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Moderated Global Warming Discussion

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Nonsense. This is what I wrote:

(note the :rolleyes:).
So it looks like you cannot understand sarcasm (or what pseudoscience or politics or sceince mean) :rolleyes:!

Sure. It's consistent with the "I'll believe anything mentality" the AGW hardliners take.

So you
  1. Are arguing from a position of ignorance of the RealClimate.com web site:
    "I don't follow these pseudoscience websites"


  1. Yep, and I know nothing of Big Foot or Homeopathy or Astrology and I know it's pseudoscience as well.

    [*]Have no idea what pseudoscience means since the RealClimate.com comments on actual climate science.

    No it doesn't, it comments on political nonsense using science to validate their leanings. That's irrefutable.
    [*]Have lied about RealClimate.com having more political than sceince articles:

    Nonsense. I never said they have "more political than science articles", if I did it was a mistake. (evidence?)



Poor reading comprehension, the fact that they have more political garbage on the front page of RealCrapClimate.com at any given time doesn't not equate to them having more political articles than science. Nice strawman.

You failed to acknowledge the fact that RealCrapClimate.com purports to be absent of political nonsense, when in fact it's rife with it. It's pure pseudoscience.
 
The Daily Caller has cracked the case! 16 international scientists claim climate change is good for life and it's all a conspiracy because scientists love money and not science. And the people who knew it all along through, um, intuition suddenly can trust in science?

http://dailycaller.com/2012/01/27/1...gument-for-drastic-actions-on-global-warming/

Courtesy of Google news,....

Some well-known names there. Lindzen, Harrison Schmitt, Nir Shaviv, Roger Cohen I recognise straight out. (Not Christy nor Spencer, surprisingly.) A not-unexpected number of engineers. And, of course, the usual garbage. See the whole thing at http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204301404577171531838421366.html. (I heard about it from a comment on http://www.realclimate.org/ ; I don't normally cruise pseudo-economics websites myself.)

This is classic :

"Although the number of publicly dissenting scientists is growing, many young scientists furtively say that while they also have serious doubts about the global-warming message, they are afraid to speak up for fear of not being promoted—or worse. "

Heard it before, not only from conservative white males into climate denial, but also from creationists. The number of "dissenting scientists" is always growin, even though they're not young. The young ones, we are told, are silently protesting - we just have to take these old guys' word for that.

They've at last identified a martyr - Chris de Freitas, which is presumably why he's not on the signatuere list.

"They have good reason to worry. In 2003, Dr. Chris de Freitas, the editor of the journal Climate Research, dared to publish a peer-reviewed article with the politically incorrect (but factually correct) conclusion that the recent warming is not unusual in the context of climate changes over the past thousand years. The international warming establishment quickly mounted a determined campaign to have Dr. de Freitas removed from his editorial job and fired from his university position. Fortunately, Dr. de Freitas was able to keep his university job. "

Of course he lost his editorial position because he was using it to get his cronies' rubbish past peer review, and they concede that he didn't lose his job as he must have feared he would. The de Freitas et cronies paper in question didn't show anything of the sort but he (and his cronies, such as McIntyre) made a great noise lying that it did. So are we likely to believe them about the downtrodden young scientists who fear to speak truth to power? I don't myself.

The deniers need to get as much out there as they can at the moment about "no warming in the last 10 years" (by which they mean up to 2008/9, believe it or not, but heck, a lot of them are still fighting the Cold War). As is well-known, a decade of little or no warming is perfectly compatible with AGW and with climate models, and the deniers were lucky enough that the 2000's was one such. The likelihood of that continuing is very small.

2010 was one of the warmest years ever and 2011 was the warmest La Nina year ever. This La Nina won't last for ever, or if it does then something peculiar is going on and would appear to be a problem in, say, Texas (deniers willingly point to La Nina to explain the drought there, but ignore it when the question turns to global temperatures). Even if the next decade sees as much La Nina conditions as the 2000's did they'll be warmer ones.

Meanwhile solar activity is cranking up and will continue to do so for a few years at least - again, unless something peculiar is going on in the Sun.

Things aren't looking good for the deniers so they're shouting louder while they can still get heard over the laughing.
 
The Daily Caller has cracked the case! 16 international scientists claim climate change is good for life and it's all a conspiracy because scientists love money and not science. And the people who knew it all along through, um, intuition suddenly can trust in science?

http://dailycaller.com/2012/01/27/1...gument-for-drastic-actions-on-global-warming/

Courtesy of Google news,....
Wrong in so many ways... :jaw-dropp

No warming for the last decade? Not according to Foster and Rahmstof 2011 as explained here, here, here, and here. That 10 of the warmest years on record have all been since 2000, last year was the warmest La Nina year...

The mis-quote of Trenbarth, who was actually referring to a lack of adequate instrumentation to track where the energy that was known to exist was actually going. It was actually going into the deep ocean.

CO2 is not a pollutant? Forgets that farmers also apply water and and nutrients to plants in greenhouses, plants are limited by the least resource. It's dealt with in detail here.

It's just a load of tripe. A shame to see Burt Rutan's name on there. I hadn't realised he'd joined the woo crowd.
 
Wrong in so many ways... :jaw-dropp

No warming for the last decade? Not according to Foster and Rahmstof 2011 as explained here, here, here, and here. That 10 of the warmest years on record have all been since 2000, last year was the warmest La Nina year...

The mis-quote of Trenbarth, who was actually referring to a lack of adequate instrumentation to track where the energy that was known to exist was actually going. It was actually going into the deep ocean.

CO2 is not a pollutant? Forgets that farmers also apply water and and nutrients to plants in greenhouses, plants are limited by the least resource. It's dealt with in detail here.

It's just a load of tripe. A shame to see Burt Rutan's name on there. I hadn't realised he'd joined the woo crowd.

It's actually no "statistical warming", which in layman terms means there was some but not enough to get alarmed about.

Both Socalledskepticalscience.com and RealCrapClimate.com are pseudoscience sites, so expect them to back track and hand wave when the alarmists predictions of climatic catastrophe don't manifest.
 
The deniers need to get as much out there as they can at the moment about "no warming in the last 10 years" (by which they mean up to 2008/9, believe it or not, but heck, a lot of them are still fighting the Cold War). As is well-known, a decade of little or no warming is perfectly compatible with AGW and with climate models, and the deniers were lucky enough that the 2000's was one such. The likelihood of that continuing is very small.

Yep, heard this in the 90's as well. If the forum is still around in 2020 I'm sure we'll be hearing this again. "Whew, we dodged a bullet there, but the next 10 years watch out..." :rolleyes:

Let the indoctrination begin.
 
Poor reading comprehension, the fact that they have more political garbage on the front page of RealCrapClimate.com at any given time doesn't not equate to them having more political articles than science. Nice strawman.

You didn't write "political garbage", you wrote "political articles" (you could have checked that in the very next quote on your message):

I've checked in the past few days and there are more political articles on the front page of RealCrapScience.com than science.

Bold mine.

But, feel free to show us some "political garbage" on the site: that could serve as material for your earlier challenge, which i'm more than eager to take as said. Still waiting.

I'll tell you what, I'll give you an example of the political agenda driven pieces at RealCrapClimate.com and then you try to find similar ones at Nature? How does that sound?
Sounds great!! Lets try that. I'm all ears.


Also waiting for your answers to my questions (8th time and counting), or a retraction of your claims:

If i ask you to tell us how the very arguments you use for claiming the linked article is pseudoscience actually apply to the article in question, i'm shifting goal posts??

Nope, i most certainly am not. So, for the sixth time:
Could you please point out what in that text, which is a commentary about a confrence, and in your own words, has nothing to do with climate science....

- makes science and idology unseparable (and/or)
- misrepresents scientific findings to promote or draw attention for publicity (and/or)
- distorts the facts of science for short-term political gain

...because i can not find anything in that article that would fit any of the above??
 
It's actually no "statistical warming", which in layman terms means there was some but not enough to get alarmed about...

"Global warming since 1995 'now significant' "
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-13719510

...By widespread convention, scientists use a minimum threshold of 95% to assess whether a trend is likely to be down to an underlying cause, rather than emerging by chance.

If a trend meets the 95% threshold, it basically means that the odds of it being down to chance are less than one in 20.

Last year's analysis, which went to 2009, did not reach this threshold; but adding data for 2010 takes it over the line.

"The trend over the period 1995-2009 was significant at the 90% level, but wasn't significant at the standard 95% level that people use," Professor Jones told BBC News.

"Basically what's changed is one more year [of data]. That period 1995-2009 was just 15 years - and because of the uncertainty in estimating trends over short periods, an extra year has made that trend significant at the 95% level which is the traditional threshold that statisticians have used for many years.

"It just shows the difficulty of achieving significance with a short time series, and that's why longer series - 20 or 30 years - would be a much better way of estimating trends and getting significance on a consistent basis."...
 
It's actually no "statistical warming", which in layman terms means there was some but not enough to get alarmed about.

Both Socalledskepticalscience.com and RealCrapClimate.com are pseudoscience sites, so expect them to back track and hand wave when the alarmists predictions of climatic catastrophe don't manifest.
Meanwhile Foster and Ramstof managed to show that the warming has continued with the same statistically significant warming when the natural factors are accounted for. There was me thinking that you only considered the scientific papers printed in the journals, silly me for actually thinking you meant that... :rolleyes:
 
Yep, heard this in the 90's as well. If the forum is still around in 2020 I'm sure we'll be hearing this again. "Whew, we dodged a bullet there, but the next 10 years watch out..." :rolleyes:

Let the indoctrination begin.

The warming since 1998 is perfectly consistent with the warming from 1970-1998, as the data clearly shows.



One can deny reality till you're blue in the face, but it will still be waiting outside the window...
 
If the warming trend was statistically significant over a period as short as 10 years it would mean that global temperatures were rising a lot faster than the models predict.
 
But, feel free to show us some "political garbage" on the site: that could serve as material for your earlier challenge, which i'm more than eager to take as said. Still waiting.

The irrefutable evidence has been cited. I don't even read the cite and I've found more than 7 articles that clearly violate their "memorandum". It's pseudoscience.

Also waiting for your answers to my questions (8th time and counting), or a retraction of your claims:

It's been cited. See below.:rolleyes:
 
Meanwhile Foster and Ramstof managed to show that the warming has continued with the same statistically significant warming when the natural factors are accounted for. There was me thinking that you only considered the scientific papers printed in the journals, silly me for actually thinking you meant that... :rolleyes:

Nonsense. More data manipulation and questionable statical methods. There's been no statistical warming in the last 10 years and the IPCC predictions have proven demonstrably false.
 
The alarmists who were scoffing at the prospects bioengineering has in reducing the effects of climate change and even climate change itself really need to check out this Horizon program on the BBC called Playing God.
 
Yep, heard this in the 90's as well.

No, you didn't.

If the forum is still around in 2020 I'm sure we'll be hearing this again. "Whew, we dodged a bullet there, but the next 10 years watch out..." :rolleyes:

Let the indoctrination begin.

What we'll most likely be talking about in 2020 is how accurate the models have turned out to be over four decades, how much more quickly AGW's visible effects have developed and how the deniers are still bleating on about "no recent significant warming". No more mention will be made of the "long-term cooling trend" we entered in 2005 - not by deniers anyway, by then they'll have us in an entirely new long-term warming trend. Some of us might bring it up.

I predict you'll be engaged in a multi-page rearguard action after saying something dumb, and insisting that words and phrases mean what you say they do and not what the rest of the English-speaking world thinks they do.

Given the age of most deniers I think we can safely predict there'll be fewer of them. With luck I'll be here to comment on how well my predictions turn out.

Regarding the science which RealClimate http://www.realclimate.org/ is suppressing by not commenting on it, have you found any examples yet? It shouldn't be hard to find. If sixteen (count them, sixteen) scientists can get an open letter printed in a Murdoch mouthpiece then some actual science is bound to get coverage.
 
Meanwhile Foster and Ramstof managed to show that the warming has continued with the same statistically significant warming when the natural factors are accounted for.

"Managed"?!? That's as bad as "adjusting"! Pseudoscience! And that should be Rahmstorf!

Having said that, they've made a considerable contribution with the paper in question, and I like the way they cut McIntyre's ground away by publishing the data and code at the same time :).

http://tamino.wordpress.com/2011/12/06/the-real-global-warming-signal/
http://tamino.wordpress.com/2011/12/15/data-and-code-for-foster-rahmstorf-2011/
 
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