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Merged General Holocaust denial discussion thread

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little grey rabbit said:
I thought there was a gas chamber at Dachau?

Do you have a list of these 69 SS men and their statements?

TBH, if you consider that at least 6000 SS served at Auschwitz, it strikes me that 69 testimonies is not such a large number.
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This objection is entirely beside the point since Wroclaw attempted to get discussion of the SS testimonies to ground the thread a bit, as Clayton Moore is in thrall with a sample of one, Elie Wiesel. As I understand Wroclaw's posts on the matter, starting at #2183, he is attempting to shift discussion of the gas chambers from one individual, Wiesel, who did not witness the gas chambers, to 69 individuals who testified to what they witnessed concerning the Birkenau gas chambers. He has asked a number of times whether these 69 AB witnesses were also liars.

In this light, your point strikes me as a very poor attempt to obfuscate.

Put another way, a sample of 69 eyewitnesses to the gas chambers out of however many SS witnessed their operation is far more useful than Clayton Moore's sample of 1 non-witness out of however many people came to Auschwitz as victims.

Basically, as you have to realize, the Wiesel gambit is crap.
 
LemmyCaution said:
This objection is entirely beside the point since Wroclaw attempted to get discussion of the SS testimonies to ground the thread a bit, as Clayton Moore is in thrall with a sample of one, Elie Wiesel. As I understand Wroclaw's posts on the matter, starting at #2183, he is attempting to shift discussion of the gas chambers from one individual, Wiesel, who did not witness the gas chambers, to 69 individuals who testified to what they witnessed concerning the Birkenau gas chambers. He has asked a number of times whether these 69 AB witnesses were also liars.

In this light, your point strikes me as a very poor attempt to obfuscate.

Put another way, a sample of 69 eyewitnesses to the gas chambers out of however many SS witnessed their operation is far more useful than Clayton Moore's sample of 1 non-witness out of however many people came to Auschwitz as victims.

Basically, as you have to realize, the Wiesel gambit is crap.
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Well its difficult to discuss the 69 SS eyewitnesses if we don't know who they are or what they said.

However, I can understand your need to change the subject. *Boom* left hook ... how was it possible to transport all those Jews and just while you are still reeling *Bam* right hook - show me an experiment using rats that shows Zyklon B is lethal.

You are staggering around in circles and it shows. Pony up the 69 SS witnesses.
 
little grey rabbit said:
Well its difficult to discuss the 69 SS eyewitnesses if we don't know who they are or what they said.

However, I can understand your need to change the subject. *Boom* left hook ... how was it possible to transport all those Jews and just while you are still reeling *Bam* right hook - show me an experiment using rats that shows Zyklon B is lethal.

You are staggering around in circles and it shows. Pony up the 69 SS witnesses.
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I am not sure what you are talking about with subject changes and the left and the right hooks. Unless you are trying to be funny. Or cryptic. I actually thought we were bouncing all over the place in this sad attempt at a thread. And have been a willing bouncer.

On the SS witnesses, I was merely trying to clarify what I had read in this thread in the face of your distorting it. Which my post made clear. FWIW I haven't read the 69 testimonies but am anxiously awaiting Clayton Moore having something to say on the topic so that we can get into it.
 
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TSR said:
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Good behaviour while in prison.


And before you sneer, look up Jesse Ray Mathews or Michael Griffin.
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Postwar leniency in the hands of a denier becomes proof of establishment villainy and the perpetuation of a hoax. LOL.
 
LemmyCaution said:
On the SS witnesses, I was merely trying to clarify what I had read in this thread in the face of your distorting it. Which my post made clear. FWIW I haven't read the 69 testimonies but am anxiously awaiting Clayton Moore having something to say on the topic so that we can get into it.
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Why wait for Mr Moore? We all want to have a say on these dastardedly 69. But who are they and what did they say?
 
TSR said:
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Good behaviour while in prison.


And before you sneer, look up Jesse Ray Mathews or Michael Griffin.
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http://timesfreepress.com/news/2011/may/22/bound-blood/
Jesse Ray Mathews had served a little more than seven years of a 20-year prison sentence for armed robbery when his request to be released was denied early last year.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_F._Griffin

On March 10, 1993, Michael Frederick Griffin murdered Dr. David Gunn in Pensacola, Florida in the United States. This was the first documented assassination of an OB-GYN, to prevent a doctor from performing abortions.[1]
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A jury deliberated three hours before finding him guilty on March 4, 1994. He was sentenced to life in prison. He is currently serving in Okaloosa Correctional Institution in Crestview, Florida.
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I don't see any connection to Dr Johann Paul Kremer.
 
Clayton Moore said:
How many of you are there? Are any of you sensual women?
Let me speak with Thunder. Can you bring him back?


At least ask Thunder how Dr Johann Paul Kremer managed to only serve 10 years.
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I'm sorry, were you high or drunk when you wrote the above? Because it makes no sense.

By the way, are you still incredulous over the capacity of a large, industrialized nation-state to do many things at one?
 
Clayton Moore said:
http://timesfreepress.com/news/2011/may/22/bound-blood/
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... and was released based on "good behaviour" despite 4 disciplinary violations, right before he killed that cop.
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Clayton Moore said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_F._Griffin
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Wrong con. http://www.idsnews.com/news/story.aspx?id=81624 -- he may only serve 25 years of his sentence, maybe less.
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Clayton Moore said:
I don't see any connection to Dr Johann Paul Kremer.
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The connection is that "good behaviour" releases ignore (in most jurisdictions) the original crime, and are based solely on the prisoners' conduct behind bars.

Which is a far more likely explanation than yours.
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TSR said:
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... and was released based on "good behaviour" despite 4 disciplinary violations, right before he killed that cop.
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Wrong con. http://www.idsnews.com/news/story.aspx?id=81624 -- he may only serve 25 years of his sentence, maybe less.
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The connection is that "good behaviour" releases ignore (in most jurisdictions) the original crime, and are based solely on the prisoners' conduct behind bars.

Which is a far more likely explanation than yours.
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My view is that in 1947ish if you were sentenced to death and the sentence was commuted there was a damn good reason for it. If the "facts" of the

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/biography/kremer.html

The prosecution was unable to calculate the exact number of victims for whose death he was responsible, but, in one diary entry Kremer had noted that 1,600 people had been murdered in one day. The prosecutors estimated that given Kremer's involvement in the gassings, he was likely to have been involved in the deaths of several thousand prisoners.
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were true or even 1/2 or 10% true I don't see him deserving/getting an early release. Especially in the early post war years.

Him, Kremer, serving only 10 or so years would mean
the jewishvirtuallibrary.org is publishing lies.
 
Jesus H. Christ, CM: The Churchill/Eisenhower/De Gaulle gambit is the one you came here with. You're hopeless...
 
Proof that much said about camp killings are lies.

http://www.whale.to/b/dachau_p.html


DachauBabies1.jpg

Mothers with their babies at Dachau, May 1945
 
Clayton Moore said:
Proof that much said about camp killings are lies.

http://www.whale.to/b/dachau_p.html


[qimg]http://www.whale.to/b/DachauBabies1.jpg[/qimg]
Mothers with their babies at Dachau, May 1945
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Who says? Oh dear,why are you making such a dick of yourself here? Are you trolling or are you really this stupid. I know that nazis are not the sharpest knives in the box,but this is a new low. Dachau looked like this.

 
So much for the killing old people LIE

Pages From The Auschwitz Death Registry Volumes
Long-Hidden Death Certificates Discredit Extermination Claims


These 46 volumes partially cover the years 1941, 1942 and 1943. There are just two or three volumes for the year 1941, and none at all for the years 1944 or 1945. [2] It is not clear why so many volumes are still missing. According to informed International Red Cross officials, the most likely explanation is that they were misplaced by the Soviets, and might therefore turn up later. (There is no indication that Auschwitz camp authorities made any effort to destroy any of the volumes.) [3.]
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Josephine Kohn, a Jewish inmate born in Hungary who had been living in Leipzig, was 69 years old when she died on February 10, 1943. Auschwitz camp physician Dr. Kitt reported "weakness of old age" as the cause of death.

Emil Kaufmann, a Jewish attorney deported from Germany, was 78 years old when he died of "old age" on February 15, 1943. "Weakness of old age" is given as the cause of death.

Julius Sonnenberg, a salesman from Germany, was 65 when he died on February 27, 1943, of "angina pectoris." His religion is cited as "non-believing, formerly Jewish."

Abraham Blok, a Jewish butcher from the Netherlands, was 70 years old when he died of "old age" on March 6, 1943.

Franz Waitz, a Catholic laborer, was 67 years old when he succumbed to typhus on June 21, 1943. His death was certified by Dr. Josef Mengele, the Auschwitz camp physician who was sensationally stigmatized after the war as the "angel of death."
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http://www.whale.to/b/weber78.html
 
Clayton Moore said:
Pages From The Auschwitz Death Registry Volumes
Long-Hidden Death Certificates Discredit Extermination Claims
http://www.whale.to/b/weber78.html
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Your source is antisemitic pseudo-scholarly claptrap, some dumbed down neo-NAZIs. Do you check the failed sources before using them? Did you realize your source antisemitic?

Why are you acting like a pseudo-academic denying that the Holocaust happened?
 
Clayton Moore said:
My view is that in 1947ish if you were sentenced to death and the sentence was commuted there was a damn good reason for it.
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There was: good behaviour. No one here cares about "your view," uninformaed as it has shown to be by anything with more than a passing resemblance to reality.

Got any of that, you know, *evidence* stuff to present?
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Clayton Moore said:
If the "facts" of the

http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/biography/kremer.html

were true or even 1/2 or 10% true I don't see him deserving/getting an early release. Especially in the early post war years.
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Which *specific* facts indicate bad behaviour behind bars, which you have been shown is what is generally taken into consideration when determining early release?

What specific *facts* do you offer in support of your credulity about there being any other reason considered?
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