General Holocaust denial discussion Part III

[Jeffk 1970]

The book The First Holocaust, Jewish Fund Raising Campaigns with Holocaust Claims During and After World War One by Don Heddeshemimer is documented with reprints of articles from the New York Times and other Jewish press that claimed that there The First Holocaustwas a holocaust of the Jews during World War One. For example, see the article by Martin Glynn, the former Mayor of New York, describing a holocaust of six million Jews published in 1919 at http://codoh.com/library/document/871 Heddesheimer missed the systematic and murderous extermination of six million Jews in 1906, as reported in the New York Times, see http://exposing-the-holocaust-hoax-

Saggy, what was going on in Russia in 1919? Bonus question, what was going on in Russia in 1906?

 

[Jeffk 1970]

Vids
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acPfPG457cw Begins 'The holocaust is a preposterous hoax based on literally millions of lies, but it all rests on one big lie

Hey, Saggy. You don't know me but I saw some of your "work" at Skeptics.

In any case, the video is deceiving. The fact is that half of all Jewish deaths happened outside of "death camps" and only about 1/6 of the Jewish deaths occurred at Auschwitz-Birkenau. The deaths that occurred in the actual death camps add up to anywhere from 2.5-3 million, about 1.4 million died at the hands of the Einsatzgruppen, Order Police, SS Cavalry or their proxies with the rest dying as a result of malnourishment, disease, maltreatment, etc.

 

[Jeffk 1970]

Saggy's link: My, what a cornucopia of denier memes!!!

The Documents

The Nazis kept meticulous records in the camps, including death certificates for every prisoner that died, and 'Death Books' summarizing the deaths. The Soviets captured the Auschwitz records but hid them for 45 years. A stone plaque was placed at Auschwitz stone plaque 4 millionthe Auschwitz entrance stating that 4 million had died there.

Does anyone see "Jews" listed anywhere on the plaque? Just askin'.
Also, the Soviets failed to mention Jews at all in relation to Auschwitz at the IMT.

In the early 90's the Russians released the documents. Samples, and a summary analysis, can be seen here http://www.holohoax101.org/auschwitzmuseum/. The data shows that more Roman Catholics died

LOL
The records are hardly complete...and don't list those that went straight to the gas chamber. Those Jews were never registered.
This is fun, we don't get this stuff at Skeptics anymore.

Auschwitz stone plaque 1.5 millionat Auschwitz than Jews. The old stone plaque stating that four million had died was replaced by the plaque shown to the left claiming that one and a half million had died. The new number was not documented; based on the documents the figure should be on the order of (some months are missing) one hundred thousand.

Remarkably, (or not), the six million total for Jewish victims of the holocaust was not affected.

Again, the plaque never said Jews. The Soviets exaggerated the number of dead but never specifically linked Jews with that number. Other scholars like Hilberg and Reitlinger questioned that number.

OK, I'm done for a bit. I'll let others take a whack.

 

[Saggy]

The Anne Frank Hoax ?

According to the standard narrative Anne Frank arrived in Belsen in late 1944 and died there of tyhpus in 1945 a few weeks before the camp was liberated by the British. But, that has changed a bit recently from one made up date to another ...
http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/01/europe/anne-frank-date-of-death/
So, we can correctly infer that there is no actual evidence that she died at Belsen at all.

And there is evidence that she did not die at Belsen. When the British liberated the camp the cameras were rolling and they made a documentary from the footage. Not surprisingly the documentary was shelved for 50 years but it can now be seen here ...
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/memory-of-the-camps/

The reason the documentary was shelved is that they wanted to use some of the footage as evidence of the holohoax, but the vid was taken after the war and showed prisoners that had died of tyhpus as the vid documents, not gassed Jews, so they presented the footage in newsreels as being Jews gassed by the Nazis, and hid the documentary.

This is a screenshot from the documentary ...

https://www.scrapbookpages.com/BergenBelsen/OldPhotos/BelsenChildren.jpg

The girl on the front row 2nd from the left looks like Anne Frank, shown here
http://s3.amazonaws.com/bncore/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/436477.jpg

There is a little more to the story - At Belsen, the camp where Anne Frank ended up, there was a special barracks for Jewish children that was overseen by luba Tryszynska, a Polish Jewess who took it upon herself to see to the well being of the Jewish children in the camp after losing her own child. She appears in the back row of the photo above. She was assisted and the barracks was known as the Kinderbarracks. It housed up to 100 children, with around fifty being Jewish Dutch children from Amsterdam. After the war Luba, the Jewish children under her care at Belsen were transported to Amsterdam, the children became known as the 'Diamond children' as their parents were largely in the diamond trade. And article by one of the non-Dutch children in the Kinderbarac indicates that the Luba for unknown reasons, took special attention to the care of the Dutch children.

A book was written about Luba, 'Angel of Belsen', and it lists all the diamond children, so, if the girl in the photo is not Anne Frank it is very likely she is one of the children listed in the book. The diamond children have remained in touch and in 1995 they had a reunion in LA with Luba.

So, if the girl in the photo is not Anne Frank it should be easy to determine who she is. I emailed the Anne Frank center in Amsterdam, and they replied that they knew nothing of the Belsen photo and could not identify the girl. Also, to my knowledge, none of the diamond children have commented on Anne Frank at all.

 

[Saggy]

Hey, Saggy. You don't know me but I saw some of your "work" at Skeptics.

In any case, the video is deceiving. The fact is that half of all Jewish deaths happened outside of "death camps" and only about 1/6 of the Jewish deaths occurred at Auschwitz-Birkenau. The deaths that occurred in the actual death camps add up to anywhere from 2.5-3 million, about 1.4 million died at the hands of the Einsatzgruppen, Order Police, SS Cavalry or their proxies with the rest dying as a result of malnourishment, disease, maltreatment, etc.

The video documents in complete detail that the photos and film footage of holohoax victims shown to the world over for the last 70 years was taken after the war by British and American troops, and shows prisoners that had died due to typhus epidemics in several camps in the last weeks of the war, mostly at Belsen. This is the big lie that the holohoax is based on. The vid also documents that the Nazis did everything in their power to combat the epidemic at Belsen by showing translated copies of correspondence from the camp commandant.

The Nordhausen vid shows that the camp was bombed in the last week of the war. It includes an interview with a Jewish doctor who survived the bombing. There are no photos of gassing victims because there were no gas chambers, it was all a 100% preposterous hoax without a shred of evidence, besides the endless lies, of course.

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Holy moly, and Ms Frank has never come forward to say she was alive, tried to reconnect with her surviving relatives?

Could you have any bigger plot holes in the story?

 

[Saggy]

Holy moly, and Ms Frank has never come forward to say she was alive, tried to reconnect with her surviving relatives?

Could you have any bigger plot holes in the story?

We have a photo of a girl that looks, to me, exactly like Anne Frank, at the Belsen fence in the company of a woman who cared for Jewish children at Belsen, there's a link for this ...

Memories of a Coal Child
http://faculty.ce.berkeley.edu/coby/essays/coalchild.htm

by Coby Lubliner, Jewish kid at Belsen but not a 'diamond child' from Amsterdam

So, I take that as prima facie evidence that she survived. If it's not Anne Frank, I think we are owed an explanation, that is, who is the girl in the photo. Instead we get complete silence from the Anne Frank Center and Luba T. and the diamond children.

 

[lionking]

I gave up after reading the word "jewess". I don't thing this is used by any other than anti-Semites.

 

[marplots]

I gave up after reading the word "jewess". I don't thing this is used by any other than anti-Semites.

It means a female who is Jewish. Usage is very similar to "negress."

Oh.

 

[Jeffk 1970]

The video documents in complete detail that the photos and film footage of holohoax victims shown to the world over for the last 70 years was taken after the war by British and American troops, and shows prisoners that had died due to typhus epidemics in several camps in the last weeks of the war, mostly at Belsen. This is the big lie that the holohoax is based on. The vid also documents that the Nazis did everything in their power to combat the epidemic at Belsen by showing translated copies of correspondence from the camp commandant.

Um, no.

The videos themselves show what happened after the SS persisted in stuffing the camps full of sick and dying people, long after there was any point in doing so.

The destruction of Europe's Jews is based upon documents collected, witnesses, perpetrators and survivors interviewed, site investigations and the various trials that happened after the war. Like any historical event it has gone through revision, not the "revision" that deniers pimp out to the gullible but actual revision by historians, researchers and investigators.

The Nordhausen vid shows that the camp was bombed in the last week of the war. It includes an interview with a Jewish doctor who survived the bombing. There are no photos of gassing victims because there were no gas chambers, it was all a 100% preposterous hoax without a shred of evidence, besides the endless lies, of course.

So, all this from one camp? Wow, where do you get your history from? YouTube?

 

[Meadmaker]

I wonder why Belsen needed an "angel". I wonder what made this angel different from the other staff at Belsen.

Saggy seems to think that descriptions of this "angel" are pretty reliable so I would think the would take that same author's description of activity at the rest of the camp as fairly reliable. So how about it, Saggy? This angel stood out because she was different from the others. In what way was she different?

 

[Nay_Sayer]

Shawn Klush looks, sounds and sings like Elvis. Ergo Elvis is alive.

Hail to the king.

 

[Ivanesca]

Saggy, what was going on in Russia in 1919? Bonus question, what was going on in Russia in 1906?

As Mentioned upthread, Even Germar Rudolf has disowned this tired old rubbish.

[Heddesheimer's book] deals with Jewish fundraising campaigns during and after the FIRST World War, and therefore if only for chronological reason does not deal with the Jewish Holocaust of the SECOND World War.

"Rubbish" is the appropriate term to describe Saggy's "contribution"

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

We have a photo of a girl that looks, to me, exactly like Anne Frank, ... So, I take that as prima facie evidence that she survived. If it's not Anne Frank, I think we are owed an explanation, that is, who is the girl in the photo. Instead we get complete silence from the Anne Frank Center and Luba T. and the diamond children.

You aren't owed anything. That alone is absurd.

But as for people looking like other people, that is common as hell. Definitely not conclusive evidence of anything. That girl in the photo looks very much like my ex-boyfriend's sister.

 

[Ivanesca]

Edited by zooterkin: 

<SNIP> Edited for rule 12

Countless times, he's spread the lie that the Majdanek Gas chamber would not have worked because of a "window". I.e. here

https://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=143258&hilit=saggy+majdanek+window

The link is from the Holocaust Historiography website. The photo is also published on the USHMM site, but they appear to move the links around on that site rendering old links pointing to the wrong pics, so I'm using the HH site photo.

http://www.holohoax101.org/Majdanek.jpg

Note the unbarred window in the upper left corner.

Do you believe the Nazis designed and built a homicidal gas chamber with a glass window?

Our Friend Denying history has exposed this lie. What Saggy

Edited by zooterkin: 

<SNIP> Edited for rule 12

call a "window" is in fact a light fixture.

https://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=143258&hilit=saggy+majdanek+window&start=15

[IMGw=640]http://i.imgur.com/MNHkP9G.jpg[/IMGw]

And this is the same as the Photo that Saggy (And other liars) spammed. The light fixture is turned off, however. Thus, no "window".

https://rachelonyearcourse.files.wordpress.com/2013/03/dsc_0001.jpg

Edited by zooterkin: 

<SNIP> Edited for rule 12

Truthist was a liar
Germar Rudolf is a liar
Eric Hunt was a Liar, and admitted that Deniers lie to spread nonsense.

They're all liars.

Do not alter other member's names for purpose of insult, please be civil and address the argument, not the arguer.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: zooterkin

 

[lionking]

It means a female who is Jewish. Usage is very similar to "negress."

Oh.

Yes indeed.

 

[Cosmic Yak]

Instead we get complete silence from the Anne Frank Center

So, if the girl in the photo is not Anne Frank it should be easy to determine who she is. I emailed the Anne Frank center in Amsterdam, and they replied that they knew nothing of the Belsen photo and could not identify the girl.

Just leaving that here.

 

[Cosmic Yak]

According to the standard narrative Anne Frank arrived in Belsen in late 1944 and died there of tyhpus in 1945 a few weeks before the camp was liberated by the British. But, that has changed a bit recently from one made up date to another ...
http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/01/europe/anne-frank-date-of-death/
So, we can correctly infer that there is no actual evidence that she died at Belsen at all.

Yet your link states quite categorically that she did die.
Can you provide evidence that the research used to fix this latest date is wrong?
Can you explain how, according to your link, Anne Frank looked like a skeleton in her last few weeks, and therefore nothing like the girl in your picture?
Can you walk us through the logic whereby you go from a corrected date of death to no death at all?
Finally, if Anne Frank had not been Jewish, and had not been imprisoned by the Nazis, would you still be posting allegations of fraud? Have you investigated anything similar in other countries such as China or Russia, that do not involve Jews?

 

[Porpoise of Life]

Completely unthinkable that two children in a concentration camp for people of one particular ethnic heritage look slightly similar!
This devious 13 year old must have cut off all ties with her family, assumed a false name and disappeared from the face of the Earth, just so her father could use her diary to slander those nice nazis a tiny bit more than he could have done if his family had not been killed but only deported, imprisoned and starved.
It's clear who the real victims are here...

 

[Jeffk 1970]

According to the standard narrative Anne Frank arrived in Belsen in late 1944 and died there of tyhpus in 1945 a few weeks before the camp was liberated by the British. But, that has changed a bit recently from one made up date to another ...
http://www.cnn.com/2015/04/01/europe/anne-frank-date-of-death/
So, we can correctly infer that there is no actual evidence that she died at Belsen at all.

And there is evidence that she did not die at Belsen. When the British liberated the camp the cameras were rolling and they made a documentary from the footage. Not surprisingly the documentary was shelved for 50 years but it can now be seen here ...
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/film/memory-of-the-camps/

The reason the documentary was shelved is that they wanted to use some of the footage as evidence of the holohoax, but the vid was taken after the war and showed prisoners that had died of tyhpus as the vid documents, not gassed Jews, so they presented the footage in newsreels as being Jews gassed by the Nazis, and hid the documentary.

This is a screenshot from the documentary ...

https://www.scrapbookpages.com/BergenBelsen/OldPhotos/BelsenChildren.jpg

The girl on the front row 2nd from the left looks like Anne Frank, shown here
http://s3.amazonaws.com/bncore/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/436477.jpg

There is a little more to the story - At Belsen, the camp where Anne Frank ended up, there was a special barracks for Jewish children that was overseen by luba Tryszynska, a Polish Jewess who took it upon herself to see to the well being of the Jewish children in the camp after losing her own child. She appears in the back row of the photo above. She was assisted and the barracks was known as the Kinderbarracks. It housed up to 100 children, with around fifty being Jewish Dutch children from Amsterdam. After the war Luba, the Jewish children under her care at Belsen were transported to Amsterdam, the children became known as the 'Diamond children' as their parents were largely in the diamond trade. And article by one of the non-Dutch children in the Kinderbarac indicates that the Luba for unknown reasons, took special attention to the care of the Dutch children.

A book was written about Luba, 'Angel of Belsen', and it lists all the diamond children, so, if the girl in the photo is not Anne Frank it is very likely she is one of the children listed in the book. The diamond children have remained in touch and in 1995 they had a reunion in LA with Luba.

So, if the girl in the photo is not Anne Frank it should be easy to determine who she is. I emailed the Anne Frank center in Amsterdam, and they replied that they knew nothing of the Belsen photo and could not identify the girl. Also, to my knowledge, none of the diamond children have commented on Anne Frank at all.

And?
Look, even if Anne Frank survived and her diary is a hoax (which is completely ridiculous), what difference does it make?
History is not built on diaries of kids.