General 9/11 Conspiracy Discussion

ralfyman said:
In any crime, authorities gather, store, and examine physical evidence. This is especially so in one that involves airplane crashes and buildings collapsing. As clearly seen in the earlier points you raised above, the steel debris has to be examined carefully. That didn't happen: most of it was sold off as scrap for no valid reason.
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Refer to the explanation of probable cause. In this context, probable cause applies to the crime of hijacking aircraft and deliberately crashing them into the towers. The collapses were the result of the crime (deliberate act), and the resulting collapses were the result of their actions.

The purpose of subsequent engineering reports was to determine if their designs were in any manner faulty with respect to life safety and building codes.

Samples of the materials that were retained were those believed to provide the most relevant information in determining the sequence of failures leading to the collapse of the buildings, not because the collapses themselves were criminal, except where perhaps design failures could be blamed on criminal negligence... that being besides the point... That's the largest disconnect held in this belief that not enough evidence of a crime was retained.

EDIT: Shortened it to the bare bones answer.
 
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ralfyman said:
Exactly, and the valid reason will come from proper storage and examination of physical evidence.
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It was stored and examined.

ralfyman said:
But most of the evidence was sold off as scrap for no valid reason.
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It should have been kept for what now? What on earth else would one do with heaps of scrap metal? Keep it forever? At great expense for no good reason?
 
abaddon said:
It was stored and examined.


It should have been kept for what now? What on earth else would one do with heaps of scrap metal? Keep it forever? At great expense for no good reason?
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If I'm correct, the first piece of steel left for China around Jan/Feb of '02. Most CTers think it left directly from GZ.
 
cantonear1968 said:
If I'm correct, the first piece of steel left for China around Jan/Feb of '02.
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Which is odd in itself. One would expect that irrelevant honking great waste metal would be disposed of quite quickly. But no. CTs think the US should have held onto all of it in perpetuity because reasons.

cantonear1968 said:
Most CTers think it left directly from GZ.
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Most CTers think that the planes had nothing to do with it. Go figure.
 
abaddon said:
Which is odd in itself. One would expect that irrelevant honking great waste metal would be disposed of quite quickly. But no. CTs think the US should have held onto all of it in perpetuity because reasons.
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Reasons? Giuliani. Because.....reasons.

Most CTers think that the planes had nothing to do with it. Go figure.
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And some think there weren't any planes at all. But they cannot be reasoned with.
 
cantonear1968 said:
On this.....they seem ro think hurricane Erin participated in the power needed to power the.....weapon?

How?


Discuss.
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Hurricane Erin? Well they seem to think that was guided and controlled by HAARP. Because it seems that nothing is good enough but that the US is hell bent on self destruction. The HAARP induce hurricanes are simply a means of forcing the seeple into the FEMA death camps for extermination when "Marshall" law is declared last century. Once "marshall" law is declared and the evil (insert bugbear of choice) are eliminated, the remaining reptilians will rule over <something> which will be themselves and insufficient to sustain themselves. Meanwhile, the GMO conspiracy will have come to fruition by dint of the chemtrails and there will be no people left to raise them. Oh, and this will only happen in murka, because nothing else exists.

The illuminutty just want to kill everyone, because...because...

Well, they are evil, I guess.It seems to matter not a whit that they would be killing themselves at the same time.

Figure that lunacy out. I can't.
 
abaddon said:
Hurricane Erin? Well they seem to think that was guided and controlled by HAARP. Because it seems that nothing is good enough but that the US is hell bent on self destruction. The HAARP induce hurricanes are simply a means of forcing the seeple into the FEMA death camps for extermination when "Marshall" law is declared last century. Once "marshall" law is declared and the evil (insert bugbear of choice) are eliminated, the remaining reptilians will rule over <something> which will be themselves and insufficient to sustain themselves. Meanwhile, the GMO conspiracy will have come to fruition by dint of the chemtrails and there will be no people left to raise them. Oh, and this will only happen in murka, because nothing else exists.
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Whenever I used to see people satirically posting this sort of thing I used to think it was exaggerated for comic effect, but recently I watched my first David Icke lecture (all nine hours of it!) and it really, really isn't, is it? :eek:
 
Georgio said:
Whenever I used to see people satirically posting this sort of thing I used to think it was exaggerated for comic effect, but recently I watched my first David Icke lecture (all nine hours of it!) and it really, really isn't, is it? :eek:
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Ah. The turquoise shell suited guru, because that is what jebus used to wear. For some reason (he claims), turquoise colour interferes with the reptilians senses. Because "turquoise". No, I don't get it either.
 
abaddon said:
Ah. The turquoise shell suited guru, because that is what jebus used to wear. For some reason (he claims), turquoise colour interferes with the reptilians senses. Because "turquoise". No, I don't get it either.
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He was in a green shirt in the one I saw. Reptiles are green. Coincidence? :D
 
Since when is following standard fire investigation protocol a conspiracy theory?
 
MicahJava said:
Since when is following standard fire investigation protocol a conspiracy theory?
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I think ignoring the numerous times you have been schooled over this error, plus ignoring all the other evidence showing the culpability of Al Qaeda, whilst simultaneously refusing to advance a theory of your own, is proof of your adherence to conspiracy theories. They only survive as a result of actions like this.
 
MicahJava said:
Since when is following standard fire investigation protocol a conspiracy theory?
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What is "standard fire investigation protocol" in your opinion?

It seems to me that this is something gleaned from TV, like the bovine notion that all crashed aircraft are painstakingly reconstructed fragment by fragment in every case. (they're not. it's rare for that to occur. But TV makes people believe that they are.)
 
ralfyman said:
The only way to show whether or not a CD was involved is to examine the physical evidence.
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Sorry, why are you even talking about CD? There is no reason to suppose that any demolition devices were installed in any of the buildings that collapsed on 9/11, no records of any such devices being installed, no observations of loud reports or flashes that on more than the most superficial and biased examination appear consistent with such devices being the cause of any of the collapses, nor any physical evidence of any such devices in the debris, which was examined in extremely fine detail. The only reason to even suggest CD as a possible cause of collapse is that you're a closet truther who doesn't want to admit to being one because you know the truth movement has no credibility, and is therefore trying to discredit the various investigations just to spin out a pointless argument. Nobody outside of the truth movement takes the idea of CD seriously as a possible cause of the collapses on 9/11 because of the complete lack of any evidence for it including evidence which could not have escaped observation, and for that reason sensible people consider it already shown that no CD was involved. Only truthers JAQing off think any differently.

Dave
 
MicahJava said:
Since when is following standard fire investigation protocol a conspiracy theory?
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I don't think anybody's actually accusing you of suggesting a conspiracy theory, for the simple reason that you haven't actually suggested anything yet, or indeed made any intelligent statement (as opposed to JAQing off) on this subject. However, since you seem (so far as it's possible from the information vacuum you're offering) to feel that a new investigation of 9/11 is necessary, would you like to start by telling us what form this investigation should take, who should carry it out, what powers they should be granted, and from what authority and under what legal framework these powers should be derived?

Dave
 
abaddon said:
What is "standard fire investigation protocol" in your opinion?

It seems to me that this is something gleaned from TV, like the bovine notion that all crashed aircraft are painstakingly reconstructed fragment by fragment in every case. (they're not. it's rare for that to occur. But TV makes people believe that they are.)
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I think TV also makes people think that when an object (lets say, oh, an airplane) travels at fast speeds and impacts something hard (like reinforced concrete on the Pentagon, just off the top of my head) it's supposed to cut out a hole the exact size and shape of a plane, just like Wile E Coyote does.
 
heymatto70 said:
I think TV also makes people think that when an object (lets say, oh, an airplane) travels at fast speeds and impacts something hard (like reinforced concrete on the Pentagon, just off the top of my head) it's supposed to cut out a hole the exact size and shape of a plane, just like Wile E Coyote does.
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Ah, yes. The Warner theory of physics.

This is exactly how no-planers and the likes of Judy Wood gained currency in the CT world. Unable to deal with actual evidence, the tall tale must get taller until you end up with CGI planes, nukes, embedded det-charges from the 70's, and space weapons.

One assumes that any moment now MicahJava will be demanding that we prove that crazy satellites touting vast laser beams don't exist. Or 1970s fusion bombs embedded in the foundations of WTC 1 and 2. Or any of the other nonsense.

Surely it makes sense to spend a gazillion dollars investigating such things, right?

MJ sure thinks so.
 
ralfyman said:
Yes, but an investigation of that will still require proper storage and examination of physical evidence. That did not take place.
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It is known that the steel was inspected. Identified critical pieces were stored. A simple search provides that information.

Your point storage and examination of physical evidence has been discussed and has no real validity.
 
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