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Free Britney!

Warp12 said:
Completely wrong. She has a history of mental illness, addiction and perhaps even self-harm. What is really happening here, is that when she becomes "free", her supporters really won't care about the ultimate results of their "movement". Of course, they will accept no responsibility if something horrible happens; in fact, they will surely blame the family.

Let's just see what happens. Hopefully it all works out well for her. :thumbsup:
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You can't hear can you? Most have already told you who we'll blame: Her. And, of course, we won't accept responsibility. It's her responsibility.
 
RecoveringYuppy said:
You can't hear can you? Most have already told you who we'll blame: Her. And, of course, we won't accept responsibility. It's her responsibility.
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You are reinforcing my point. "We didn't kill her, we just handed her the gun. She shot herself. Yay, Free Britney!"

Comical.
 
Warp12 said:
You are reinforcing my point. "We didn't kill her, we just handed her the gun. She shot herself. Yay, Free Britney!"

Comical.
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Nothing comical here. What's tragic is that an adult woman can be reduced to a state of legal infancy under false pretenses, can be forced to work against her will to earn money for her conservators, and then has to go to court to try to prove that she doesn't deserve it. There is overwhelming evidence that, whatever her problems were and are, a permanent conservatorship should never have been imposed.
 
Checkmite said:
Warp12 said:
You are reinforcing my point. "We didn't kill her, we just handed her the gun. She shot herself. Yay, Free Britney!"

Comical.
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"The gun" here literally meaning "the agency accorded to adults in our society".
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Warp12, Britney Spears—like other capacitated adults—is allowed to make good, bad, or indifferent decisions, whether we like it or not.
 
Friday, November 12, 2021 hearing:

Judge said anyone posting updates from the courtroom to social media will result in entire courtroom being cleared out.

Apparently, people who got a seat to observe in the courtroom can't leave or they risk losing their seat.

The public, should have audio/video access to this public proceeding. Court appears to want to keep that from being public.

Paraphrasing California attorney Christopher Melcher who's attending #FreeBritney rally outside the Mosk Courthouse and reporting for YouTube channel Popcorned Planet, livestream today:
There should be a livestream camera in the court room.​
But there isn't.

Attorney Melcher said it might not be constitutional to close the courtroom because it doesn't interfere with the hearing. This is a public proceeding in a public setting.
 
Conservatorship over person and estate has been terminated.

Britney's Free!!! (There are a couple conditions)

Britney has right to sue.
 
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Ernie M said:
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Attorney Melcher said it might not be constitutional to close the courtroom because it doesn't interfere with the hearing. This is a public proceeding in a public setting.
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Well, if it's open to members of the public to walk in, then it's public. Very few legal proceedings are livestreamed.
 
Bob001 said:
Ernie M said:
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Attorney Melcher said it might not be constitutional to close the courtroom because it doesn't interfere with the hearing. This is a public proceeding in a public setting.
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Well, if it's open to members of the public to walk in, then it's public. Very few legal proceedings are livestreamed.
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Popcorned Planet livestream (Fri., 12 Nov 2021), attorney Christopher Melcher mentioned today's proceeding should be live-streamed. Reasons being, you can get the demeanor of persons, versus really can't get demeanor from a transcript; there's a difference between the written word (transcript) and spoken word. The info is public, so what's the difference if you livestream versus get a transcript...the information is in the public interest. The courts are (supposed to be) for the people.

Also, transcripts can take about three weeks, and cost $300.

Attorney Melcher is fighting to restore audio access.

I get the sense the court wants to block public audio access to the Britney Spears proceedings. Judge Brenda Penny took away access after audio recording was leaked. In essence, the public was blamed for the leak, although apparently no investigation into the leaked audio was undertaken. The audio could have been leaked from one of eleven attorneys on a different link the court system. If so, it could have been an underhanded—and potentially coordinated move—to get the public audio link removed. There were different links to the court system; one for the public, another for participants & attorneys.

The abusive/exploitative/fraudulent conservatorship Britney Spears was ensnared in is BIG news. Crooked, sadistic, and corrupt conservatorship machine doesn't want to be exposed. "Entire" means all abusive power of attorney authorizations, conservatorships and guardianships.

This amount of public attention seen in Britney's conservatorship hasn't been seen before. This is rare. Activism from the #FreeBritney movement helped stop this illegal conservatorship, and saved Britney's life.

It's a perversion of the rule of law. It violates constitutional rights, civil liberties.

Typically, sadistic abusers and broken guardianship systems isolate, manipulate, control, in essence torture, loot, and kill the vulnerable...with impunity.

Corrupt conservatorship/guardianship/power of attorney authorizations are so rampant. So many broken systems let the problems persist in perpetuity. If it can happen to Britney Spears, it can happen to anyone.

Write books, tell us about your experiences
I hope Britney and Mathew Rosengart write some books to expose how deep and wide the abusive systems are, how easy it was to be taken advantage of, and how difficult it's been to get out of. I believe Britney was lucky to get out of her abusive conservatorship alive.
 
Free Britney? Doesn't sound right.

For $200, now, you might get half n half in your

coffee.
 
I've no doubt that Britney will probably proceed to screw her life up now.
But at least it'll be up to her.
My brother is way smarter than me. Graduated from a university in just three years. Produced four pretty awesome children. And who I and my parents have had to bail out from his financial foolishness over and over. He's in his late 60's and, last I heard, broke again. But at least it was up to him. And his wife, of course.
Meanwhile, my wife's sister has screwed up the lives of nearly all her children, grandchildren, and great-grandchildren. Again, we tried to help, but it wasn't accepted. It's on her. And her complacent husband, who now has dementia and couldn't help if he wanted to.
Nuts. Was there a point to this post? I suppose it's that ultimately, people have to be responsible for their own lives. Britney hasn't been allowed to. I hope she succeeds, but am not optimistic.
 
Checkmite said:
Bob001 said:
https://www.msn.com/en-us/music/news/britney-spears-conservatorship-ends-after-13-years/ar-AAQDGLr
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Well, that's the end of that.

Now all that's left is the investigation into Jamie Spears' activities while acting as conservator.
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I disagree, and, while I can't speak for Britney, I have strong feelings about how you hold many people and broken systems, accountable for many types of abuse.

Jamie wasn't knowledgeable, skilled, or connected enough, to pull off all the conservatorship abuse by himself. Jamie had help. Multiple perpetrators, and multiple enablers, broken systems (court/lawyers/medical/financial wealth management firm/more...), lack of needed laws, all make for a wide-ranging investigation. Multiple judges were involved in issues that appear to include judicial misconduct. So it's not as simple as it's just Jamie's activities as conservator that need to be investigated. And perhaps prosecuted...

I keep in mind issues of transparency, traceability, and accountability. One example: Why didn't Judge Brenda Penny, review Britney's case when she got it? It would've been clear it was fraudulently-conceived under Judge Reva Goetz approved the conservatorship? Another red-flag of abuse was that Britney was in a hospital at the time, and wasn't in court. So Reva Goetz couldn't ask Britney if she understood, or wanted to challenge the conservatorship. The red-flag is, it's typical that changes, difficult or traumatic times, occur when someone is ensnared, gaslit, manipulated, or controlled.

Britney was subjected to limitations; limits of visiting with her kids, limits of where she can go, how much she could spend (of her own money), etc. Think of the trauma she likely experienced under this fraudulently-conceived, court-imposed conservatorship, where your own (corrupt) court-appointed attorney didn't properly advocate for you, didn't act in your best interests. Betrayal run amok.

Britney will direct what may or may not end up being researched, investigated, and criminally and/or civilly, pursued.

This is huge, and way more expansive than saying, "Now all that's left is the investigation into Jamie Spears' activities while acting as conservator."

Lots of people could be under investigation, and subject to prosecution, if Britney chooses.

Missing $600 million?
If correct, about $600 million dollars of Britney's wealth was siphoned off, with a public proclamation that Britney's wealth was valued at about $60 million dollars. So there are questions of who all was involved with that, and how that was done (it wasn't just Jamie).

During Popcorned Planet livestream (Fri., 12 Nov 2021), attorney Christopher Melcher mentioned Britney can recover money if there was fraud, failure to disclose, or conspiracy.

What is the emotional toll of trauma, endured for 13 years, trying to get out of...with the knowledge that she could've died, ensnared in a fraudulently-constructed abusive conservatorship she never needed to be in?
 
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Ernie M said:
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Missing $600 million?
If correct, about $600 million dollars of Britney's wealth was siphoned off, with a public proclamation that Britney's wealth was valued at about $60 million dollars. So there are questions of who all was involved with that, and how that was done (it wasn't just Jamie).
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I have no doubt that she was royally ripped off by actual fraud and general mismanagement, starting with "her" court-appointed lawyer who was getting $10,000 a week. But $600M? Who says? That would certainly create a trail.
 
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Ernie M said:
... Jamie wasn't knowledgeable, skilled, or connected enough, to pull off all the conservatorship abuse by himself. Jamie had help. Multiple perpetrators, and multiple enablers, broken systems (court/lawyers/medical/financial wealth management firm/more...), lack of needed laws, all make for a wide-ranging investigation. Multiple judges were involved in issues that appear to include judicial misconduct. So it's not as simple as it's just Jamie's activities as conservator that need to be investigated. And perhaps prosecuted...

...Lots of people could be under investigation, and subject to prosecution, if Britney chooses.
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Agreed. The father is an unscrupulous greedy worthless lowlife that did his damnedest best to suck everything he could off of his own daughter; but absolutely, there's no way he could've done without a whole lot of organized support. And all of that absolutely needs to be brought out into the open, and all of those individuals held to account, in order that there is some hope of a systemic overhaul for the sake of the others already trapped in this unspeakable horror... a horror that's so surreal that it's difficult to conceive of such outside of a horror novel or movie. It's truly hell on earth for everyone caught in it.


Missing $600 million?
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That much, really? I haven't really been following this case at all, after having initially checked out some reports some weeks ago. 600 million is a very large sum, even by the standards of Britney Spears' huge estate.

Absolutely, every cent of this misappropriated sum needs to be accounted for, and the people who've siphoned it away made to return every single cent of it. And that's just to begin with. That criminality, and the sheer horror of what they did to Britney and what they are conceivably doing to others as well, needs a full accounting, and commensurate redress and punishment.

If ever there were a truly ...evil real-life story, this is that story. The sheer horror of being caught in a system like this, it's difficult to really wrap one's head around the sheer ...horror of it all.



Let's hope Britney doesn't give up, and that she pushes for the criminality to be investigated and punished.



Although why should it be up to her personally? Surely there's enough material here for the authorities --- I don't know, whichever is the correct authority here --- to themselves initiate a full-on investigation into all of this?

They won't do that without prompting, that much is clear. Chances are this FreeBritney movement will now run out of steam, since its major goal --- perhaps its only goal --- has been achieved. If it could be mobilized to push for investigation into and redress of the system-wide criminality, then that would be great.
 
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Chanakya said:
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Although why should it be up to her personally? Surely there's enough material here for the authorities --- I don't know, whichever is the correct authority here --- to themselves initiate a full-on investigation into all of this?
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We could certainly hope for that. But "the authorities" created and supervised her conservatorship, including multiple judges. There's a report that at one point Spears sneaked out of her house and went to a police station to ask for help, and got nothing. The authorities have every incentive to maintain a coverup. Her lawyers are going to be fighting tooth and nail for every dollar and every document.
 
Bob001 said:
We could certainly hope for that. But "the authorities" created and supervised her conservatorship, including multiple judges. There's a report that at one point Spears sneaked out of her house and went to a police station to ask for help, and got nothing. The authorities have every incentive to maintain a coverup. Her lawyers are going to be fighting tooth and nail for every dollar and every document.
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True enough. I suppose I meant some "higher", federal level, investigation into this whole systemic mess, something like that.

And yes, I agree, the "hope" that some kind of self-correction of this kind might now set in seems more like wishful thinking than anything else.

Probably the only thing that might make for systemic cleanup is if Britney now goes after those who'd screwed up her life, or if activists take up that cause. That is, nothing may come of it even if she/they did, but I guess it's unlikely there's the slightest chance of anything happening, at a systemic level, in the absence of such. The kind of automatic self-correction I'd been thinking aloud about, I agree it doesn't look very likely.
 
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