Fat people in denial

tamiO said:

I agree totally about taking responsibility. I have managed to lose my weight by lowering my carb intake. I am not able to exercise very often, but on those good days I do.
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tamiO, I like your story - don't give up. I've lost some of my weight by higher protein, lower carb; but, I don't exercise either (at the moment). I sit at a computer at work for 3-7 hours a day. We all have some kind of stress in our lives, I know I do, and boy, do I love comfort food. It's hard to have control in a high-stress culture that isn't rationing food...
 
Badger said:


Nope, it's not easier for men. We just pretend it doesn't matter better.
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I think it's probably more difficult for women. Society still views a woman's appearance as having higher priority in her list of qualities than in the corresponding case of a man.
 
LucyR said:


I think it's probably more difficult for women. Society still views a woman's appearance as having higher priority in her list of qualities than in the corresponding case of a man.
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I submit that being compared to Fabio, Mel Gibson, Tom Selleck, Brad Pitt, Leonardo Di Capricio, etc. feels the same to a guy as being compared to any of the "hot" female celebrities does to a gal.
 
Badger said:


I submit that being compared to Fabio, Mel Gibson, Tom Selleck, Brad Pitt, Leonardo Di Capricio, etc. feels the same to a guy as being compared to any of the "hot" female celebrities does to a gal.
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I submit that you have serious self-esteem issues. To me, those people are nonentities, and being compared with them is a matter of supreme indifference to me. I get by on my almost boundless charm and wit.
 
LucyR said:


I submit that you have serious self-esteem issues. To me, those people are nonentities, and being compared with them is a matter of supreme indifference to me. I get by on my almost boundless charm and wit.
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That may be true, but I pretend not to care.

And anyone who don't like it, well FORK em! They don't know nothin anyway.;)
 
Earthborn said:
I really don't see why society should treat morbid obesity any different than other disabilities. Why make people's lives any more difficult than it probably already is?
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I don't see why society should treat people who eat too much the same as they treat people born without limbs or any other disability that isn't primarily caused by their own actions, i.e., eating too much. This thread is about denial - this nation has perfected it. See, we're not obese because we're lazy and eat crappy food, we're obese because we're "disabled." Or because our metabolisms are too slow. Or because our genes predispose us to obesity. Horsesh!t. When I leave this country, the only fat people I see are Americans on vacation. Since we are a nation of immigrants, primarily of European and African descent, how is it that we've evolved some kind of fat genes that bypassed our European and African breathren? We haven't. We just eat more than they do.

For the record, I'm 6'0" with 15% body fat and have been within 10 pounds of my usual weight for the last 15 years. However, I now weigh 182, the heaviest in my life. Have I gained the last 8 pounds due to a disability? Hardly. How did I gain the weight? I ate too much and exercised too little. How will I lose it? By exercising more and eating less. I was born with hypohidrotic ectodermal dysplasia. While I'm losing weight, can I also decide that I'd like to start sweating? No, because my extra weight is due to my eating too much while my inability to sweat is due to a congenital birth defect. In no way am I disparaging those who have legitimate health issues because of obesity caused by medical conditions; I'm only targeting those who refuse to change their lifestyles and blame it on circumstances beyond their control.

Edited to add:
Obesity is similar to substance abuse and I don't deny that many people have problems and may need treatment. However, I'm not comfortable granting the same "disease" or "disability" status to a group that includes those with cerebral palsy or cancer, as well as those who can resolve their conditions with behavior modification.
 
zultr said:
I don't see why society should treat people who eat too much the same as they treat people born without limbs or any other disability that isn't primarily caused by their own actions, i.e., eating too much. This thread is about denial - this nation has perfected it. See, we're not obese because we're lazy and eat crappy food, we're obese because we're "disabled." Or because our metabolisms are too slow. Or because our genes predispose us to obesity. Horsesh!t. When I leave this country, the only fat people I see are Americans on vacation. Since we are a nation of immigrants, primarily of European and African descent, how is it that we've evolved some kind of fat genes that bypassed our European and African breathren? We haven't. We just eat more than they do.

For the record, I'm 6'0" with 15% body fat and have been within 10 pounds of my usual weight for the last 15 years. However, I now weigh 182, the heaviest in my life. Have I gained the last 8 pounds due to a disability? Hardly. How did I gain the weight? I ate too much and exercised too little. How will I lose it? By exercising more and eating less. I was born with hypohidrotic ectodermal dysplasia. While I'm losing weight, can I also decide that I'd like to start sweating? No, because my extra weight is due to my eating too much while my inability to sweat is due to a congenital birth defect. In no way am I disparaging those who have legitimate health issues because of obesity caused by medical conditions; I'm only targeting those who refuse to change their lifestyles and blame it on circumstances beyond their control.
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I don't really have too much problem with your post. Humans are genetically predisposed to eat enough calories to allow them to hunt and kill food. Sitting ones ass in a computer doesn't mesh with that. The fact that Americans are fat and others are not might have to do with the abundance of food and ability for so many to make money without physical exercise.

I don't want to be compared with people who are handicapped. I certainly don't see myself that way. I like them don't want sympathy or pity. However I would like you to understand the science and realize that 95% of all people who are obese and lose a significant amount of weight will put it all back on.

Almost ALL people who are overweight WILL change their lifestyle and not blame it on circumstances but understand that they have a problem. You can pretend that there is no science to support this. You can pretend that the 95% figure is meaningless but it is not. For what it is worth I have lost more than 100 pounds. I can link specific and significant increases in my own weight to any behavior or activity associated with losing weight.

RandFan
 
RandFan said:
You can pretend that there is no science to support this. You can pretend that the 95% figure is meaningless but it is not. RandFan
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I don't believe I was "pretending" anything. We are creatures of habit and routine. I'm willing to bet that 95% of any habitual behavior returns to the previous norm after attempting to change, so it wouldn't surpise me in the least if almost all gained their weight back. The problem, as I see it, is that people have bought into the commercial concept of "going on a diet" There's no such thing as going on a diet; if you announce that you're going on a diet, you're implicitly admitting that you'll be going off of it before too long. To lose weight and keep it off, you don't go on a diet, you change your diet, and your lifestyle - permanently.

I'd also add some stats about how much the diet industry rakes in and the obvious synergy between junk food peddlers and the weight loss industry, but I'm too lazy to look them up. The problem is, if people lost weight and kept it off, then the industry wouldn't be selling too many books, and not many people would buy them if they read that they have to change their lives instead of popping a super carb burner pill and exercising 10 minutes a week.
 
You can pompously speculate all you want zultr, or you can actually look at the research.

Warning: openly biased link.
http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-poorfat.htm

Dr. Martin Seligman, an authority on obesity, writes: "Nineteen out of twenty studies show that obese people consume no more calories each day than non-obese people. In one remarkable experiment, a group of very obese people dieted down to only 60 percent overweight and stayed there. They needed one hundred fewer calories a day to stay at 60 percent overweight than normal people needed to stay at a normal weight." (2)
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zultr said:
I don't believe I was "pretending" anything. We are creatures of habit and routine. I'm willing to bet that 95% of any habitual behavior returns to the previous norm after attempting to change, so it wouldn't surpise me in the least if almost all gained their weight back.
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There is a problem with your thinking. 95% of people who quit smoking don't start again.

The problem, as I see it, is that people have bought into the commercial concept of "going on a diet" There's no such thing as going on a diet; if you announce that you're going on a diet, you're implicitly admitting that you'll be going off of it before too long. To lose weight and keep it off, you don't go on a diet, you change your diet, and your lifestyle - permanently.
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Been there done that. Yeah, if only we all knew that. I love how people spout wisdom with no evidence to support their nonsense.

I'd also add some stats about how much the diet industry rakes in and the obvious synergy between junk food peddlers and the weight loss industry, but I'm too lazy to look them up. The problem is, if people lost weight and kept it off, then the industry wouldn't be selling too many books, and not many people would buy them if they read that they have to change their lives instead of popping a super carb burner pill and exercising 10 minutes a week.
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:D Obesity is now a conspiracy.
 
zultr said:
I'm willing to bet that 95% of any habitual behavior returns to the previous norm after attempting to change, so it wouldn't surpise me in the least if almost all gained their weight back.
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No, I'll dig up the stats but absolutely not.

BTW,

The Truth About Obesity

The science does not agree with you but what the hell does science know?
 
RandFan,

Do you believe that there is any connection between being fat and eating too much?
 
LucyR said:
RandFan,

Do you believe that there is any connection between being fat and eating too much?
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Thanks for the question.

When I was young I wrestled in high school. I weighed 145 lbs but like everyone else I went down a weight class. I was very careful what I ate and exercised allot. I had very little body fat.

After high school I when ever I put on a few pounds I would simply watch what I ate and go to the gym more often.

Over the years my weight got higher and higher. I found that "changing lifestyles" made me nervous and miserable to be with. I hated life and thought only of changing my lifestyle. I was abusive and mean but I was thin. After I reached my goal weight I would seek to do that which made me feel normal which was to revert back to my old lifestyle.

I know what it takes to lose weight. My picture ran in the newspaper as a before and after picture when I lost the most weight in my life. The problem is the psychology and physiology. The inability to focus and perform daily tasks.

Long answer to a short question, yes, so what?

I belive I can save millions of dollars by working every waking minute of my life and never spending any money except that which is required to live. Why? What is the point if your life sucks?
 
Nasarius said:
You can pompously speculate all you want zultr, or you can actually look at the research.

"Nineteen out of twenty studies show that obese people consume no more calories each day than non-obese people. In one remarkable experiment, a group of very obese people dieted down to only 60 percent overweight and stayed there. They needed one hundred fewer calories a day to stay at 60 percent overweight than normal people needed to stay at a normal weight."

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I don’t dispute any of that. My point from above is that lifestyle choices affecting metabolism has the greatest impact on weight gain and loss. If your metabolism is trained to horde calories, you can actually eat less and still be overweight. So what is your point? That some genetic plague is sweeping the nation causing us to be fat? Can you find a study showing why Americans are obese and the rest of the world isn’t? What has caused the gene pool in this nation of immigrants to suddenly mutate and cause such a high percentage of obese persons? I’m looking forward to your next link.

RandFan said:
There is a problem with your thinking. 95% of people who quit smoking don't start again.
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40% of those having their voice box removed (laryngectomy) continued to smoke afterwards.

Almost 50% of those surviving surgery for lung cancer start smoking again.

Relapse rates are about the same as relapse rates for heroin and alcohol: about 60% of quitters relapse in 3 months, and 75% in 6 months.

According to the National Institute on Drug Abuse, nearly 35 million Americans attempt to stop smoking every year; less than seven percent are successful in permanently kicking the habit.

Congratulations. You were right. It’s only 93%. Is that the kind of “spouting wisdom with no evidence to support their nonsense” you were talking about? I will also point out that it is now illegal in many states to smoke at work or any public places, but you can eat till your heart’s content.


RandFan said:
Obesity is now a conspiracy.
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The diet industry pulls in $40 million per year. Source

How many diets are there? How many work? As far as I can tell, there’s only one solution, short of surgery: lifestyle modification. Until people decide to do it, there will be plenty of money to be made selling diets and no one will care if they work except the people going on them.

RandFan said:
No, I'll dig up the stats but absolutely not.

BTW,

The Truth About Obesity

The science does not agree with you but what the hell does science know?
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Again, there is nothing there I disagree with. I simply don’t think that people who have trained their bodies via their lifestyles to horde calories qualify as disabled or “diseased.” Can anyone respond to my comments about whether being obese is a “disease” or “disability” on a par with birth defects, amputations, cancer, or other non-lifestyle conditions?
 
zultr said:
The diet industry pulls in $40 million per year. Source

How many diets are there? How many work? As far as I can tell, there’s only one solution, short of surgery: lifestyle modification. Until people decide to do it, there will be plenty of money to be made selling diets and no one will care if they work except the people going on them.
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It by no means prove a conspiracy. And if anyone has a workable solution then they will never have to work another day in their life.
 
Ultimately, it all comes down to what you decide to put in your mouth. It really is that simple. Some people do have faster metabolisms then others, but that's not what's really behind america's obesity issues. As a nation, I doubt we are any more predisposed to getting fat as the people of any other country. It has everything to do with diet and lifestyle.

A couple of generations ago, you didn't see near the level of obesity in children that you see today. There's a reason for that, and its not genetic or biological.
 
Renfield said:
Ultimately, it all comes down to what you decide to put in your mouth. It really is that simple. Some people do have faster metabolisms then others, but that's not what's really behind america's obesity issues. As a nation, I doubt we are any more predisposed to getting fat as the people of any other country. It has everything to do with diet and lifestyle.

A couple of generations ago, you didn't see near the level of obesity in children that you see today. There's a reason for that, and its not genetic or biological.
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Kids nowadays got REAL strong thumbs, though!;)
 
RandFan said:
It by no means prove a conspiracy. And if anyone has a workable solution then they will never have to work another day in their life.
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I never tried to prove a conspiracy. In fact, I never called it a conspiracy. You did. I'm simply pointing out that our culture has evolved to the point where we are conditioned to make unhealthy choices.
 
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