Facebook and "coming out"

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

My family situation is similar to EeneyMinnieMoe's -- lots of devout Catholics. I was a struggling agnostic-bordering-on-atheist for a long time, before jumping to "just an atheist." (That Catholic upbringing's tough to let go of, huh, Eeney? )

Blackwell...I think you are psychic!

You just described all my religious struggles of the past four or five years! If not six or seven.

I've never been able to declare myself an atheist but I think I'm just on the verge of getting there, finally.

One day on the JREF Forum Community board, you might see a thread from me titled "Hey, it's finally happened" with a post text along the lines of "So I had breakfast and then I went to Barnes and Nobles, sat down with a book and I decided that I'm an atheist. It's happened. Just today. Just now. Today over the yukky Starbucks coffee in Barnes and Nobles. I took the plunge. Hello, my now new fellow atheists."

 

[OWW]

I am sure that 99.?% of the people involved in scouting follow the don't ask don't tell approach. However it is in the rules that you have to believe in a higher power to even be a participant. If someone chose to make a issue out of it one way or another then the zealots will crawl out of the wood work and that is not good for the kids nor the organization. I am unwilling to discard or disavow Scouting because of one issue when they do provide a lot of good guidance, educational opportunities and expereinces that are harder to obtain outside the scouting framework.

I agree. I've often been told by friends involved in uk scouts/guides that the associations have already had to make big changes to combat declining membership, and would never be able to function if the management chose to actively purse the (approved) religious angle; adults and kids alike would leave in droves.

Apologies for the slight thread hijack

 

[JFrankA]

Blackwell...I think you are psychic!

You just described all my religious struggles of the past four or five years! If not six or seven.

I've never been able to declare myself an atheist but I think I'm just on the verge of getting there, finally.

One day on the JREF Forum Community board, you might see a thread from me titled "Hey, it's finally happened" with a post text along the lines of "So I had breakfast and then I went to Barnes and Nobles, sat down with a book and I decided that I'm an atheist. It's happened. Just today. Just now. Today over the yukky Starbucks coffee in Barnes and Nobles. I took the plunge. Hello, my now new fellow atheists."

Pretty much the same story with me as well. Brought up Catholic, even seriously considered becoming a priest in my late teens but couldn't get my mind fully around some of the concepts I had to accept as a priest, so I never went through with it. Went through years of self-questioning and exploring until finally I realized that I simply did not, and through the evidence that history and science has presented, could not believe. I declared myself an atheist some years ago.

Which brings me to the OP. Most of my Facebook friends are old college and high school people who are used to me being religious. So when I listed myself as atheist it kind of threw a bunch of my friends for a loop.

I tend to speak my mind, though I try to be polite about it. I don't expect to change minds, I don't want to be disrespectful but I do want my voice heard and understood.

Consequently, I tend to get a lot of "God wants you to know" and "Weekly Bible Verse" on my wall. Admittingly, I find all this a little irksome because there's so many emotionally charged quotes and sayings that if one looks beyond the emotion, the saying makes no sense.

So in response, and this may be pompous of me, every week I put up an "Atheist Quote of the Week", and sometimes I challenge some of the quotes that I find particularly irksome. I try to remain polite and understanding, and to be honest, so do they.

But, honestly, I brought the whole "come out of the closet thing" on myself on Facebook. For example, at the moment I am in one discussion about Evolution with an old friend. When I told him that I know I am not going to convince him and he's not going to convince me, I just like to debate, he responded by saying that he is sure I'm going to "see the light" and convince me that "Evolution is a hoax". -.-

 

[Bikewer]

I'm on Facebook and a member of the "Atheist" group. My "friends" list is very small, and I keep my "groups" invisible to others.
At 63, everyone I know knows of my atheism and doesn't care.

Still, on the discussion group, (with mostly rather young members) we get constant discussions about how/if to "come out" to family and friends... Lot's of anguish there.

 

[GreyICE]

Exactly. Interacting with people on the Internet is one great big role playing game. It's not "real" life at all. And it's very dangerous for people to know who the "real" person is behind a post. Do you take the same precautions in real life? Like, if you got to a party or a bar, do make sure nobody there knows you? Do you watch your rear view mirror on the drive home to make sure you're not followed? Or do you just not say things to "real" people that you feel "safe" saying anonymously with no risk of repercussions?

Signed,

Jim Carr
www.AlwaysWellWritten.com
www.Facebook.com/UncaYimmy

Actually, Yimmy, yes. I don't hand out my phone number to random people at bars unless I'm pretty sure I want them to have it. I certainly don't hand out my full name and address. I do check my surroundings before I exit my car.

It's just basic self-protection. I've known a person who was stalked because her personal information was on the web. Someone had a person show up at their job. Wanted to talk to them or something.

If you want to put your information out there for every /b/tard, crazy nutter, and obsessed weirdo on the entire planet to have access to, go right ahead.

By the way, nice swimming pool in your back yard. That must be fun in the summer out there. That alleyway looks kinda sketchy though, do you know whose back there? Those trees would be great cover.

 

[CurtC]

It's interesting that, despite America having legally recognised division of church and state, Americans seem to have far more problems with being atheists than the British whose titular head of state is "defender of the faith" as well.

I've heard it suggested that perhaps, instead of being a contradiction, there's cause-and-effect. In the US, religion has flourished because of the separation from government, not in spite of it. In the US, we have a staggering variety of Protestant churches. When I was a kid, all the Protestant churches were associated with mainline denominations, but it seems like these days, most of the churches I see are generic, non-denominational.


About Facebook, I have on my info page, "None" listed as my religious views, and I'm a member of "North Texas Atheists, Agnostics, and Humanists." Plus, I'm friends with Reasonable Doubts. Those are the only indications of my religious views, and I've never had anyone notice.

Then again, I don't often comment with others. I couldn't care less whether they're making a grilled cheese sandwich right now, or they just got back from a 5 K run. Yawn.

 

[Blackwell]

One day on the JREF Forum Community board, you might see a thread from me titled "Hey, it's finally happened" with a post text along the lines of "So I had breakfast and then I went to Barnes and Nobles, sat down with a book and I decided that I'm an atheist. It's happened. Just today. Just now. Today over the yukky Starbucks coffee in Barnes and Nobles. I took the plunge. Hello, my now new fellow atheists."

I'm pullin' for ya, Eeney!

 

[Marduk]

I remember reading in "The Salmon of Doubt" an interview an American atheist magazine did with Douglas Adams. He responded to a few of the questions, as I recall, along the lines of "That situation just doesn't exist in the UK, so I can't respond to your question." It's interesting that, despite America having legally recognised division of church and state, Americans seem to have far more problems with being atheists than the British whose titular head of state is "defender of the faith" as well.

yup seems to me that in the U.S. you are a sceptic or an atheist first and an individual second. Thats the other way round in the UK. I have friends who are fundementalist christians, some others who are hardline atheists. I have discovered at my parties that both these are easily diluted with alcohol.

 

[Mark6]

I find it tragic that anyone in this day and age feels the need to hide perfectly respectable views in order to enjoy a hobby.

Respectable by whom?

If atheist views WERE respectable in US, nobody woul need to hide them. Unfortunately, most Americans do not respect atheist views. Hence they are not respectable, by definition.

 

[ToddH]

On my info page, my religion is listed as Pastafarian. So far I haven't heard from any of my christian friends or family about what that means. Other than that I pretty much keep it to myself.

 

[Chimera]

On my info page, my religion is listed as Pastafarian.

Me too, how funny.

 

[KingMerv00]

I'm pretty open with my atheism but every once in a while, someone will post something on my wall that is unnecessarily insulting to my Christian friends. I cringe but don't usually erase it. Maybe I should.

 

[Yeah_Right]

I have both friends and family on facebook, and there are times I'll post a video from youtube that features Michael Shermer, James Randi, or Joe Nikell, and I am not sure that anyone watches them since I never get any feedback. I continue to post videos regardles, and maybe the next time I'll ask if anyone every views them.

 

[OWW]

Respectable by whom?

If atheist views WERE respectable in US, nobody woul need to hide them. Unfortunately, most Americans do not respect atheist views. Hence they are not respectable, by definition.

er....

 

[OWW]

Wouldd it not be more accurate to say that Atheist views are respectable, if not actually respected by the majority of Americans?

Sorry, I'm not sure if I'm following your line correctly?

 

[baron_army]

I don't get any grief from my family. My brothers and cousins are on FB and they don't say anything about my Skepticism or my Atheism. My parents would probably say something but it really wouldn't effect me all that much.

I've only recently started adding people from the Skeptic community I've met through Virtual Drinking Skeptically and other means.

 

[KingMerv00]

er....

The top definitions for "respectable" from dictionary.com are:

1. worthy of respect or esteem

2. of good social standing

So you are both right.

 

[Uncayimmy]

Wouldd it not be more accurate to say that Atheist views are respectable, if not actually respected by the majority of Americans?

Sorry, I'm not sure if I'm following your line correctly?

Respect is a social invention. I would offer that there is nothing that the global population will agree is respectable, meaning worthy of esteem. In any given social circle (country, state, city, neighborhood, family, friends, workplace, club) something may or may not be respectable. When somebody says that something is not "respectable" I take it to mean that it's not generally considered "worthy of esteem" by the majority of a given social circle. That another circle holds it in high regard is immaterial.

There's also the semantic issue of "respectable" implying that something which is not respectable is worthy of scorn. For example, standing at a party and not farting is not really something we hold in esteem. It's the "respectable" thing to do in the sense that farting is disrespectful.

In the USA (broad brush to illustrate a point) it's generally considered to respectable to have a religion. It's the "most" respectable (believed by most) to have a Christian religion with "mainstream" beliefs. Having "oddball" Christian beliefs is not as respectable. Having a belief with one god is still respectable, but not as widely accepted. Having a belief with multiple gods or based on the "occult" is not particularly respectable. Believing in no god at all is not respected by many. Some believe it is respectable to respect all other beliefs in terms of god (or no god). Others find that ridiculous for their own reasons, and that includes some atheists.

Each one of those groups will define what respectable means in regards to religion. In a practical sense, which is the topic in this thread, sometimes the mere act of revealing a belief (or non-belief) will have ramifications. Somebody can be "respected" for all the things they do and how they treat others, but if they reveal themselves to be an atheist, some people will turn their backs. In the USA, there's a good chance of that happening.

 

[rjh01]

<snip>
By the way, nice swimming pool in your back yard. That must be fun in the summer out there. That alleyway looks kinda sketchy though, do you know whose back there? Those trees would be great cover.

In case someone does not read public notices you need to keep your identity secret on this forum in case there is another Apollo20 on the forum.

Ref http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=117412

Or even worse OldBob who breached rule 5. He posed a clear danger to another member

Ref http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154879
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154881

 

[GreyICE]

In case someone does not read public notices you need to keep your identity secret on this forum in case there is another Apollo20 on the forum.

Ref http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=117412

Or even worse OldBob who breached rule 5. He posed a clear danger to another member

Ref http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154879
http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=154881

It took me about 3 minutes to find Yimmy's home address off the information posted. There's no way in hell I'm posting a how to, but it's not tough - it's all publicly available. Google maps has him, and I posted a decent description of the back yard.

It's really why I don't give this stuff out. I have no particular desire to meet crazy people in real life, and I have no desire to be so utterly harmless and inoffensive that a crazy person would never be bothered by me (and how would I know what bothers them anyway? They're crazy).

P.S. I have no desire to visit people's houses, especially not Arizona. By the same token, I think people really need to be aware that 'what you give out' and 'what's available' isn't even CLOSE to the same thing.