Elizabeth Warren Ancestry Thread

[Stacyhs]

Warren's family narrative says Cherokee.

Yes, but she never claimed that the DNA test proved she was Cherokee....which was the question:

... but there is just no way to determine if someone has a Cherokee ancestor,, did she claim that the tests proved that?

 

[Silly Green Monkey]

Serious question: Why would the ethnicity of the placement family even matter?

Native Americans are quite insistent that NA children be placed with Native American families.

Indian Child Welfare Act (1978):

There's also the possibility that if the child was placed with the NA family without a test, he or she could grow up immersed in a culture they had no biological right to. Kinda the opposite of an adult with NA ancestry deciding that meant they could get tribal benefits despite not being a part of the tribe's society.

 

[Silly Green Monkey]

I rather suspect Warren already knew there was a trace of Native American when she started ticking the boxes as an ethnic minority. Perhaps she heard it from a family member.

So, this is where her calculating scheming nature comes in. She gamed the system for all it was worth, knowing that she could always come up with the trump card <ahem> of hey, I'm entitled to, it's in my DNA, so you can't touch me, guv.

This is the type of person who sits on the pavement claiming to be homeless...and then toddles off home when no-one's looking.

Yes, she believed there was a trace of Native American in her ancestry, as did I, that's why we ticked the boxes. How much did she get for 'gaming the system', given that she already had the position she was going for? How did she 'know she could point to her DNA' before DNA tests were a thing? What is she gaining now for the box ticking she stopped doing decades ago? Why is her political rivals' namecalling and insults a mark against her?

 

[Stacyhs]

I rather suspect Warren already knew there was a trace of Native American when she started ticking the boxes as an ethnic minority. Perhaps she heard it from a family member.

Have you not read even the basics of this story? There is no "perhaps" about it. She did grow up with stories of her Cherokee and possibly Delaware ancestry.

So, this is where her calculating scheming nature comes in. She gamed the system for all it was worth, knowing that she could always come up with the trump card <ahem> of hey, I'm entitled to, it's in my DNA, so you can't touch me, guv.

This is the type of person who sits on the pavement claiming to be homeless...and then toddles off home when no-one's looking.

LOL! Again with the character assassination about someone you know virtually nothing about? Warren ticked the box in 1986 when DNA testing was in its infancy. She had no idea she could be tested. Give it a rest.

 

[Meadmaker]

So, this is where her calculating scheming nature comes in. She gamed the system for all it was worth, knowing that she could always come up with the trump card <ahem> of hey, I'm entitled to, it's in my DNA, so you can't touch me, guv.

Back when she was ticking the boxes, this sort of DNA testing was science fiction.


I have no idea why she ticked the boxes. My guess is that Tragic Monkey hit the nail on the head. There was this story about Indian ancestry, and she thought it was cool to be Native American. I'm guessing that's all there is to it.

 

[Vixen]

I hadn't heard that rule, but it's a good rule.

I'm a little bit nervous about putting my DNA out there, but I'm trying to imagine what's the worst that could happen? I'm fairly confident that my DNA isn't sitting in a rape kit anywhere, even though I did get blackout drunk a few times in the early 1980s, so I am told anything is possible.

Right now, I'm leaning strongly toward going through with it. I actually already paid for it. I'm going through ancestry, and they had a sale where there was a low cost for the test, plus a 6 month membership. I already used the data in their database to find a couple of branches on the family tree. Not sure I like the fact that I identified them on their site, which means now they also have a record of who my cousins are but......I guess I'm taking some chances here.

Just use a fake name.

 

[Stacyhs]

There's also the possibility that if the child was placed with the NA family without a test, he or she could grow up immersed in a culture they had no biological right to. Kinda the opposite of an adult with NA ancestry deciding that meant they could get tribal benefits despite not being a part of the tribe's society.

Native Americans have a long history of adopting people into their tribes, including white captives in the past. These adopted members are considered to be just as much a member as those born into it.

 

[Meadmaker]

sigh, another article, quoting more experts...

This british expert found out that he had traces (1/1024 perhaps?) of native American heritage which just happened to line up with family lore! aMAZEBALLS!

“As a geneticist, I am absolutely convinced that they’re not related,” he told me. “It’s just statistical noise that happens to coincide with this cool story.” Statistically, it’s unlikely that such tiny amount of Native American DNA would have been enough to show up on Rutherford’s test.

https://gizmodo.com/how-dna-testing-botched-my-familys-heritage-and-probab-1820932637

Good article. You should read it.

Yeah, the percentages published by consumer tests aren't reliable. (Although I wasn't sure how unreliable until reading the article.) That doesn't make the science junk. It makes the automated algorithms and the numbers those algorithms produce junk, at least when explained in a computer generated printout geared toward an American consumer.

 

[Vixen]

How predictable. Is that the best you can do?

Now that you've responded with a such a persuasive argument, how about presenting the evidence that

1) "Today's DNA testing can pinpoint exactly which 'tribe' you are from",
2) DNA "can distinguish one Native American tribe from another",
3) "Warren also lied about her parents having to elope",
4) "They had a big traditional church wedding",
5) Harvard "fulfilled its quota of ethnics"*.

*Harvard disclosing the ethnicity of its freshmen does not prove there was a "quota" to fulfill.

And please, don't try to divert from the fact that you can't provide evidence of any of the above by resorting to accusing me of supporting a murderer. If you want to discuss that, I suggest you post in the appropriate thread.

ETA:
If Warren is 1/64 Native American ( as family lore and the DNA says is more likely) then Trump owes Warren at least $15, 610 to her chosen charity.


https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.e5b684b7dab8

(Thank you to Giordano)

No she isn't. If she was she would be able to name that third g-grandparent, or at least be able to point to culture handed down, such as in naming.

My Family DNA pinpointed the exact region my DNA emanated and it was correct. This was not a place you could randomly guess at.

Assuming many of the NA tribes in North America have kept themselves to themselves, then various markers will have developed over the generations specific to each group.

Warren's parents did not elope. They were back in town next day.

 

[Vixen]

We seem to be all over the place in this thread. There really is not a lot of similarity between 23andme and the research undertaken by Warren's team. They achieved a high degree of resolution, down to individual base pairs, but there is just no way to determine if someone has a Cherokee ancestor,, did she claim that the tests proved that?

She couldn't because it didn't.

 

[Vixen]

Yes, she believed there was a trace of Native American in her ancestry, as did I, that's why we ticked the boxes. How much did she get for 'gaming the system', given that she already had the position she was going for? How did she 'know she could point to her DNA' before DNA tests were a thing? What is she gaining now for the box ticking she stopped doing decades ago? Why is her political rivals' namecalling and insults a mark against her?

It wasn't usual for someone from Rutgers to get taken on at Harvard (a top 10). She arrived as a visiting lecturer (i.e., on probation), shortly after a time Harvard students had demonstrated about its lack of diversity.

Now Harvard is just over 50% 'ethnic minority'. How would you feel if you discovered this 50% were actually 99.9% 'Caucasian' admitted in with Warren levels of minority DNA?

Would you really be arguing, 'Ah, but they have 1.5% Asian, African American, Latino, Native American in their er, 'heritage' - their DNA tests prove it, so therefore they are ethnic minorities. They are not at all taking the piss out of the system"?

 

[Vixen]

Have you not read even the basics of this story? There is no "perhaps" about it. She did grow up with stories of her Cherokee and possibly Delaware ancestry.




LOL! Again with the character assassination about someone you know virtually nothing about? Warren ticked the box in 1986 when DNA testing was in its infancy. She had no idea she could be tested. Give it a rest.

No, I was referring to actual DNA kit testing. Her arrogance indicates she knew a trace would turn up in a test, thus felt emboldened to confidence trick people, knowing she could play the dumb broad game of 'told you'.

 

[Stacyhs]

No she isn't. If she was she would be able to name that third g-grandparent, or at least be able to point to culture handed down, such as in naming.

Oh, good lord. I couldn't name any of my 3X great grandparents until I researched my genealogy. Most Americans can't. I got news for ya: many, many Native Americans took "white" names, including my own Creek ancestor. They did so especially when not living on reservations. Today's leader of the Cherokee nation is Bill John Baker. Woodrow Keeble (Medal of Honor recipient) was a full blooded Dakota Sioux. You know not of what you speak.

My Family DNA pinpointed the exact region my DNA emanated and it was correct. This was not a place you could randomly guess at.

And unless you are a Native American, this means jack squat. I've already listed evidence, as have others, that DNA cannot pinpoint different tribes. On the other hand, you've presented no evidence otherwise despite repeated requests to do so.

Assuming many of the NA tribes in North America have kept themselves to themselves, then various markers will have developed over the generations specific to each group.

But they haven't. And thus the problem.

Warren's parents did not elope. They were back in town next day.

WHAT? Are you friggin' kidding me? This is just plain sad. My parents eloped the night my dad got back from Korea and drove to my mom's home the next day.
Again, you have presented no evidence otherwise.

 

[Vixen]

Good article. You should read it.

Yeah, the percentages published by consumer tests aren't reliable. (Although I wasn't sure how unreliable until reading the article.) That doesn't make the science junk. It makes the automated algorithms and the numbers those algorithms produce junk, at least when explained in a computer generated printout geared toward an American consumer.

It's a well-written article, but nonetheless pure anecdote. The author claims the DNA tests are wrong in that it doesn't identify English people as 'British'.

This is actually correct. The English have mixed so much with the French and Germans, geneticists are unable to distinguish one from the other. Scots, Irish and Welsh have remained more British than the English. He fails to understand this.

He's upset because he was expecting his Norwegian dad to give him a large portion of 'Scandinavian'. Later in the article it turns out his dad was only part-Norwegian; it was a grandparent who was Norwegian two generations back.

It's not so much the different DNA companies have different results, its that some label their findings by country, others by broad regions. Each commercial enterprise will seek to differentiate itself from its rivals, so no surprise there.

23+me constantly update your results (which are on your unique cloud account) every time new breakthroughs happen, or algorithms are adjusted.

 

[Stacyhs]

I rather suspect Warren already knew there was a trace of Native American when she started ticking the boxes as an ethnic minority. Perhaps she heard it from a family member.

So, this is where her calculating scheming nature comes in. She gamed the system for all it was worth, knowing that she could always come up with the trump card <ahem> of hey, I'm entitled to, it's in my DNA, so you can't touch me, guv.
This is the type of person who sits on the pavement claiming to be homeless...and then toddles off home when no-one's looking.

No, I was referring to actual DNA kit testing. Her arrogance indicates she knew a trace would turn up in a test, thus felt emboldened to confidence trick people, knowing she could play the dumb broad game of 'told you'.

You really just don't know when to put the shovel down.

She ticked the box in 1986. There was no DNA kit testing then.

 

[The Big Dog]

Now for the amusing part, we have the presumptive female front runner for the Dems with a completely tone deaf, self-inflicted wound and the leftists tripping all over themselves to defend her completely idiotic stunt rather than facing facts, apologizing and moving on..

Raise your hand if that sounds familiar!

 

[Vixen]

Oh, good lord. I couldn't name any of my 3X great grandparents until I researched my genealogy. Most Americans can't. I got news for ya: many, many Native Americans took "white" names, including my own Creek ancestor. They did so especially when not living on reservations. Today's leader of the Cherokee nation is Bill John Baker. Woodrow Keeble (Medal of Honor recipient) was a full blooded Dakota Sioux. You know not of what you speak.



And unless you are a Native American, this means jack squat. I've already listed evidence, as have others, that DNA cannot pinpoint different tribes. On the other hand, you've presented no evidence otherwise despite repeated requests to do so.



But they haven't. And thus the problem.



WHAT? Are you friggin' kidding me? This is just plain sad. My parents eloped the night my dad got back from Korea and drove to my mom's home the next day.
Again, you have presented no evidence otherwise.

Getting married in secret is not the same thing as 'eloping because of race hate'.

Let's face it, is was a folly of youth, not anti-American Native prejudice against Warren's mother.

 

[Stacyhs]

Getting married in secret is not the same thing as 'eloping because of race hate'.

Let's face it, is was a folly of youth, not anti-American Native prejudice against Warren's mother.

You're moving the goalpost waaaaaaaaaaaay over there ------->

First you claimed they did not elope and had a big traditional wedding. Now it's "not the same thing as 'eloping because of race hate'."

Let's face it, you have no idea why they eloped because you have absolutely no knowledge of them or what their families thought. None.
This need to denigrate a woman solely based on what you think you know about her is oh, so familiar.

 

[Vixen]

You're moving the goalpost waaaaaaaaaaaay over there ------->

First you claimed they did not elope and had a big traditional wedding. Now it's "not the same thing as 'eloping because of race hate'."

Let's face it, you have no idea why they eloped because you have absolutely no knowledge of them or what their families thought. None.
This need to denigrate a woman solely based on what you think you know about her is oh, so familiar.

Warren didn't see her mother as a Native American. She herself, as 'informant', notified the authorities that her Aunt Bee was 'White'.

https://legalinsurrection.com/wp-co...-Veneck-Certificate-of-Death-partial-view.jpg

Busted.

 

[Vixen]

https://twitter.com/RealJamesWoods/status/1053072014368538626


...and just like that, Senator Warren's Indian blood was gone.