Earth-like exoplanet discovered around Proxima Centauri

[Hlafordlaes]

I'm still not getting how you think this would break c.

Not to worry. You send out probes in many directions. They relay the info at c. You collect it. Once probes have reached other systems, you now have a first set of systems a machine could 'visit' in virtual reality. Doing the entire galaxy would take eons. But a machine, ostensibly, needn't travel to send its "eyes and ears" elsewhere. Actually, we humans do this, too, and so far have covered a good part of the local system only. We can now cruise around it using software simulation programs, and move from A to B at any 'speed.'

So this is really just the suggestion that since virtual reality for machines is ostensibly no different from local sensing of the environ, using data collected by probes is basically the same thing as traveling to a location directly. This also suggests that as our own tech improves, this is how we eventually will visit other planets. A lot cheaper than going there on manned missions. (Except for our local system, which makes sense, or can make sense, to visit in the flesh.)

 

[alexi_drago]

If true it could be the destination to aim for with those tiny laser riding solar sail probes from the news a couple of months back.

 

[Trebuchet]

The article coming from Universe Today, where Bad Astronomy wound up, seems quite ironic.

Nitpick: Bad Astronomy did not "wind up" at Universe Today. They are two separate blogs. BA is on Slate these days. Their forums did merge quite some time ago and have since been taken over by Cosmoquest.

The article does express some skepticism as well.

 

[Pianoro]

There is no known or anticipated technology that could make 4 light years traversable in a single human lifetime.

Fusion rockets and beamed propulsion are two examples of anticipated technology that would allow for a trip in a human lifetime.

If this pans out, it is extremely exciting. Not only might there be the potential for exobiology, but even if there isn't life it may be suitable for human colonisation - and be close enough that colonists could actually get there within a single human lifetime.

Humans travelling to Proxima Centauri (and the technology needed to do so) appears to be possible within the laws of physics as we understand them. Note that to colonize a planet, settlers would not necessarily need to get there in a human lifetime. Generation ships and some form of suspended animation could be possible solutions.

Regardless of speed, even with the most optimistic outlook on technological and economical development on Earth, any such efforts would likely be centuries out.

 

[theprestige]

One scenario would be that AI has evolving algorithms and can adapt, so motives might change over time. But my take on machine exploration is that it makes much more sense to send out sensors that can relay info back to each other and to the origin system. Eventually, with all the data, AI could 'travel' in a virtual galaxy instantly, even breaking "c," yet never actually move. Unlike humans, for AI, accurate data is ostensibly the same as 'being there.'

Why make a distinction between humans and AI on this score? Humans can learn from and apply accurate data just as well as AI. Ostensibly, we don't need to directly experience (or simulate) the Plutonian sensory environment in order to 'be there' in every practical way.

 

[Corsair 115]

There needs to be a hard definition put to 'Earth-like', perhaps in a scaling system. 'Earth-like' can be in terms of mass, diameter, density, average orbital distance from star, axial tilt, estimated average surface temperature, atmospheric composition, presence and extent of any surface oceans.

 

[Pianoro]

I'm still not getting how you think this would break c.

The same way Google Sky "breaks" c. Obtaining data for objects hundreds of light years away is virtually instantaneous.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

Not to worry. You send out probes in many directions. They relay the info at c. You collect it. Once probes have reached other systems, you now have a first set of systems a machine could 'visit' in virtual reality. Doing the entire galaxy would take eons. But a machine, ostensibly, needn't travel to send its "eyes and ears" elsewhere. Actually, we humans do this, too, and so far have covered a good part of the local system only. We can now cruise around it using software simulation programs, and move from A to B at any 'speed.'

So this is really just the suggestion that since virtual reality for machines is ostensibly no different from local sensing of the environ, using data collected by probes is basically the same thing as traveling to a location directly. This also suggests that as our own tech improves, this is how we eventually will visit other planets. A lot cheaper than going there on manned missions. (Except for our local system, which makes sense, or can make sense, to visit in the flesh.)

But still none of the information can move quicker than c.

 

[RecoveringYuppy]

But still none of the information can move quicker than c.

I think you're reading with a misconception. Nothing moves faster than c in his scenario.

 

[Craig B]

I think you're reading with a misconception. Nothing moves faster than c in his scenario.

Yes, it's like speeding up a pre-exposed cinema film so that the illusion of travelling faster than light is created. As in these reconstructions in which the viewer is taken in a trip from the Sun past Mercury and Venus to Earth. If that is compressed into less than eight minutes it creates the illusion of >c travel. But it is an illusion, not a voyage in real time by any person, or machine, or even signal.

It's a "this is one I prepared earlier" situation, like when Nigella seemed to have made a Christmas cake in two minutes.

 

[RecoveringYuppy]

Yes, it's like speeding up a pre-exposed cinema film so that the illusion of travelling faster than light is created. As in these reconstructions in which the viewer is taken in a trip from the Sun past Mercury and Venus to Earth. If that is compressed into less than eight minutes it creates the illusion of >c travel. But it is an illusion, not a voyage in real time by any person, or machine, or even signal.

It's a "this is one I prepared earlier" situation, like when Nigella seemed to have made a Christmas cake in two minutes.

Great example. I drew a blank on anything other than a simple repeat of what was already said.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

Ah, I think I see what's being said. But that isn't breaking c any more than watching a film which jump cuts from London to New York is.

Because that's what we're talking about, sequentially "watching" pre-recorded "footage" from different locations. That the viewer is viewing data that's wholly immersive doesn't change that.

 

[jonesdave116]

Put it like this: we aren't getting there any time soon!
However, if there are any sci-fi fans out there, may I recommend 'Proxima', by Stephen Baxter. Has a follow up called 'Ultima'. Well worth a read, and posits this exact scenario.

 

[Hlafordlaes]

Put it like this: we aren't getting there any time soon!
However, if there are any sci-fi fans out there, may I recommend 'Proxima', by Stephen Baxter. Has a follow up called 'Ultima'. Well worth a read, and posits this exact scenario.

Love Baxter... except when he is on too much of a science roll and forgets to do any character development. Missed those two titles; will add to my wish list.

 

[arthwollipot]

Generation ships and some form of suspended animation could be possible solutions.

Suspended animation is absolutely science fantasy and not at all realistic given what we know about physics and biology.

 

[3point14]

First things first: No, an Earth-like exoplanet has not been discovered around Proxima Centauri. Rather, Der Spiegel cites an unnamed source claiming such a discovery. Official sources have no comment. So much for the title of the thread.

Personally, I am skeptical. I think it would be suspiciously coincidental if our nearest star system just so happened to be home to another Class M Planet.

I'm not sure we have enough information to make this calculation, do we?

 

[3point14]

It's almost impossibly unlikely that intelligent life evolved on earth.

What figures are you using to make this calculation?

 

[RecoveringYuppy]

First things first: No, an Earth-like exoplanet has not been discovered around Proxima Centauri. Rather, Der Spiegel cites an unnamed source claiming such a discovery. Official sources have no comment. So much for the title of the thread.

Personally, I am skeptical. I think it would be suspiciously coincidental if our nearest star system just so happened to be home to another Class M Planet.

I'm not sure we have enough information to make this calculation, do we?

It's impossible for this to be an "Earth Like" or (Star Trek term used above) "Class M" planet. We know for certain it doesn't orbit a sun like star and that is one of many things those phrases would mean to the average person. We know that for certain, but we also know that the odds are against it having a day night cycle or a stable atmosphere. It's also likely to be hit by solar flares and frequently (constantly actually) x-rayed.

This is very likely to boil down to something that repeatedly happens in these stories: Author reads too much in to the word "terrestrial" and the phrase "habitable zone". To an astronomer, "terrestrial planet" simply means rocky, and "habitable zone" simply means the planet is at a distance that then temperate might be able to allow surface water.

When they make this announcement the odds are they will know the following: Distance from star, length of year, and a mass range.

Phrases like "Earth twin", "Earth like", or "habitable planet" are virtually ruled out.

 

[Belz...]

EARTH-LIKE PLANET AROUND PROXIMA CENTAURI DISCOVERED







If this pans out, it is extremely exciting. Not only might there be the potential for exobiology, but even if there isn't life it may be suitable for human colonisation - and be close enough that colonists could actually get there within a single human lifetime.

I hope it's true.

Ok now all we need is relativistic sublight speeds on a space probe...

 

[Belz...]

First things first: No, an Earth-like exoplanet has not been discovered around Proxima Centauri. Rather, Der Spiegel cites an unnamed source claiming such a discovery. Official sources have no comment. So much for the title of the thread.

Personally, I am skeptical. I think it would be suspiciously coincidental if our nearest star system just so happened to be home to another Class M Planet.

I'm betting this doesn't pan out. But either way, I think we should let official sources give a proper statement.

It's also odd that we didn't see it before, considering how close Proxima is.

Damn. I was born way too soon. Still waiting for that warp drive.