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Merged Due process in the US

stanfr said:
It absolutely was stupid, and disgraceful, but it 'differs' in that this in not being offered in a courtroom, this was presented for the court of public opinion, by an insane administration looking to justify their unconstitutional actions. So, it was not "illegal" per se in that it did not violate any specific law. Like so many of Trump's unethical actions, it was done with plausible deniability, he can claim he was just presenting evidence handed to him (that's always his 'out') and it was meant to clarify to the masses why he is behaving like a dictator.
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Yes, I should have been clearer here. It is of course legally different, just as a lie in court is legally different from a lie elsewhere. It was in the ethical sense that I meant it.
 
Jack by the hedge said:
Honestly I'd like to know too. Not that it's material to whether he's entitled to due process, but I've learned not to take any claim of fact by the Trump regime at face value, so I'm curious to know what the real fact are.
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My views are fluid on this matter, and I now agree that someone accused of being a gang member should be able to defend themselves against the charges if those charges will cause deportation to a terrible prison. That's why I want to know why two different courts decided Garcia is indeed MS-13.
 
Tero said:
Courts? Courts do not believe. They convict if there is evidence. The prosecutors always believe. That allows them to...er...prosecute.
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OK well numerous news articles make the claim that two courts accepted as accurate the accusation that he was MS-13.

I want to know why.
 
Hercules56 said:
OK well numerous news articles make the claim that two courts accepted as accurate the accusation that he was MS-13.

I want to know why.
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Did that actually happen, though? I've looked for details of these supposed rulings and come up empty. What court did it happen in? When? Who was the judge? What was the nature of the hearing? This stuff leaves a lot of paperwork and no one seems interested in sharing it.
 
I Am The Scum said:
Did that actually happen, though? I've looked for details of these supposed rulings and come up empty. What court did it happen in? When? Who was the judge? What was the nature of the hearing? This stuff leaves a lot of paperwork and no one seems interested in sharing it.
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I dont know but Newsweek says it happened, I want details.
 
Tero said:
Newsweek! Fox news lite.
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And the BBC:

www.bbc.com

Kilmar Abrego Garcia and MS-13: What is alleged and what we know

BBC Verify looks at the evidence behind allegations that the Salvadoran mistakenly deported to a mega-prison was a dangerous gang member.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

But the judge who presided over his 2019 case said that based on the confidential information, there was sufficient evidence to support Mr Abrego Garcia's gang membership. That finding was later upheld by another judge.




 
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I Am The Scum said:
Did that actually happen, though? I've looked for details of these supposed rulings and come up empty. What court did it happen in? When? Who was the judge? What was the nature of the hearing? This stuff leaves a lot of paperwork and no one seems interested in sharing it.
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www.bbc.com

Kilmar Abrego Garcia and MS-13: What is alleged and what we know - BBC News

BBC Verify looks at the evidence behind allegations that the Salvadoran mistakenly deported to a mega-prison was a dangerous gang member.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

bbc article. basically the arresting officers in his 2019 home depot arrest said his chicago bulls hat and tattoos were indicative of involvement in ms13. the presiding judge in that case agreed and they got a confidential source to confirm it.

this is trayvon martin level stuff
 
Hercules56 said:
And the BBC:

www.bbc.com

Kilmar Abrego Garcia and MS-13: What is alleged and what we know

BBC Verify looks at the evidence behind allegations that the Salvadoran mistakenly deported to a mega-prison was a dangerous gang member.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

But the judge who presided over his 2019 case said that based on the confidential information, there was sufficient evidence to support Mr Abrego Garcia's gang membership. That finding was later upheld by another judge.
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Hmm, it appears that Garcia was arrested at Home Depot with two MS-13 members. One of them confirmed that Garcia is also part of MS-13, but a low-level member. Both judges accepted this evidence as accurate.
 
dirtywick said:
www.bbc.com

Kilmar Abrego Garcia and MS-13: What is alleged and what we know - BBC News

BBC Verify looks at the evidence behind allegations that the Salvadoran mistakenly deported to a mega-prison was a dangerous gang member.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

bbc article. basically the arresting officers in his 2019 home depot arrest said his chicago bulls hat and tattoos were indicative of involvement in ms13. the presiding judge in that case agreed and they got a confidential source to confirm it.

this is trayvon martin level stuff
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There was also a corrupt cop claiming Garcia was ms13.

A second deportation under President Donald Trump’s draconian immigration crackdown has been tied to a disgraced police officer — exposing a disturbing pattern in how the administration is removing powerless people from the United States, largely without due process.
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This time, it’s Kilmar Abrego Garcia — a Maryland father of three wrongfully deported to El Salvador by the administration’s admission — whose case has drawn international scrutiny. The New Republicrevealed that the local police detective who first labeled him an MS-13 gang member was later indicted for misconduct.
A second deportation under President Donald Trump’s draconian immigration crackdown has been tied to a disgraced police officer — exposing a disturbing pattern in how the administration is removing powerless people from the United States, largely without due process.


The Maryland officer, Ivan Mendez of the Prince George’s County Police Department, was suspended and convicted for leaking confidential police information to a sex worker in 2020. According to The New Republic, in 2019, Mendez filled out the “Gang Field Interview Sheet” that ICE later used to claim Abrego Garcia was a member of MS-13 — citing, among other things, that he wore a Chicago Bulls hoodie and hat. ICE also claimed a confidential informant tied him to a New York gang clique despite Abrego Garcia never living there.
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Hercules56 said:
Two judges felt the evidence was believable, not withstanding the PO's previous lack of integrity.
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Indeed, based on testimony like this.
Mendez filled out the “Gang Field Interview Sheet” that ICE later used to claim Abrego Garcia was a member of MS-13 — citing, among other things, that he wore a Chicago Bulls hoodie and hat. ICE also claimed a confidential informant tied him to a New York gang clique despite Abrego Garcia never living there.
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