Drag Shows!!

[Upchurch]

"Why they get their own reading group when straight/cis/whatever people don't" is just my grandpa doing his "Why ain't der no White People History Month?" routine with the nouns swapped out, nothing more, nothing less.

Damn. Beat me to it.

Of course, the whole point behind DSH was brought up pages ago and hand waved away.

 

[Thermal]

Can you explain to me how those two things are comparable? This is like, the definition of false equivalence.

Promoting gender specific lifestyle choices. It's not that complicated.

Is a more direct equivalence more comprehensible for you? I already mentioned a Cis Het Story Hour. Would you be okay with that too? It would piss me off royally. "Oh, but queer folk need more positive representation, unlike CisHet folk" you say. Not to 4 year olds, who not only don't like have prejudices, but don't even know what a man in drag is, and wouldn't even recognize one. This is adult virtue signaling, just like a cishet story
hour would be.

Also, about your "Houston Libraries only do this one story hour" thing, the Houston Public Library appears to disagree that there is "only this one" Story Hour:

Yeah I saw them. You know what I didn't see? Any character readings at all. You know, like we have been assured they had princess story hour and superhero story hour and all the rest?

Did you see the last part? IN SPANISH?!?!?! HARUMPF, HARUMPF.

I see you are tipping your bigot projecting hand. You might recall that I am a Jersey construction guy, and speak Spanish daily. I think we all should, as a matter of course in the states. But you just have to project made up bull ****, don't you? Honest discussion is formally in the rear view mirror, I see.

ETA: in strictest accuracy, I speak a butchered Spanglish. I lose a lot of the subtleties of "eh" versus "ah" at the end of words which changes meanings and stuff. My kids all speak at least elementary Spanish from us using it around the house, and one graduated high school as biliterate fluent and passably bilingual

 

[Emily's Cat]

Non-sexual dance is performed virtually exclusively in strip clubs? Did you miss the 'non-sexual' part?

Let's start an "Actors Story Hour" where all of the actors are porn actors. But they're not doing anything sexual in the presence of kids, so no biggie. If you remove all of the sex, they're just acting.

So obviously, having a story time for children in which porn stars are featured, it totally fine.

 

[Foster Zygote]

I'm aware guys, hence my putting scare chords around agenda.

I'd assumed as much. I didn't mean to seem as if I was informing you, but rather just putting it out there for everyone.

 

[Emily's Cat]

The clown and super hero and princess and Star Wars reading hours aren't at risk of being banned or even labeled dangerous so of course there isn't a national discourse on them. The people arguing it's sexual and dangerous and somehow wrong for kids to be exposed to have the burden to support that claim.

Have you bothered to give any thought at all as to WHY superheroes, princesses, and star wars characters are NOT being considered inappropriate for young children, where drag performers (and strippers, for that matter) are being challenged?

Are you genuinely incapable of understanding the difference here?

Can you at least vaguely grasp why parents might be perfectly fine with Sandra Bullock reading to their children, but NOT with Stormy Daniels doing the same thing?

 

[Foster Zygote]

Have you bothered to give any thought at all as to WHY superheroes, princesses, and star wars characters are NOT being considered inappropriate for young children, where drag performers (and strippers, for that matter) are being challenged?

Are you genuinely incapable of understanding the difference here?

Can you at least vaguely grasp why parents might be perfectly fine with Sandra Bullock reading to their children, but NOT with Stormy Daniels doing the same thing?

You certainly seem to be incapable of understanding the difference between wearing clothes and taking them off/having sex.

If Scott Thompson were to read children's stories to a group of kids dressed as Elizabeth II (which would be awesome), would you think, "Great! Now I have to explain anal sex to a bunch of 5 - 6 year olds!"?

 

[JoeMorgue]

You certainly seem to be incapable of understanding the difference between wearing clothes and taking them off/having sex.

"I bet you're naked under your clothes, you harlot."

 

[JoeMorgue]

Again we're back to "Everything non-traditionally sexual people do is all about sex" thing.

The fact that we don't go "You want a straight man to read to your children? A straight man! Why he could start inserting his penis into a vagina at any moment!" is the point that now two people are putting on a big, showy point of pretending not to get.

What makes a Drag Queen more sexual than Mr. John Straight Cis Smith Esq?

Answer the question, and acting faux and unbelievably faked shocked that we don't agree is not an answer.

 

[Upchurch]

Have you bothered to give any thought at all as to WHY superheroes, princesses, and star wars characters are NOT being considered inappropriate for young children, where drag performers (and strippers, for that matter) are being challenged?

Yes. (Well, not the silly stripper slippery slope argument.) It is exactly the same prejudice that leads to higher levels of self-harm among gender atypical teens. The very problem DSH states they're trying to help by exposing kids to people not adhering to traditional gender roles.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Again we're back to "Everything non-traditionally sexual people do is all about sex" thing.

The fact that we don't go "You want a straight man to read to your children? A straight man! Why he could start inserting his penis into a vagina at any moment!" is the point that now two people are putting on a big, showy point of pretending not to get.

What makes a Drag Queen more sexual than Mr. John Straight Cis Smith Esq?

Answer the question, and acting faux and unbelievably faked shocked that we don't agree is not an answer.

I haven't been to any of these story readings, but I'd be willing to bet that the performers look more like Dame Edna than a dominatrix in a corset, thigh-high stockings and spike heels.

 

[Thermal]

Yes. (Well, not the silly stripper slippery slope argument.) It is exactly the same prejudice that leads to higher levels of self-harm among gender atypical teens. The very problem DSH states they're trying to help by exposing kids to people not adhering to traditional gender roles.

Walk us through that, if you don't mind. Do the 3 year olds understand what they are being exposed to? Are the story readers introduced as Mr John Smith, a man who wears a dress and that's okay? Will the kids even remember that they saw a man in drag reading to them one afternoon? How, specifically, does all this work in real time?

 

[Foster Zygote]

Can you at least vaguely grasp why parents might be perfectly fine with Sandra Bullock reading to their children, but NOT with Stormy Daniels doing the same thing?

In the highly unlikely event that Stormy Daniels did do a book reading at a public library, why would kids be any more likely to be curious about her sex life than that of a mainstream actress? Are you advocating such prudish standards that people have to maintain a certain "purity standard" in order to be allowed to interact with people in public?

Again, you're demonstrating an inability to see certain people as anything but their sex lives. A drag performer, who might not even be gay, might have a rather pedestrian sex life compared to a librarian, who might like to dress in dominatrix gear and chain her husband to the wall in gimp suit. And I'm not saying that should disqualify her from interacting with children at work.

 

[plague311]

Is a more direct equivalence more comprehensible for you? I already mentioned a Cis Het Story Hour.

Cis and drag aren't even in the same realm.

Would you be okay with that too?

Having straight people read to kids? That would totally shock the hell out of me.

It would piss me off royally. "Oh, but queer folk need more positive representation, unlike CisHet folk" you say. Not to 4 year olds, who not only don't like have prejudices, but don't even know what a man in drag is, and wouldn't even recognize one. This is adult virtue signaling, just like a cishet story hour would be.

So you're upset that this thing that kids won't understand is taking place? Neat.

Speaking of projecting, how about the "adult virtue signal"? You can read minds now or is that just what you would be doing in their situation? You don't think the kids enjoy it? You don't think that they enjoy seeing someone in, as you imply, a "costume" reading to them? After all, to them it's just a person in a costume reading to them.

Yeah I saw them. You know what I didn't see? Any character readings at all. You know, like we have been assured they had princess story hour and superhero story hour and all the rest?

Not sure if you noticed but just because that one individual library doesn't do them, there are many story hours around Houston with characters in them. Just because they don't happen at this specific library (due to there being more than one in Houston) doesn't mean they don't happen. This might surprise you, but there are a ton of bigots, homophobes, and uptight ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ that would frown at a Drag Queen Story Hour. That's why other story hours are held at other locations as well.

I see you are tipping your bigot projecting hand.

I was more just mocking the idea that since something is different, people hate it, but sure.

You might recall that I am a Jersey construction guy, and speak Spanish daily. I think we all should, as a matter of course in the states. But you just have to project made up bull ****, don't you? Honest discussion is formally in the rear view mirror, I see.

ETA: in strictest accuracy, I speak a butchered Spanglish. I lose a lot of the subtleties of "eh" versus "ah" at the end of words which changes meanings and stuff. My kids all speak at least elementary Spanish from us using it around the house, and one graduated high school as biliterate fluent and passably bilingual

I don't care.

 

[plague311]

Walk us through that, if you don't mind. Do the 3 year olds understand what they are being exposed to? Are the story readers introduced as Mr John Smith, a man who wears a dress and that's okay? Will the kids even remember that they saw a man in drag reading to them one afternoon? How, specifically, does all this work in real time?

When superheroes come out, are they introduced by their ******* superhero name? Their real name? The superheroes real name? They don't bring up that he's a man in a superhero uniform and that's ok. Jesus Christ. Common sense ain't all that common sometimes.

Look at the poster about the guy that had a background you're bitching about, does the poster show his real name or his character name? Glad I could help.

 

[plague311]

Let's start an "Actors Story Hour" where all of the actors are porn actors. But they're not doing anything sexual in the presence of kids, so no biggie. If you remove all of the sex, they're just acting.

So obviously, having a story time for children in which porn stars are featured, it totally fine.

It would be totally fine with me. If my kid asks what a story reader did for a living I'd tell them to be quiet and listen to the story.

It's fun moving from sex career to sex career just trying to find something "wrong".

Emily, you know that Stormy is a ******* mother, right? She probably reads to her kids, right? So they literally have Stormy doing porn star story hour, and I'd bet that child is perfectly fine because they have a mother that loves them. Crazy, that.

 

[JoeMorgue]

Walk us through that, if you don't mind. Do the 3 year olds understand what they are being exposed to? Are the story readers introduced as Mr John Smith, a man who wears a dress and that's okay? Will the kids even remember that they saw a man in drag reading to them one afternoon? How, specifically, does all this work in real time?

1. 3 years olds are stupid. They don't understand anything.

If it was really about "But it will confused da children!" mentioning the Pitch Hitter Rule in Baseball or Icing in Hockey would be banned as a weapon of Mass Destruction in NATO Treaties.

There's literally toddler books about String Theory that you have zero problem with. Shove "But it will confuse the children!"

2. "This is John. He wears a dress." End of discussion. It ain't that hard.

People pretending they get to discriminate because "Oh how am I going to explain this to my children" would need several smart arguments added to it just to get to the level of "dumb argument."

Explaining things to your little waterhead crotch goblins (I said it that way specifically so you'd have something to pretend to get offended about so you didn't have to address my actual argument, figure I'd make it easy on you) is your problem, not mine.

 

[Stacyhs]

Let's start an "Actors Story Hour" where all of the actors are porn actors. But they're not doing anything sexual in the presence of kids, so no biggie. If you remove all of the sex, they're just acting.

So obviously, having a story time for children in which porn stars are featured, it totally fine.

False equivalent. Unless there is sex involved, it's not porn.
Besides, unlike drag queens, porn acting is inherently sexual. You do seem to have difficulty separating the two.

Have you bothered to give any thought at all as to WHY superheroes, princesses, and star wars characters are NOT being considered inappropriate for young children, where drag performers (and strippers, for that matter) are being challenged?

Are you genuinely incapable of understanding the difference here?

Can you at least vaguely grasp why parents might be perfectly fine with Sandra Bullock reading to their children, but NOT with Stormy Daniels doing the same thing?

Kids wouldn't have any idea who Stormy Daniels is or what porn is, for that matter. To them, she'd just be a lady reading them a story.

 

[Foster Zygote]

Do the 3 year olds understand what they are being exposed to?

Do they ever? They're three FFS.

Are the story readers introduced as Mr John Smith, a man who wears a dress and that's okay?

If they were, so what? Do you think the proper thing to do is tell them it's not OK? Should they be indoctrinated with bigotry at a young age so they're less likely to ever question it? Could you walk us through exactly how you think a child knowing that a performer dressed as a woman is actually a man will cause that child psychological harm?

If the performer is a young woman dressed as Elsa from Frozen, do we really need to tell the kids that she's not really a magical princess?

Will the kids even remember that they saw a man in drag reading to them one afternoon?

How is this relevant?

How, specifically, does all this work in real time?

Well, kids are taken by their parents to see someone dressed in a costume read a story to them. Then they go insane when/if they learn the person dressed like a ridiculously large fairy princess is actually a man, just like that kid in the Chick Tract who instantly became homicidally psychotic when he learned that Santa doesn't exist, because their little brains are born with the God-given knowledge that men and women must conform to gender specific clothing standards. Having been driven insane by "the gay", they then socialize with other children, destroying their universal sense of who wears the pants in the family, thus spreading the gay to them as well. This will spread like the Super Flu until the entire human species (as well as the rest of the frogs) are as gay as your average whelk, and humanity dies out (albeit dressed fabulously) according to article VI, section 69 of the Gay Agenda. The only way to stop this is to nuke the whole site from orbit before the children have a chance to realize that the person reading the story isn't one of Grandma's sewing club friends. It's the only way to be sure.

 

[Stacyhs]

I asked for my first Basic D&D set for Christmas when I was a kid during all that. I thought there was no way my parents would actually give it to me, let alone at my religious grandmother’s house that year. I was genuinely surprised to un-wrap both the first and second set that year and nobody batted an eye. That’s when I began to put together that “religious” does not mean completely stupid.

Agreed. Religious does not mean completely stupid. But the ones behind the D&D hysteria were.

 

[Thermal]

1. 3 years olds are stupid. They don't understand anything.

If it was really about "But it will confused da children!" mentioning the Pitch Hitter Rule in Baseball or Icing in Hockey would be banned as a weapon of Mass Destruction in NATO Treaties.

There's literally toddler books about String Theory that you have zero problem with. Shove "But it will confuse the children!"

2. "This is John. He wears a dress." End of discussion. It ain't that hard.

People pretending they get to discriminate because "Oh how am I going to explain this to my children" would need several smart arguments added to it just to get to the level of "dumb argument."

Explaining things to your little waterhead crotch goblins (I said it that way specifically so you'd have something to pretend to get offended about so you didn't have to address my actual argument, figure I'd make it easy on you) is your problem, not mine.

Let me hold your hand and guide you through this, lest you say something stupid again:

I am not saying, JoeMorgue, that this will "confuse the children". I am saying, JoeMorgue, with painful clarity, that they will not have the faintest comprehension of what a drag queen is or what any of it is all about. They will not become enlightened. They will not remember that they once had a drag queen read them a story in a library, and look more favorably on the queer community. The odds are staggering that it will all be lost on them, and if anything, they will vaguely remember over the summer that they once had a fairy tale read to them by some colorfully dressed lady, then they will forget. Do you understand that, JoeMorgue? Do you understand how stupid it is to interpret that as "it will confuse the children?

Speaking of stupidity and childishness, the thread seems long past anything resembling good faith discussion. Feel free to join plague and some others here in making up random bigoted bull **** to project while you pine the loss of Warp.