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Merged Does CERN prove Einstein wrong?

JayUtah said:
The thermal deformation hypothesis is fully supported by nothing more than basic physics. I don't need to postulate some sort of magical material.
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How hot is the alleged mirror on the moon when sunlight is shining on it? And how cold is the mirror when no sunlight is shining on it? The answer is: super hot and super cold. That's thermal deformation. A few dust particles would not heat up the already super hot glass more than by a minuscule change.
 
Anders Lindman said:
Only gullible people believe that...
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...there is somehow naturally-occurring soil that is an order of magnitude or two more reflective than the surrounding material, localized to one particular spot on the lunar surface, and becomes less reflective when only acting as a retroreflector.

Can't you see how you are being fooled?
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We know you're doing your best, but I'm afraid you're not fooling us.
 
JFK was sacrificed so that the Apollo hoax could continue. Not because of the general public, but to make the 'brainy people in the industry and universities' to not object. Object and you will get your head blown off, just as JFK, capiche?
 
Anders Lindman said:
JFK was sacrificed so that the Apollo hoax could continue. Not because of the general public, but to make the 'brainy people in the industry and universities' to not object. Object and you will get your head blown off, just as JFK, capiche?
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And you're not afraid of objecting?
 
Anders Lindman said:
JFK was sacrificed so that the Apollo hoax could continue. Not because of the general public, but to make the 'brainy people in the industry and universities' to not object. Object and you will get your head blown off, just as JFK, capiche?
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Oh no! Better keep your head down, Anders :boggled:

Yea, like nobody in the history of Earth has every blown the whistle on something while risking their lives to do so...
 
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twinstead said:
Oh no! Better keep your head down, Anders :boggled:

Yea, like nobody in the history of Earth has every blown the whistle on something while risking their lives to do so...
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This is where I start to actively dislike conspiracy theorists. Bad enough that they lie and distort science and history -- I happen to think that spreading scientific ignorance is bad for all of us -- but they also seem to believe in a world where;

1) No-one is very smart, no-one can accomplish great things. Einstein was a fool, engineers are all faking it trying to make things look complex, geologists are all frantically cribbing off each others papers because they don't actually know anything but how to support a status quo, computers and the pyramids were only built with alien assistance, etc.

2) No-one is courageous. Not just the average person, but ALL the people who know enough to matter are willing to put a paycheck ahead of even human decency; they'll turn a blind eye to mass murder as long as they can keep their own job.

It is a scary, depressing, and downright sick world they believe in, and I am sickened to think that they see other people, their fellow human beings, in that light.
 
Anders Lindman said:
The answer is: super hot and super cold.
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Are you sure about that? What's the absorptivity of a mirror?

See, this is how we weed out the real engineers from the engineer wannabes. You don't get to be an engineer until you get rid of all your prejudices and preconceptions.

A few dust particles would not heat up the already super hot glass more than by a minuscule change.
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Or so you think. Heat transfer is not an intuitive subject.
 
Anders Lindman said:
JFK was sacrificed so that the Apollo hoax could continue. Not because of the general public, but to make the 'brainy people in the industry and universities' to not object. Object and you will get your head blown off, just as JFK, capiche?
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Then why are you still alive?

This is the same argument that every hopeless conspiracy theorist throws out there just about at the time he realizes he's in over his head on the technical details. At some point he has to admit that he's just not smart enough to argue the actual facts, so he changes tack. He tries to argue that everyone who is smart enough to dispute the hoax theory on its facts actually knows the conspiracy theory is right, but doesn't admit it for fear of some deadly threat looming.

In other words it's the same old conspiracy mantra: If you can't make it work, make it bigger.

So basically he's back to calling everyone liars. It's the last desperate throes of the departing troll.
 
Anders Lindman said:
How hot is the alleged mirror on the moon when sunlight is shining on it? And how cold is the mirror when no sunlight is shining on it? The answer is: super hot and super cold. That's thermal deformation.
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You can always spot a clear, correct and detailed scientific analysis of heat transfer from the way it carefully avoids considering any details of the problem it's addressing, offers no quantitative results whatsoever, and can't even distinguish between totally different phenomena.

Dave
 
Wait a minute... "Alleged" mirror? Total incomprehension about thermodynamics?

Anders....how far up does the vacuum go?
 
JayUtah said:
Are you sure about that? What's the absorptivity of a mirror?
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Enough to to make it very hot since objects which are heated cannot be cooled by empty space. So when sunlight is shining on the mirror it constantly absorbs more and more energy from the sun.
 
Anders Lindman said:
Enough to to make it very hot since objects which are heated cannot be cooled by empty space. So when sunlight is shining on the mirror it constantly absorbs more and more energy from the sun.
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So let's see your estimates of the following:

Thermal mass of the mirror.
Rate of heat transfer into the mirror through absorption.
Rate of heat loss from the mirror through radiation.
Rate of heat loss to the lunar surface through conduction.

From that, we should be able to work out how long it takes the mirror to get "super-hot". Or rather, we could, if you could also tell us how hot "super-hot" is.

Dave
 
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