Ed Do you like your cheese?

arthwollipot said:
There's a difference between a group of people "reclaiming" a word and using it to apply to themselves, and that being acceptable for other people to use to apply to them.

Just be a white guy, head into Detroit, and start calling people the n-word. After all, African-Americans use the word to refer to themselves, right? Should be fine for you to do so too.

Let me know how it goes.
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Indeed. This is all down to the fact that the meaning of utterances is so context dependent. The word "wog" means something in a particular context and is usually considered perfectly unobjectionable by the speakers and listeners, and in another context it would not be acceptable to those listening.

Use of the N-word would certainly be unacceptable in some contexts depending on the speaker and who was being addressed by it. But in the context of a group of RAF veterans watching the Dambusters it would not be.
 
arthwollipot said:
There's a difference between a group of people "reclaiming" a word and using it to apply to themselves, and that being acceptable for other people to use to apply to them.
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Not necessarily. As I posted earlier, I once said to my daughter’s mother-in-law, of Italian heritage, “the wog is strong in you today” (we were talking about food) which resulted in laughter. It shows how well the word has been neutralised.
 
lionking said:
Not necessarily. As I posted earlier, I once said to my daughter’s mother-in-law, of Italian heritage, “the wog is strong in you today” (we were talking about food) which resulted in laughter. It shows how well the word has been neutralised.
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For your mother-in-law, perhaps. But you are very familiar and it's not likely to be taken badly. You judged the situation at the time and deemed that in that situation it was likely to be okay. That's not the same thing as it being acceptable for use generally.
 
lionking said:
Not necessarily. As I posted earlier, I once said to my daughter’s mother-in-law, of Italian heritage, “the wog is strong in you today” (we were talking about food) which resulted in laughter. It shows how well the word has been neutralised.
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A large part of that has to do with how the view of a certain ethnic group has been assimilated into society. Even during my lifetime, there has been a huge shift. In today's America, pretty much anyone of non-Hispanic European heritage is just plain white. In my youth, 50 years ago, a lot more people knew and cared about their ancestral background. Those ethnic identities were fading, but still visible. By now, two generations later, the melting pot has done its work and very few people are purely of one ethnic group.

Now, I only know one person who strongly identifies as Italian, and she is over 70.

As a result, there really isn't much discrimination against most of those ethnic groups, because there isn't really much way to distinguish them. So, if someone called me a "Paddy" or a "Mic", I would just laugh because I am sufficiently connected to my Irish heritage that I have a passport from the place, but, culturally, I'm really just an American who likes folk music. I would take the "ethnic slur" as a rare acknowledgement that I am slightly different from your average white guy. Since there is no real discrimination against Irish or Italian or Polish people anymore, the various slurs against them don't carry any negative weight.
 
arthwollipot said:
For your mother-in-law, perhaps. But you are very familiar and it's not likely to be taken badly. You judged the situation at the time and deemed that in that situation it was likely to be okay. That's not the same thing as it being acceptable for use generally.
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I don’t agree at all. In Melbourne at least, “wog” is on the same level as “Pom”. Sure, they can be used in hateful, derogatory ways when combined with anger and spittle, but usually aren’t.
 
lionking said:
I don’t agree at all. In Melbourne at least, “wog” is on the same level as “Pom”. Sure, they can be used in hateful, derogatory ways when combined with anger and spittle, but usually aren’t.
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You really only get away with it, as is mostly the case with these things, with people you know.

I wouldn't recommend (as a Skippy) to walk up to any non-Skippy on Sydney Rd, Brunswick and start calling him a wog.

I was born in Brunswick, in the last year of high school I was one of only two Anglos (Skippies) out of 60+ in the class. I also worked in the Coburg Market where I could get away with this with the other guys working there but never a customer - or indeed in front of a customer.

Sorry, I don't buy it.
 
cullennz said:
Have never heard of "Pakistani" being offensive any where personally
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Well - I never comment on the social mores between Maoris and Pākehā in NZ.

The reason?
I don't have any experience in that society.

I have, though, lived and worked in the UK and Pakistan.

You are wrong.
For exactly the reason I don't comment on NZ society.
 
lionking said:
The last time I heard racial sledging in public was at an AFL match over 10 years ago.
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Riiighhhhttttt - racial abuse of AFL footballers stopped in 2010.

Racism in sport in Australia
We've had this discussion before - oh, 6 days old.

Carlton's Eddie Betts calls out racist abuse he received on Twitter on weekend AFL supports Black Lives Matter.
Online - 'cos they haven't been playing because of COVID - but still public

And we've been bring up our children to be fair, unbigoted cherubs too.
Basketball ACT investigating racist slur allegedly made to 12-year-old girls during Canberra game
 
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EHocking said:
Riiighhhhttttt - racial abuse of AFL footballers stopped in 2010.

Racism in sport in Australia
We've had this discussion before - oh, 6 days old.

Carlton's Eddie Betts calls out racist abuse he received on Twitter on weekend AFL supports Black Lives Matter.
Online - 'cos they haven't been playing because of COVID - but still public

And we've been bring up our children to be fair, unbigoted cherubs too.
Basketball ACT investigating racist slur allegedly made to 12-year-old girls during Canberra game
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For goodness sake. Will you please stop this crap.

I did not say that racial abuse has not happened recently. I used the word “I” and I did it deliberately. Many people in this thread have been relating anecdotes, including you a post ago. That’s what I did.

But you seem determined to paint a picture of me that, for some reason, suits you. It’s wrong and boring.
 
cullennz said:
No ****

It is almost like that was my point.

Do you actually read posts?
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Yes. Do you?
You claim that Australians find it inoffensive so Pakistanis should do to.
My point is that Pakistanis find it offensive.

Exactly the opposite of your point.
 
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lionking said:
For goodness sake. Will you please stop this crap.

I did not say that racial abuse has not happened recently. I used the word “I” and I did it deliberately. Many people in this thread have been relating anecdotes, including you a post ago. That’s what I did.

But you seem determined to paint a picture of me that, for some reason, suits you. It’s wrong and boring.
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No.
I am pointing out that just because you are not noticing it does not mean that it no longer happens.
Which was the point of your anecdote.
 
EHocking said:
Yes. Do you?
You claim that Australians find it inoffensive so Pakistanis should do to.
My point is that Pakistanis find it offensive.

Exactly the opposite of your point.
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No

Geezes. Read.

My point is the exact opposite.

It is something a lot of aussies find in-offensive that is.

I need the head banging wall icon again.
 
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