DJLegacy of LC Forum Proves Gravy Dead Wrong!

[RandFan]

Suggestion for Gravy and Dubfan, who have done yeoman's work here -- since DJ2Kwhatever insists on broadcast, for reasons that escape me, I don't suppose either of you know of any more legitimate media that might host such a debate? One with more than 50 listeners and higher standards of reporting, I mean?

Actually that is a pretty good idea.

 

[pgwenthold]

Why are you all so dead set on being on a forum so you all can pat each other on the back and it saves you from thinking on your feet? Is that it?

Since the question is about "truth," it's not obvious to me why "thinking on your feet" matters. I would think that ultimately it should come down to being able to provide verifiable information that can be examined closely.

I mean, it is about finding out the truth, right?

As for why they are dead set about it being in this forum, I think it is because they feel secure that they won't be banned as soon as things start getting dicey.

 

[dubfan]

Actually that is a pretty good idea.

Gravy suggested that Team JREF Ninja Wave respond to the "9/11 Scholars for Truth" request for a debate with government experts on 9/11. I thought it was a serious request (although Gravy might differ) and worthy of consideration.

The government plainly has no interest in offering legitimacy to a bunch of CTs by entering into debate with them, so I'm sure it was just a bluff on the Scholars' part designed to discredit the Kean report and FEMA/NIST, etc.

We should call their bluff.

 

[Ducky]

Why are you all so dead set on being on a forum so you all can pat each other on the back and it saves you from thinking on your feet? Is that it?

Funny, the same could be said for the LC forum. Of course we don't ban people because we disagree with them...

So you're here and for the most part all I see is insults and rhetoric and not one iota of evidence to debunk any of Gravy's paper on the film.

You just come here to insult, or are you going to pony up some actual evidence and seriously discuss anything?

 

[Kage]

First he is waiting for Gravy to show up, then when Gravy does show up, he leaves. Somehow I imagine that this will be porttrayed as DJ pwning Gravy, which is typical. To paraphrase Master Shake, this is topsy turvey world.

 

[realitybites]

We should call their bluff.

I agree. Although my debating skills are a little rusty, I'm a damn good waterboy and can certainly chime in when a good Star Wars reference is needed to drive the point home.

In all seriousness though... what are the odds we could do something like that?

 

[CptColumbo]

First he is waiting for Gravy to show up, then when Gravy does show up, he leaves. Somehow I imagine that this will be porttrayed as DJ pwning Gravy, which is typical. To paraphrase Master Shake, this is topsy turvey world.

Maybe he went to work? I think we should show a little patience...

No rush...

Plenty of time...

WTF MAN LET'S GET MOVING HERE!!!

Seriously, let's give him an oppurtunity to prepare a post with proper notation. That was why I wanted a written debate, rather than a live one.

 

[Regnad Kcin]

Paranoia?...

I had never followed government or conspiracies before 9/11. I could have honestly cared less...

But anyone who can watch what happened that day and say the planned it in a cave, and pulled off their plans the way they did...Are nutjobs.

there was no paranoia because I hadn't exposed myself to it, so I had nothing to be pananoid about...

You people make me sick...

I feel bad for everyone who died on 9/11 and you all choose to turn a blind eye to finding out what really happened to them. "CT'ers at least want to know what happened, they care more than someone who is just going to turn their back and make excuses to go with the official story...WHICH THE NIST ADMITS IS JUST A THEORY!

Punk.

 

[Belz...]

If the "study" was asking a group of military men to plan out an attack that used boxcutters to take of planes to fly them into the WTCs and to also use explosives in the process...You don't find that to suggest anything?

You wouldn't happen to have a scan of the original "plan", would you ?

 

[Belz...]

Exactly my point...You all have no proof of anything that went on on 9/11....except someone TOLD you what to believe...

Yes, indeed. The same thing you're doing here. Only THEY have evidence. YOU don't.

Its quite sad...If I had a close mind like what you all have, Id probably slit my wrists...

No you wouldn't, because close-minded people tend to think they have an open mind.

 

[Belz...]

Paranoia?...

I had never followed government or conspiracies before 9/11. I could have honestly cared less...

But anyone who can watch what happened that day and say the planned it in a cave, and pulled off their plans the way they did...Are nutjobs.

Unfortunately, that's not evidence, and it's not the kind of sentence that'll convince anyone, on any side.

I feel bad for everyone who died on 9/11

I feel bad for their families, really.

and you all choose to turn a blind eye to finding out what really happened to them.

We just don't let emotion get in the way of the truth.

"CT'ers at least want to know what happened, they care more than someone who is just going to turn their back and make excuses to go with the official story...WHICH THE NIST ADMITS IS JUST A THEORY!

Just like gravity.

 

[ZouPrime]

I've always found strange the willingness of CT believers to use Northwood as some kind of evidence for 9/11. If Northwood proves anything, it is that a government willing to create a casus belli to support a war would never design something like 9/11 to begin with.

Northwood called for relatively small operations: mock attacks, fake bombing and sabotage, involving a very small number of victims (a plane) when there's victims, all far and away from the public eye. All things that make sense; the goal here is to provoke a reaction within the US population, not to kill and destroy indiscriminately. Countless states (including the US) has used similar tactics at one point or another in the past, so by itself Operation Northwood isn't anything special. And note that even with its relatively small scope, Nortwood was actually never implemented by the JFK administration.

9/11 on the other hand was anything but Northwood. We're talking here about thousands of deads, billions in damage, and the destruction of very important US landmarks, affecting the country economy in a very profound and permanent way. In scope, it is many orders of magnitude bigger than Nortwood. If the goal is a mere casus belli, it's a complete overkill. And a risky one too: there're advantages of blowing a plane far and away from the public eye, while doing all these things right in front of everybody is massively stupid when you want to hide a conspiracy. If the Bush government had conspired to create 9/11 (assuming MIHOP here), it would NEVER have done 9/11. Too complicated, too costly, way too risky, and completely unecessary given the stated goal. And why put the blame on Saudis and not on Iraqis? Why destroy the WTC? Why risk that important millitary assets get killed in the Pentagon? There's far too many ways the plan could have seriously backfire for even think about attempting it, when much easier, much less riskier solutions could be easily designed.

 

[MarkyX]

I always found it funny that people bring up Northwoods and "IT PROVES TEH GOVERNMENT HAS THE BRAINS TO THINK ABOUT ITZZ"

Do they honestly believe that if this actually went to court, that Operation Northwoods (a document not written by their adminstration, 40 years ago before Bush was elected, and never happened) would actually be used as good evidence against them? No, they'll be laughed at by the courthouse.

Sorry but this doesn't prove anything. Anyone who fails to see the lack of connection are simply twisting or ignoring evidence to suite their agenda. Then again, most of the emails I've been getting that I get that don't accuse me for being in the CIA, FBI, Mossad, Global Elite, or threaten my life, always in the end up accusing me of being a Bush Supporter.

It really shows me the CT's true colors. They either dislike the government because it's the government, or they are trying to get a ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ of money for it (Dylan, Jones), or just 'ammo' against Bush so they can hold a sign instead of working. These people do not care about 9/11 or it's victims.

 

[kookbreaker]

It really shows me the CT's true colors. They either dislike the government because it's the government, or they are trying to get a ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ of money for it (Dylan, Jones), or just 'ammo' against Bush so they can hold a sign instead of working.

The Apollo Hoax thread over there showed those colors well. Even one 911 doubter, after destroying all the hoax claims was left with a bunch of guys saying 'How can you beleive it, lol!'. At one point he was just exasperated and said 'Does it ever occour to you that the government can tell the truth as well as lie?'. The replies indicated that they seemed to think this was not possible.

 

[realitybites]

But anyone who can watch what happened that day and say the planned it in a cave, and pulled off their plans the way they did...Are nutjobs.

And what exactly are people who believe that the government (the Bush Administration no less) not only pulled this off, but published their intentions (via Northwoods and PNAC) for the whole world to see?

I'll see you're "nutjob" and raise you an "effing certifiable".

 

[MarkyX]

With apologies to Pardalis, have you considered Cananda?

They take in refugees.

Oh hell no. I will ran this guy over before he crossed the border.

 

[Orb]

Over on the Gravy only thread, He posted links to the accusations of DK. Most of them aren't working now. Looks like someone removed them.

 

[MarkyX]

All you people do is make excuses....

You lack the ability to connect 2 and 2 to make 4. To you all and Negative times a Negative would NEVER equal a positive...

It's quite sad.

Coming from the same guy who believes all explosions are from bombs

http://newsfromrussia.com/accidents/2005/02/13/58231.html

A raging fire swept through the upper levels of an empty, 32-story office building in downtown Madrid early Sunday, causing no serious injuries but collapsing the top floors in a shower of flaming debris.

Bright orange flames shot out the sides of the Windsor Building, which is near one of Madrid's main boulevards.

The fire started around 11:30 p.m. Saturday and was still burning out of control several hours later. At least nine upper stories were on fire and muffled explosions could be heard in the building.

 

[chipmunk stew]

Over on the Gravy only thread, He posted links to the accusations of DK. Most of them aren't working now. Looks like someone removed them.

I think some of the links are just broken. (They point to urls that are truncated by ellipses--probably were copy-pasted, rather than copy_shortcut-pasted)

 

[Arkan_Wolfshade]

Zzzzz I told you, if you all can't be a part of it, you all want to whine and complain...the radio show is archived and saved to later break downs...When you all are serious let us know...until then I will just continue on with my work...If you want it all in writing I will just keep working on my article...If you have some balls to stand up live and thin on your feet let me know...

Roxdog's pudcast meets none of the criteria for a proper debate: it is not on neutral ground, it is not judged by an impartial third-party, and it does not have a formal format.

What you are asking for is a talk-show like confrontation, a la Jerry Springer.