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DeSantis’s Lost Cause

Warp12 said:
On the first point, there is no need to illustrate the obvious liberal bias in classrooms. If we each search our souls, we know we have experienced this firsthand in our education.
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Snort. The 'it's so obvious I don't need to illustrate it by giving actual examples' fallacy followed by the 'we know' fallacy. Well done. Transparent, but points for using two fallacies. :thumbsup:
 
Stacyhs said:
Snort. The 'it's so obvious I don't need to illustrate it by giving actual examples' fallacy followed by the 'we know' fallacy. Well done. Transparent, but points for using two fallacies. :thumbsup:
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Yeah, that doesn't add up, from my experience. Imo, either you teach with your heart and conviction, or you are disingenuous. And the best teachers I ever had, taught with their hearts and conviction. And most were liberals.

I'd like to think that most good teachers do the same. But, as with anything, it can be taken too far.
 
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shuttlt said:
Just as in the Soviet Union it had a Communist bias, in Nazi Germany it had a Nazi bias and in ancien regime France it had a monarchist bias. How puzzling that time after time reality has a bias towards the ruling orthodoxy. Reality should make up it's mind.
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It's not puzzling at all. It's the philosophy of the grifter, the bully, the criminal and the autocrat.

You seem to be missing the point. The question isn't about what actually happens when one group wins power over another; it's about why that 'might' necessarily makes 'right'.

In your view, Russia's invasion of Ukraine is just hunky-dory as long as they eventually win.
 
Stacyhs said:
It's not puzzling at all. It's the philosophy of the grifter, the bully, the criminal and the autocrat.

You seem to be missing the point. The question isn't about what actually happens when one group wins power over another; it's about why that 'might' necessarily makes 'right'.

In your view, Russia's invasion of Ukraine is just hunky-dory as long as they eventually win.
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You are misunderstanding what "might makes right" means. It's like you are trying to interpret Whose On First as a riddle. If you don't understand that, you really can't understand any Conservative, and certainly not any Realist postitions.
 
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Warp12 said:
Originally Posted by Stacyhs View Post
Snort. The 'it's so obvious I don't need to illustrate it by giving actual examples' fallacy followed by the 'we know' fallacy. Well done. Transparent, but points for using two fallacies.
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Yeah, that doesn't add up, from my experience.
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Your post doesn't actually address mine. You shift off into what makes a good teacher which had nothing to do with the fact that you have still failed to give actual examples of how school children are being indoctrinated with liberal ideologies.


Imo, either you teach with your heart and conviction, or you are disingenuous. And the best teachers I ever had, taught with their hearts and conviction.
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True, good teachers love their work but I've yet to see a teacher, and I know lots of teachers having been one myself, who told her kids "you need to feel really guilty because white people are bad and had slaves over a hundred years ago! AND, sweetheart, you aren't really a boy. You're a girl!"

And most were liberals.
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Sure. And I bet your elementary and middle school teachers had some great conversations with you about their political and gender/sexual orientation beliefs so that you could surmise that they were 'liberals'. :rolleyes:

"Yes, Warpie, as soon as you're done learning today's ten spelling words starting with the letter 'B', we'll talk about how great Socialism is, how bad Capitalism is, and how being Gay is a good thing and you can be gay, too!"

I'd like to think that most good teachers do the same. But, as with anything, it can be taken too far.
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Yes, like the restrictive laws that idiot DeSantis and his loyalists are imposing on teachers in his bid to be a Trump Mini-Me on the way to the WH in 2024 or 2028. FL teachers are quitting over this crap:

A Florida elementary school teacher said he quit his job after another staff member removed his pictures depicting African American leaders.

Michael James, who taught at O.J. Semmes Elementary School in Pensacola, said he had posted images on a bulletin board depicting civil rights icons Martin Luther King Jr. and Harriet Tubman, scientist George Washington Carver and former Secretary of State Colin Powell. He told the Pensacola News Journal that he wanted to display the images so the students, a majority of whom are Black, could see someone they could relate to.
James said it "really floored" him when a staff member removed the photos.

"I've been teaching special education for 15 years, and it just really floored me when she did that," he told the newspaper.
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James said the staff member told him that the images were not "age appropriate." He said she also removed an image he had on his desk of former President Barack Obama.
"She picked it up and said, 'You don't need to put this up either.' She said — I can't remember exactly what she said — but she said, 'the kids are too young' or something like that. It floored me," he told the newspaper.
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Read the rest of the article for the ************ story the School District came up with. A teacher doesn't resign because he was being helped 'setting up his classroom" and "didn't mind" when the posters were removed.

A unique set of challenges is causing Florida educators to call it quits. In addition to passing laws that critics say target the LGBTQ+ community and people of color, political figures in the state have characterized educators as threats to students and parents. Tired of what they consider to be character assassination, low pay and a lack of job security, teachers in the Sunshine State are resigning in worrisome numbers.
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But for the first time in 12 years , when school resumes this fall, [Anita Carson] the bisexual middle school instructor won’t be in a classroom. She resigned in May due to a combination of factors, chief among them Florida’s recent passage of laws, including “Don’t Say Gay” and the Stop WOKE Act, that limit what educators can say about issues such as sexual orientation, gender identity and race.
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Then the rhetoric took a sharp turn. Political groups began portraying teachers as nefarious influences in students’ lives. “These right-wing extremist groups were talking about teachers indoctrinating kids with liberal [agendas] and saying that teachers are groomers and pedophiles if they ever support LGBTQ-anything in the presence of a minor,” Carson said. “I couldn’t take it anymore. I was like, ‘I have to get out of this. This is toxic. This is not the space that I want to be in anymore.’”
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The Sunshine State is the epicenter of Moms for Liberty, a conservative parent group co-founded by two former Florida school board members.
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Their movement for more parental oversight of curricula related to race, gender, sexuality or politics spread across the nation during the pandemic. The group holds such sway in conservative circles that Betsy DeVos spoke at its summit Saturday, garnering headlines for reportedly calling for an end to the Department of Education, the federal agency she led during former President Donald Trump’s administration.
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https://19thnews.org/2022/07/national-school-teacher-shortage-florida-controversial-laws/
 
Stacyhs said:
Your post doesn't actually address mine. You shift off into what makes a good teacher which had nothing to do with the fact that you have still failed to give actual examples of how school children are being indoctrinated with liberal ideologies.




True, good teachers love their work but I've yet to see a teacher, and I know lots of teachers having been one myself, who told her kids "you need to feel really guilty because white people are bad and had slaves over a hundred years ago! AND, sweetheart, you aren't really a boy. You're a girl!"



Sure. And I bet your elementary and middle school teachers had some great conversations with you about their political and gender/sexual orientation beliefs so that you could surmise that they were 'liberals'. :rolleyes:

"Yes, Warpie, as soon as you're done learning today's ten spelling words starting with the letter 'B', we'll talk about how great Socialism is, how bad Capitalism is, and how being Gay is a good thing and you can be gay, too!"



Yes, like the restrictive laws that idiot DeSantis and his loyalists are imposing on teachers in his bid to be a Trump Mini-Me on the way to the WH in 2024 or 2028. FL teachers are quitting over this crap:





Read the rest of the article for the ************ story the School District came up with. A teacher doesn't resign because he was being helped 'setting up his classroom" and "didn't mind" when the posters were removed.








https://19thnews.org/2022/07/national-school-teacher-shortage-florida-controversial-laws/
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Unfortunate expression of position, imo. One that illustrates an intense desire to condemn conservatives, even when they extend an olive branch.
 
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shuttlt said:
You are misunderstanding what "might makes right" means. It's like you are trying to interpret Whose On First as a riddle. If you don't understand that, you really can't understand any Conservative, and certainly not any Realist postitions.
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Please, sir, will you please explain to me what "might makes right" really means? I've always thought, apparently incorrectly, that it meant what dictionaries defined it as:

1) "Definition of might makes/is right
—used to say that people who have power are able to do what they want because no one can stop them"

2) "Superior strength can enforce one's will or dictate justice, as in The generals dismissed the parliament and imprisoned the premier—might makes right in that country, or The big boys wouldn't let the little ones use the basketball, a case of might makes right. "

3) "The stronger and more powerful rule others, control the situation, or determine right and wrong."
 
Stacyhs said:
Again, you don't address the topic but segue into victimization.
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Completely false. I clearly stated that my experience was that most teachers were liberals, and certainly the best teachers I had were largely liberals. And I also have said, if most look at their educational experience honestly, they will find that their educators were primarily liberals.

There is nothing more for me to say on this.
 
Warp12 said:
Completely false. I clearly stated that my experience was that most teachers were liberals, and certainly the best teachers I had were largely liberals. And I also have said, if most look at their educational experience honestly, they will find that their educators were primarily liberals.

Your attempt an excuse doesn't even make sense. How does an "Unfortunate expression of position, imo," become "One that illustrates an intense desire to condemn conservatives, even when they extend an olive branch"?

There is nothing more for me to say on this.
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Promise?
 
shuttlt said:
Just as in the Soviet Union it had a Communist bias, in Nazi Germany it had a Nazi bias and in ancien regime France it had a monarchist bias. How puzzling that time after time reality has a bias towards the ruling orthodoxy. Reality should make up it's mind.
Click to expand...

The US now is denying rational science and history in order to promulgate right-wing propaganda in obvious denial of facts.
Congratulations! You are now fully echoing Stalinist ideals!
Well done comrades!
 
shuttlt said:
Just as in the Soviet Union it had a Communist bias, in Nazi Germany it had a Nazi bias and in ancien regime France it had a monarchist bias. How puzzling that time after time reality has a bias towards the ruling orthodoxy. Reality should make up it's mind.
Click to expand...

No, reality isn’t that flexible. Alternative facts aren’t facts.
 
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Warp12 said:
On the first point, there is no need to illustrate the obvious liberal bias in classrooms. If we each search our souls, we know we have experienced this firsthand in our education.
Click to expand...

I'm sure if you search your soul you'll know that we all see what a lame, transparent evasion that is. It's almost as though you're just parroting right-wing talking points without having thought about them.
 
Stacyhs said:
Snort. The 'it's so obvious I don't need to illustrate it by giving actual examples' fallacy followed by the 'we know' fallacy. Well done. Transparent, but points for using two fallacies. :thumbsup:
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Followed up with the 'but muh feels!' maneuver.

Still too hackey. 1½ stars.
 
Stacyhs said:
It's not puzzling at all. It's the philosophy of the grifter, the bully, the criminal and the autocrat.

You seem to be missing the point. The question isn't about what actually happens when one group wins power over another; it's about why that 'might' necessarily makes 'right'.

In your view, Russia's invasion of Ukraine is just hunky-dory as long as they eventually win.
Click to expand...

Funny thing is these "might makes right" types will undoubtedly call the cops if they're ever mugged.
 
Warp12 said:
Completely false. I clearly stated that my experience was that most teachers were liberals, and certainly the best teachers I had were largely liberals. And I also have said, if most look at their educational experience honestly, they will find that their educators were primarily liberals.

There is nothing more for me to say on this.
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You also completely failed to provide any of the requested examples of "freakish liberal ideals and beliefs being pressed on children".

Can you imagine what would happen if a prosecutor said he knew the defendant was guilty, but when asked by the defense council what evidence he had to support that claim he simply turned to the jury and said, "Look into your hearts and you'll know he's guilty. I rest my case."? I imagine he'd be laughed out of court.
 
shuttlt said:
Why shouldn't they? There is nothing inconsistent in that.
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So might makes right, but only when it works out in your favor. Yeah, that seems pretty consistent with that position.

I bet it would be right if the police started rounding up university professors and charging them with corrupting the youth by pressing their freakish liberal ideals and beliefs on them, but wrong if they started rounding up conservative Christians like in some Left Behind fan fiction story.
 
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