DeSantis’s Lost Cause

[Foster Zygote]

Of course not. They're just trying to stunt the intellectual growth of this generation of students. Otherwise, who would vote for them in the future? Certainly not anyone who's informed and can think critically.

A little while ago I posted a link to a Pew poll showing what demagogues like DeSantis are actually afraid of.

High school or less: 47% Republican - 45% Democrat

Some college: 47% Democrat - 45% Republican

College graduates: 54% Democrat - 39% Republican

Postgraduates (people with Master's Degrees and Ph.D.s) 63% Democrat - 31% Republican.

 

[dudalb]

You have well and truly drunk the Kool Aid.

Exactly what "beliefs and standards" have "liberals" "pushed onto" and "programmed" school children with?

Do you think all State Boards of Education and local school boards, who determine the curriculum, are all controlled by 'leftists'? I got news for you: curriculum development is determined by the input of many people... educational professionals that include teachers from all political and religious beliefs. It is reviewed and changed on a regular basis with the aim of always improving it.

What you, DeSantis and his ilk are really upset about is not that children are being 'indoctrinated' or 'programmed' but that they aren't being 'indoctrinated' and 'programmed' in YOUR right wing ideologies.

The hypocrisy of the right knows no bounds.

to be frank, De Santis strikes me as more of an opportunist then a true believer.

 

[dudalb]

Once again, I want some specific examples of the kind of teaching the Pro De Santis people here object to. Specfic items.not gliittering generalaties.
Yes, Historians on the left often take it to the other extrems...I am no fan of Howard Zinn....but I doubt that is what the Trumpers are really upset about.

 

[Lurch]

A little while ago I posted a link to a Pew poll showing what demagogues like DeSantis are actually afraid of.

High school or less: 47% Republican - 45% Democrat

Some college: 47% Democrat - 45% Republican

College graduates: 54% Democrat - 39% Republican

Postgraduates (people with Master's Degrees and Ph.D.s) 63% Democrat - 31% Republican.

When despots come to power one of the first tasks is to liquidate the intelligentsia.

 

[Stacyhs]

Here's a good example of right-wing "indoctrination" in Texas and FL public schools:

Texas schools are required to put up posters of the national motto 'In God We Trust,' but critics say the law imposes religion on children

Texas public schools will now be required to hang posters that display the national motto.
The law also requires that the posters have an American flag centered under the motto.
Opponents say the law "imposes religion" on students.


A new Texas law requires schools to hang posters of the national motto, "In God We Trust," in every building on their campuses, as long as the posters are donated.
The bill, SB 797, was passed last year by the Texas legislature and states that campuses must display "a durable poster or framed copy of the United States national motto" in a "conspicuous place in each building of the school or institution."

It also requires that each poster have an American flag "centered under the motto" as well as the state flag of Texas.

The law applies to both K-12 and higher education institutions.

State Rep. Tom Oliverson, one of the co-authors of the bill, told television station KHOU it was a "great opportunity" to display the national motto at schools.
Texas state Sen. Bryan Hughes, another co-author, celebrated the bill with a Twitter post on Tuesday, saying that the national motto "asserts our collective trust in a sovereign God."
Opponents of the law, however, told The Guardian that it imposes Christianity in public schools, which they say are meant to be secular institutions.

"Alone, they're a basic violation of the separation of church and state. But in the broader context, it's hard not to see them as part of the larger Christian nationalist project," Sophie Ellman-Golan, director of strategic communications at Jews for Racial & Economic Justice, told The Guardian.

Over the past few years, several other states, many in the south, have required or allowed schools to display signs, posters, or other insignia with the words, "In God We Trust," Forbes reported.

In 2018, following the Parkland shooting, Florida Gov. Rick Scott signed a bill similar to the Texas law that required schools to display the national motto in a "conspicuous place" in every building.
The Texas law comes as support for Christian nationalism — or the belief that Christianity is and should be intrinsically tied to American life and laws — grows on the right, including among GOP lawmakers.

Before our right-wing members claim that there's nothing wrong with displaying the national motto in schools, let's just skip this crappy go to excuse. This was not the national motto until 1956 when it was signed into law in the same Cold War hyper- patriotic/religious related fervor of McCarthyism that had added "under God" to the Pledge of Allegiance two years earlier.

We already have the flag hanging in classrooms and the Pledge being said but, apparently, that's just not good enough for these right-wingers who won't be happy until they've relegated separation of church and state to the dung heap of history and made the US into a Christian Nationalist country. But, according to the right-wing it's the left who are 'indoctrinating' and imposing their will" on schoolchildren.

 

[shuttlt]

This seems to be the perennial coming to blows of describing the world as it is, and describing how we think the world should be. If people disagree about morality, how, in this modern world that has left might makes right behind, do we decide who get's their way?

 

[JoeMorgue]

What does any of this have to do with anything?

 

[Upchurch]

Just a reminder, this thread is about DeSantis' rebranding of the Lost Cause mythology/propaganda into modern times. Not whether "might makes right" or if any one poster is a flaming hypocrite.

 

[sackett]

DeStinkass can push through all the dumbutt laws he wants, and they'll be shot down for gross unconstitutionality. Happens a lot in the funny south.

He doesn't mind at all, because his only desire is to claw together as much right wing support as he can. His ambition is to be Trumph Mark 2 in 2024.

And 2028 and 2032 and so on.

 

[JoeMorgue]

DeStinkass can push through all the dumbutt laws he wants, and they'll be shot down for gross unconstitutionality.

You sure of that these days?

 

[shuttlt]

You sure of that these days?

Which ever side is the stronger will find that they have the right to get their way.

 

[Stacyhs]

I think you need to look at the larger picture of liberal influence and its affects on educational curricula (particularly on social matters), which is what this really comes down to. The pushback is well-deserved and overdo, even if not ideally presented.

In a sense, liberals have created this scenario by their incessant need to push their beliefs and standards as policy of law, even down to programming our children.

Yep, it's those radical lefties "pushing their beliefs and standards as policy of law, even down to programming our children":

Republican Gov. Ron DeSantis is working to line up a slew of loyalists on school boards across Florida as he seeks a second term in the nation's third-largest state.
"We need help at the local level," DeSantis said at a firehouse to about 430 enthusiastic supporters during a campaign event on Sunday. "You guys with your power going out and voting is going to make a huge difference."

The governor has endorsed 29 conservative candidates ahead of Tuesday's election for school board races, which typically don't receive much attention and are technically nonpartisan.
School board members make decisions about spending, schedules, supplies, curriculum, and other matters. But in more than a dozen counties where DeSantis endorsed candidates, school boards defied the governor last fall by requiring students to wear masks.

Another curriculum area DeSantis bashed at his campaign rally was "critical race theory," which he defined as teaching "kids to hate our country and hate each other because of race." Republicans have used the term as a shorthand for race-based discussions and trainings that they say are tied to Marxism.

Formally, critical race theory examines racism in US institutions stemming from slavery and the Jim Crow era. Democrats have argued it's mostly taught in law schools and accuse politicians who favor bans of trying to whitewash history.

Governors rarely get involved in local school board elections, but DeSantis is pushing for the election of loyalists who support his conservative ideology. Open discussions are out; restrictions on what can be discussed are in. Teaching historical fact and reality is out; the sanitized, Hollywood version is in. But it's the left who are "programming our children".

 

[dudalb]

I see Warp12 has still not produced an solid detailed example of what they consider "biased" teaching.
Looking forward to he or she telling us what a wonderufl things Sand Creek and Wounded Knee were.

 

[sarge]

112 posts to AAH as off-topic, uncivil, or other various violations. Pity, as some of them might have made for interesting threads in their own right. Please stick to the thread topic or create a new thread.

Replying to this modbox in thread will be off topic  Posted By: sarge

 

[sackett]

La lutte perpétuelle

Which ever side is the stronger will find that they have the right to get their way.

And how, pray, are you defining strength?

If you reply, "Any way I choose to!" I won't be even one tiny bit surprised.

 

[ZiprHead]

Florida Swing Voters Aren’t Sold on DeSantis or Rubio

For months, the general consensus has been that in Florida’s two marquee midterm races—for governor and U.S. Senate—the Republican candidates are likely to prevail. But recent polling shows both races tighter than expected for Ron DeSantis and Marco Rubio. On August 9 we conducted focus groups with a dozen Trump-to-Biden voters and these people explained why they were open to replacing both incumbents.

Let’s start with the likely contest between DeSantis and former governor Charlie Crist. If the governor’s race in November is indeed DeSantis versus Crist, nine respondents said they would take Crist, two would take DeSantis, and one was undecided. Our swing voters described DeSantis as “power-hungry,” “petty,” “an opportunist,” “egotistical,” “anti-abortion,” and a “bull in a china shop.”

“[I didn’t like] the revenge politics with the Reedy Creek Improvement District,” explained B.J., 43, from Deland. “I’m a big Disney fan. That hit pretty close to home. There was just no point to it. It was just pure revenge politics. Also, I don’t agree with how he handled the Covid pandemic, like restricting local municipalities, not allowing them to enforce mask mandates and things like that. I think that was highly inappropriate.”


For months, the general consensus has been that in Florida’s two marquee midterm races—for governor and U.S. Senate—the Republican candidates are likely to prevail. But recent polling shows both races tighter than expected for Ron DeSantis and Marco Rubio. On August 9 we conducted focus groups with a dozen Trump-to-Biden voters and these people explained why they were open to replacing both incumbents.

Let’s start with the likely contest between DeSantis and former governor Charlie Crist. If the governor’s race in November is indeed DeSantis versus Crist, nine respondents said they would take Crist, two would take DeSantis, and one was undecided. Our swing voters described DeSantis as “power-hungry,” “petty,” “an opportunist,” “egotistical,” “anti-abortion,” and a “bull in a china shop.”

“[I didn’t like] the revenge politics with the Reedy Creek Improvement District,” explained B.J., 43, from Deland. “I’m a big Disney fan. That hit pretty close to home. There was just no point to it. It was just pure revenge politics. Also, I don’t agree with how he handled the Covid pandemic, like restricting local municipalities, not allowing them to enforce mask mandates and things like that. I think that was highly inappropriate.”

Lance, 27, from Orlando remarked, “I disagree with DeSantis on quite a few things . . . It’s purely just his stance on things. [I’m troubled that he’s] anti-abortion, primarily, anti-transgender—more the social issues.”

“[DeSantis is] petty. He’s all about keeping government out of business unless the business disagrees with him, and then it becomes personal,” said Thomas, 27, from Coral Gables.

“DeSantis is too much like Trump. . . . I don’t trust him,” commented Kim, 60, from St. Augustine.

Nik, 37, from Miami Shores, added, “If Crist can win in November here in Florida, then that puts DeSantis in a really bad spot in terms of trying to run for president in ’24.”

Much more in the link.

 

[shuttlt]

And how, pray, are you defining strength?

If you reply, "Any way I choose to!" I won't be even one tiny bit surprised.

In that case, you too have no understanding of realist thought. I don't know what else is to be said. It isn't an obscure or unknown world view. It has been written about in well known works for close to two and a half thousand years. It has been explained in this thread. It was taught to children for hundreds of years. It was the standard view of international relations for centuries .Yet, there is still post after post, like this one, that view it as a mysterious riddle.

 

[Warp12]

I see Warp12 has still not produced an solid detailed example of what they consider "biased" teaching.
Looking forward to he or she telling us what a wonderufl things Sand Creek and Wounded Knee were.

On the first point, there is no need to illustrate the obvious liberal bias in classrooms. If we each search our souls, we know we have experienced this firsthand in our education.

On the second point, clearly I am not permitted to address that in this thread. Maybe start a new one.

 

[Dr. Keith]

On the first point, there is no need to illustrate the obvious liberal bias in classrooms. If we each search our souls, we know we have experienced this firsthand in our education.

On the second point, clearly I am not permitted to address that in this thread. Maybe start a new one.

I never thought I would see you make the point that “reality has a liberal bias.” Well done.

 

[shuttlt]

I never thought I would see you make the point that “reality has a liberal bias.” Well done.

Just as in the Soviet Union it had a Communist bias, in Nazi Germany it had a Nazi bias and in ancien regime France it had a monarchist bias. How puzzling that time after time reality has a bias towards the ruling orthodoxy. Reality should make up it's mind.