Death Valley heat record may be invalidated

[Jrrarglblarg]

Stepping off a plane from Colorado to the south, pretty much year round, is like suddenly breathing through a used tube sock. There are certain days in the fall that remind me of Christmas in bootcamp, San Antonio. My wife, from NO, says the same thing, that crisp fall days remind her of Chrismas.

 

[Damien Evans]

Far too hot if you ask me. I can't deal with anything over 80°F and prefer 55 - 65°F. I don't wear a jacket outside until it's 40°F or under, unless it's raining. I don't know how people can exist in such heat. I was once in Athens when it was 110°F+ and it was like walking through the fires of Hell.

Never come to Australia in summer or the tropics ever in that case. The average in Melbourne in January and February is nearly 80 in your ridiculous scale, and the rest of the mainland considers our summers unusually cold.

 

[John Jones]

A family friend from New Orleans was baffled by the idea of hanging a washcloth on the edge of the sink to dry.

Was it the word 'wash' that confounded your friend?

 

[Jrrarglblarg]

Was it the word 'wash' that confounded your friend?

I'm unable to find any manner in which this question isn't offensive. I don't know what your preconceived notions are about New Orleans, as this question bears no relation to any experience I've had.

 

[Foolmewunz]

RH also has a great vs nasty effect on feeling cold. I have, because of my work, the rare privilege of comparing the extremes, having lived in two of the most humid populated areas: Hong Kong and New Orleans. A cold snap in Hong Kong will last about 7/10 days. It "goes down" to 10C(50F) and by about the third day, when the poured concrete and cinderblock underlayers have chilled through, it's like living in your refrigerator. With "low" RH (what they consider "not too uncomfortable" of about 75% in January, the cold just penetrates every cell of your body, it seems). I felt colder in Hong Kong, well above freezing than in Montreal. I've mentioned it before, but I have never been as miserable-cold in my life as in Hong Kong.

OTOH, when I was heading off to the driest place on earth, my buddy and coworker advised "Try to come during the rainy season. We get 15 mm of rain in January." For you Murkins, that's a little over half-an-inch... in a month. The rainy season. I'm speaking, of course, of the fabled Atacama Desert. Daily forecast "Sunny and Clear". Up at Chuquicamata it's just as dry but a couple of thousand meters up, and I've been at 0-5C/32-41F in a suit jacket and it was fine. You start to feel the cold after being out in it for about forty-five minutes, but it's absolutely pleasant compared to Hong Kong at 10/15 degrees warmer.

If Hong Kong had ever dropped to freezing? I would never have gotten out from under my duvet. Damp Cold might be more of an impact than Damp Hot, at least on the misery index.

On the hot/dry side, I also lived in Tulsa. Summer temps go over a hundred quite often, but very dry. We played tennis in the mid-afternoon summer sun. We were rather poor and could get the public courts only at those times. I don't recall every actually feeling "hot".

 

[jaydeehess]

I have experienced very cold, very dry conditions, and cold with high RH.

Weather station Mould Bay in the 80s I experienced as low as -47C with RH in the teens. Simply walking down a hallway indoors then reaching for the light switch you could see a 3-4 inch long static discharge to the screws holding the switchplate. I would make sure I touched each and every switchplate going down the hallway in order to not build up a large charge. (Felt like welding yourself to the wall)
Outside your breath would move out and down as the vapour froze to crystals.
Exposed skin would quickly get painful but if you had a hood mitts boots and proper long coat it felt fine. Comfortable even.

OTOH I also spent a very cold snap in Toronto. -35C is uncommon for that city and Lake Ontario did not freeze over fully. Humidity made this very very uncomfortable. I could not seem to get warm.

 

[Molinaro]

129 F is nuts. Not fit for humans at all. I keep my apartment at 12 C (53.6 F) year-round. And I almost never wear anything more than shorts and socks at home.

 

[jaydeehess]

On thread topic though; anecdotes about only 129 F mean nothing scientificically. It amounts only to personal incredulity that 134 can't be reached.
As for supposed proof in the weather records I have my own anedocte.

At Mould Bay the weather techs would regularily report light snow and ice crystals. These reports always came back with the Hdqtrs meteorologists saying that there were no conditions that could have both snow and ice crystals at the same time. "Pick one" and resubmit the report, they were told. Later though a memo went out to all stations that stated that it was now acceptable to report both. Seems a Ph.D meteorologist from headquaters happened to be in the high Arctic and witnessed the phenomena.

 

[jaydeehess]

Weirdly my home town has seen bith -40C and +40C in the same year

 

[Slowvehicle]

Not much to add, really, except I hiked across DV on my birthday, on a dare, one year...
(never said I was smart...)

 

[CynicalSkeptic]

I have lived in Florida, Houston, and Phoenix.

I much prefer the dry heat and higher temps of Phoenix (regularly over 110F in the summer) to the somewhat lower temps (rarely breaks 100) but higher humidity of Houston/Florida

 

[jaydeehess]

Probably the guy reading it exhaled on the thermometer. Those gauges are sensitive enough to record that sort of difference.

How many posts until someone points out that warm breath is far cooler than 129F?

Yeah, the real temp would have been 137 had he not breathed on it.

 

[Dr. Keith]

RH also has a great vs nasty effect on feeling cold.

Yep. I remember as a kid going to Colorado to ski and it being numerically quite cold and then coming back to Houston to a much milder temperature, but much higher humidity, and thinking they must use a different scale up in the mountains.

 

[Modified]

I'm unable to find any manner in which this question isn't offensive. I don't know what your preconceived notions are about New Orleans, as this question bears no relation to any experience I've had.

Have you been in the restaurant/bar bathrooms there?

 

[Red Baron Farms]

Seems a Ph.D meteorologist from headquaters happened to be in the high Arctic and witnessed the phenomena.

It can snow through fog too, which could be related.

 

[Elagabalus]

On thread topic though; anecdotes about only 129 F mean nothing scientificically. It amounts only to personal incredulity that 134 can't be reached...

That's my take on it as well. They also impugn poor old Oscar Denten's character. In the summary they say it's observational error but imply that was more observer malfeasance in the main text. I also noticed that he recorded 131 and 130

...Maximum temperatures for July 7-14, 1913, were: 127°, 128°, 129°, 134°, 129°, 130°, 131°, and 127°F respectively...

So he screwed up one day, measured correctly the next and then messed up the reading on the following two days?

 

[RedPillNeo]

I've been in Vegas in July when the temperature was 112 with 50mph winds... at midnight!

One interesting thing about Death Valley in the summer, according to locals: most of the tourists then are German. It's like something on the national bucket list, to experience that dry heat.

Last time I was there 16 years ago, the talk was about a missing family of three, whose rental van was found abandoned in a remote area with several flat tires. Only a few years ago, a hiker finally found their bodies where they set off overland, possibly toward the lights of Shoshone which is deceptively far away.

I camped in Butte Valley one late spring and took an afternoon hike up Manly Peak. Ended up at the top for sunset, walking down the sandy slope in the dark was like being on a down escalator. The next morning, I set off on the trail looking for my missing disposable camera. I intended to go only part way, carrying only one smallish bottle of water. Never found the camera, but ended up on the peak again near noon. On a North slope, there was a patch of dirty snow that probably saved my foolish life. I ate some and pushed some into my empty bottle and began the hike down. By the time I reached camp, I was blundering along, ready to pass out. I drank and laid on my bed for 2 hours before feeling mostly normal again.

 

[crescent]

One interesting thing about Death Valley in the summer, according to locals: most of the tourists then are German.

I lived there for five years, and got married about a year before I moved away - with my German wife.

Last time I was there 16 years ago, the talk was about a missing family of three, whose rental van was found abandoned in a remote area with several flat tires. Only a few years ago, a hiker finally found their bodies where they set off overland, possibly toward the lights of Shoshone which is deceptively far away.

They were found south, near the boundary with Ft. Irwin or China Lake (can't remember which). It is thought that they thought the military boundary would be patrolled, and thought that would be a way to get rescued. The boundary was not patrolled, barely even marked (pre-2001), there was no rescue there. They too were German.

ETA: They had kids with them, and they probably suffered terribly. It was an interesting local legend up until the remains were found. Until then, many people thought they had maybe faked their own disappearance and started over somewhere under assumed names. We imagined them drinking beer in Cancun, or in the south of France. That didn't happen. The Hunt for the Death Valley Germans

I camped in Butte Valley one late spring and took an afternoon hike up Manly Peak.

I used to love Butte Valley. If I had a better 4x4 that could carry my whole family safely, I would take the kids there. I usually stayed at the Geologist's cabin.

 

[jhunter1163]

I got out of an air conditioned car in the Nevada desert. It was like being hit in the face with something kinetic. I got back into the car with the aircon.

I went outside on the hottest day ever recorded in Connecticut (108 degrees with about 60% humidity). It was like that blast of hot air you get upon opening your car door after it's been sitting in the sun on a hot July day. Except that it didn't pass. I lasted about a minute and went back into the AC.

 

[RedPillNeo]

I used to love Butte Valley. If I had a better 4x4

Heh... I drove all the way from Panamint Valley, in an unmodified 2wd... two different times! Caused a Ranger driving the other way in a Hummer to stop and stare for a longish time, mouth agape, before intoning, "I never thought I'd see a Volvo Station Wagon in Butte Valley!"

Geologist's Cabin

I stayed there the first time, absolutely beautiful scenery, especially from the pit toilet round back. Best morning "business" ever! There were rodents running back and forth in the drop ceiling, and I made the mistake of hitting one of the panels as one ran by, only to hear a rain of thousands of droppings falling back onto the panel; sent visions of Hantavirus running through my head. Nearby is Stella's Cabin, the first parts of which were built by Mormon prospectors around 150 years ago!