Dear Mike (Michael Moore)
- Thread starter RandFan
- Start date
-
- Tags
- michael moore
Kitty Chan
Muse
- Joined
- May 14, 2004
- Messages
- 826
Mike Moore almost got me in a fight
Im on vacation in Vegas, enjoying the hot tub. My co tubber is interested Im from Canada. She asks me if I lock my doors, well yes I do.
Are you sure do your neighbours?
Well yea even my family does Actually I even have an alarm.
Well, is that common I heard that you guys dont lock your doors Im sure of it.
Well, occasionally Ive ran to the store and maybe didnt
But Im sure its more common
I said maybe in very small towns people may not
This conversation went on for almost 10 minutes like this.
Luckilly it was time to go I bid her goodnight assured her I locked my door and left figuring what brought that on??
Then I saw the last half of bowling, Thanks Michael Moore for spreading paranoia and misinformation. Im from there I lock my doors my friends and family lock their doors BUT she wont believe me because Michael said so.
Then I heard about the award. . . Id say I was surprised but not really.
Im on vacation in Vegas, enjoying the hot tub. My co tubber is interested Im from Canada. She asks me if I lock my doors, well yes I do.
Are you sure do your neighbours?
Well yea even my family does Actually I even have an alarm.
Well, is that common I heard that you guys dont lock your doors Im sure of it.
Well, occasionally Ive ran to the store and maybe didnt
But Im sure its more common
I said maybe in very small towns people may not
This conversation went on for almost 10 minutes like this.
Luckilly it was time to go I bid her goodnight assured her I locked my door and left figuring what brought that on??
Then I saw the last half of bowling, Thanks Michael Moore for spreading paranoia and misinformation. Im from there I lock my doors my friends and family lock their doors BUT she wont believe me because Michael said so.
Then I heard about the award. . . Id say I was surprised but not really.
No.RandFan said:
But I will give you this, RF:
"You agree RF that fatso conservatives like yourself are hateful bigoted bastards, and that's how you kill Iraqis."
What's the news about your trip to Iraq RF to find WMDs over there and prove a breach in 1441?
Any progress?
Kitty Chan
Muse
- Joined
- May 14, 2004
- Messages
- 826
Re: Re: Mike Moore almost got me in a fight
Bush didnt get me into a potential fight on vacation
I dont know Im sure Bush needs critics to keep him in line the absolute power thing. But Im more nervous that his current critics (not meaning you) are not of the right motives.
In other words they are only serving themselves not the truth or the people. That election looms. And I have never understood why the average person lets any politican away with negative campaiging.
I dont give a rip what one guy thinks the other guys is doing wrong.
The REAL question is what are they going to do? And the masses get sucked into not asking it every time.
One thing to consider is, the US was attacked. What did Russia do to the terrorists when that night club was attacked??
What would China or North Korea do? if 9/11 hit there. Much more than the States did. The terrorists are laughing their heads off with all the internal fighting of the Great Satan. A house divided. . . its great when the ememy fights your battles for you.
Ion said:
Bush didnt get me into a potential fight on vacation
I dont know Im sure Bush needs critics to keep him in line the absolute power thing. But Im more nervous that his current critics (not meaning you) are not of the right motives.
In other words they are only serving themselves not the truth or the people. That election looms. And I have never understood why the average person lets any politican away with negative campaiging.
I dont give a rip what one guy thinks the other guys is doing wrong.
The REAL question is what are they going to do? And the masses get sucked into not asking it every time.
One thing to consider is, the US was attacked. What did Russia do to the terrorists when that night club was attacked??
What would China or North Korea do? if 9/11 hit there. Much more than the States did. The terrorists are laughing their heads off with all the internal fighting of the Great Satan. A house divided. . . its great when the ememy fights your battles for you.
Re: Re: Re: Mike Moore almost got me in a fight
Just think how you cross the border, from Canada to U.S..
You have "...a potential fight on vacation..." like never before, at the border.
A bigger "...potential fight on vacation..." than your story about little fish Moore.
I know because I see it around me when I travel back and forth between Vancouver, Canada and San Diego, U.S., every year.
He does, he does...Kitty Chan said:
Just think how you cross the border, from Canada to U.S..
You have "...a potential fight on vacation..." like never before, at the border.
A bigger "...potential fight on vacation..." than your story about little fish Moore.
I know because I see it around me when I travel back and forth between Vancouver, Canada and San Diego, U.S., every year.
Kitty Chan
Muse
- Joined
- May 14, 2004
- Messages
- 826
Re: Re: Re: Re: Mike Moore almost got me in a fight
Not sure where your digging but I have 100% no problem with the US boarder guards. We go down alot too. even moved someone down there. They are tough but consistant, they have a job to do.
Now our guards are another story. You never know what your gonna get. They dont seem to know the difference between tough and being a jerk.
As for tightness at the boarder, thats not Bushes fault, its the card carrying members of terriorists that are if thats where your barking up. Taking advantage of our mutual societies that would rather people were allowed to think for themselves. Instead they want puppets that obey their every whim, then kill them for it.
If we were under Saddam first thing would be everyone on this board would be rounded up and hung in prison getting shocks to various parts until dead or just kept around for amusement and a example to other free thinkers. Free thinking, critical thinking, its gone forget about it.
Saddam was never going to change EVER no matter how long France or anyone waited. He had a plan and unless you bowed to him you were not included in that plan. You his people, family are only a means to a end to him.
I do remember one thing Bush said if you dont deal with Saddam now you will at some time deal with him. That I can take to the bank. Do you really think the world was just going to go on forever like it was? It changes continualy. If Saddam had captured Kuwait, then the rest of his neighbours do you think his people would come to America as human sheilds to protest him?????
Ion said:
Not sure where your digging but I have 100% no problem with the US boarder guards. We go down alot too. even moved someone down there. They are tough but consistant, they have a job to do.
Now our guards are another story. You never know what your gonna get. They dont seem to know the difference between tough and being a jerk.
As for tightness at the boarder, thats not Bushes fault, its the card carrying members of terriorists that are if thats where your barking up. Taking advantage of our mutual societies that would rather people were allowed to think for themselves. Instead they want puppets that obey their every whim, then kill them for it.
If we were under Saddam first thing would be everyone on this board would be rounded up and hung in prison getting shocks to various parts until dead or just kept around for amusement and a example to other free thinkers. Free thinking, critical thinking, its gone forget about it.
Saddam was never going to change EVER no matter how long France or anyone waited. He had a plan and unless you bowed to him you were not included in that plan. You his people, family are only a means to a end to him.
I do remember one thing Bush said if you dont deal with Saddam now you will at some time deal with him. That I can take to the bank. Do you really think the world was just going to go on forever like it was? It changes continualy. If Saddam had captured Kuwait, then the rest of his neighbours do you think his people would come to America as human sheilds to protest him?????
"I do remember one thing Bush said if you dont deal with Saddam now you will at some time deal with him. That I can take to the bank."
Bush and co said an awful lot of things about Saddam, so far most of them have proved to be ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊. I see no reason to think what he said above wasn`t ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ too.
Bush and co said an awful lot of things about Saddam, so far most of them have proved to be ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊. I see no reason to think what he said above wasn`t ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ too.
"Perhaps but Saddam's desires to dominate his corner of the world is demonstrable. I think it not difficult to come to the same conclusion as Bush. Saddam had a nasty habit of not giving up on those things he really wanted."
He might have had the desire to dominate (like many others), but I`m not so sure about the means.
Remember what Powell and Rice said...they seemed pretty confident, even explicit that Saddam had been "contained" by sanctions etc.
I think we need a bit more evidence, proper evidence, as to their threat if we want to go around invading sovereign countries.
He might have had the desire to dominate (like many others), but I`m not so sure about the means.
Remember what Powell and Rice said...they seemed pretty confident, even explicit that Saddam had been "contained" by sanctions etc.
I think we need a bit more evidence, proper evidence, as to their threat if we want to go around invading sovereign countries.
Kitty Chan
Muse
- Joined
- May 14, 2004
- Messages
- 826
demon said:
Ask Kuwait if he was "contained" . . .
Question He received awards for all his work in childcare etc in Iraq, correct. Why other than to pump up his image with everyone did he decide to "help" the children.???
"Ask Kuwait if he was "contained" . ."
I think you need to revise your Iraq chronology some.
The US and the UK had no wish to "contain" Saddam in the 80s and assisted him in his "plan" as you call it with their supplies of some rather nasty things. He was free to do what he wanted then and the invasion of Kuwait was the cullmination of that.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
US SUPPLIES
===========
"The CDC [Center for Disease Control] and a biological-sample company, the American Type Culture Collection, sent strains of all the germs Iraq used to make weapons, including anthrax, the bacteria that make botulinum toxin, and the germs that cause gas gangrene, the records show. Iraq also got samples of other deadly pathogens, including West Nile virus.
The transfers came in the 1980s, when the United States backed Iraq in its war against Iran. They were detailed in a 1994 Senate Banking Committee report and a 1995 follow-up letter from the CDC to the Senate."
Iraq got germs for weapons program from U.S. in '80s
The CDC and a biological-sample firm sent strains of anthrax and more, government records show.
By Matt Kelley
Associated Press
http://www.philly.com/mld/philly/news/nation/4185241.htm.
"The US provided less conventional military equipment than British or German companies but it did allow the export of biological agents, including anthrax; vital ingredients for chemical weapons; and cluster bombs sold by a CIA front organisation in Chile, the report says.
A 1994 congressional inquiry also found that dozens of biological
agents, including various strains of anthrax, had been shipped to Iraq by US companies, under licence from the commerce department.
Furthermore, in 1988, the Dow Chemical company sold $1.5m-worth (£930,000) of pesticides to Iraq despite suspicions they would be used for chemical warfare."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,866942,00.html
"We found that pathogenic, which means disease-producing items, and toxigenic, meaning poisonous items, and other hazardous materials were exported from the United States to Iraq following a licensing and application procedure actually set forth by our own United States Department of Commerce.
That meant our own Government had to approve the shipment of these materials and obviously did so - approving the shipment of these items to Iraq before the war started.
Now, we further learned by talking to the suppliers that these
exported biological materials were not weakened when they were shipped over there. In other words, many were full pathogens capable of being reproduced by Iraq once they got there. Between the years of 1985 and 1989, the United States Government approved the sales of quantities of potentially lethal biological agents that could have been cultured and grown in very large quantities in an Iraqi biological warfare
program."
Congressional Record (Senate) February 9, 1994
Mr Riegle - U.S. Senator Chair, Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs Washington, DC
http://www.svsu.edu/~boles/index/iraq/ussuppliesiraqgas.htm
"When United Nations weapons inspectors were allowed into Iraq after the 1991 Gulf War, they compiled long lists of chemicals, missile components, and computers from American suppliers, including such household names as Union Carbide and Honeywell, which were being used for military purposes.
A 1994 investigation by the Senate Banking Committee turned up dozens of biological agents shipped to Iraq during the mid-'80s under license from the Commerce Department, including various strains of anthrax, subsequently identified by the Pentagon as a key component of the Iraqi biological warfare program. The Commerce Department also approved the export of insecticides to Iraq, despite widespread suspicions that they were being used for chemical warfare.
Although U.S. export controls to Iraq were tightened up in the late
1980s, there were still many loopholes. In December 1988, Dow Chemical sold $1.5 million of pesticides to Iraq, despite U.S. government concerns that they could be used as chemical warfare agents. An Export-Import Bank official reported in a memorandum that he could find "no reason" to stop the sale, despite evidence that the pesticides were "highly toxic" to humans and would cause death "from asphyxiation."
U.S. Had Key Role in Iraq Buildup
Trade in Chemical Arms Allowed Despite Their Use on Iranians, Kurds
By Michael Dobbs
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, December 30, 2002
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/w...e&node=&contentId=A52241-2002Dec29¬Found=true
"Fresh details about how America helped to supply Iraq with weapons during the 1980s have emerged with the release of declassified documents from the period."
America helped Iraq to acquire chemical weapons
By Toby Harnden
Daily Telegraph 31/12/2002
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/12/31/wirq31.xml
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anyway, some "plan": put in 30 odd years of loyal service for the US, then get greedy (or complacent) and then sit around in a shattered country with no armed forces worth speaking of, periodically getting bombed by your former bosses. What an inspiration to dictators everywhere.
Bet he dearly missed the Rummie "Saddam, I f@*kin` love ya man!" days of the 80s.
I think you need to revise your Iraq chronology some.
The US and the UK had no wish to "contain" Saddam in the 80s and assisted him in his "plan" as you call it with their supplies of some rather nasty things. He was free to do what he wanted then and the invasion of Kuwait was the cullmination of that.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
US SUPPLIES
===========
"The CDC [Center for Disease Control] and a biological-sample company, the American Type Culture Collection, sent strains of all the germs Iraq used to make weapons, including anthrax, the bacteria that make botulinum toxin, and the germs that cause gas gangrene, the records show. Iraq also got samples of other deadly pathogens, including West Nile virus.
The transfers came in the 1980s, when the United States backed Iraq in its war against Iran. They were detailed in a 1994 Senate Banking Committee report and a 1995 follow-up letter from the CDC to the Senate."
Iraq got germs for weapons program from U.S. in '80s
The CDC and a biological-sample firm sent strains of anthrax and more, government records show.
By Matt Kelley
Associated Press
http://www.philly.com/mld/philly/news/nation/4185241.htm.
"The US provided less conventional military equipment than British or German companies but it did allow the export of biological agents, including anthrax; vital ingredients for chemical weapons; and cluster bombs sold by a CIA front organisation in Chile, the report says.
A 1994 congressional inquiry also found that dozens of biological
agents, including various strains of anthrax, had been shipped to Iraq by US companies, under licence from the commerce department.
Furthermore, in 1988, the Dow Chemical company sold $1.5m-worth (£930,000) of pesticides to Iraq despite suspicions they would be used for chemical warfare."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,866942,00.html
"We found that pathogenic, which means disease-producing items, and toxigenic, meaning poisonous items, and other hazardous materials were exported from the United States to Iraq following a licensing and application procedure actually set forth by our own United States Department of Commerce.
That meant our own Government had to approve the shipment of these materials and obviously did so - approving the shipment of these items to Iraq before the war started.
Now, we further learned by talking to the suppliers that these
exported biological materials were not weakened when they were shipped over there. In other words, many were full pathogens capable of being reproduced by Iraq once they got there. Between the years of 1985 and 1989, the United States Government approved the sales of quantities of potentially lethal biological agents that could have been cultured and grown in very large quantities in an Iraqi biological warfare
program."
Congressional Record (Senate) February 9, 1994
Mr Riegle - U.S. Senator Chair, Committee on Banking, Housing, and Urban Affairs Washington, DC
http://www.svsu.edu/~boles/index/iraq/ussuppliesiraqgas.htm
"When United Nations weapons inspectors were allowed into Iraq after the 1991 Gulf War, they compiled long lists of chemicals, missile components, and computers from American suppliers, including such household names as Union Carbide and Honeywell, which were being used for military purposes.
A 1994 investigation by the Senate Banking Committee turned up dozens of biological agents shipped to Iraq during the mid-'80s under license from the Commerce Department, including various strains of anthrax, subsequently identified by the Pentagon as a key component of the Iraqi biological warfare program. The Commerce Department also approved the export of insecticides to Iraq, despite widespread suspicions that they were being used for chemical warfare.
Although U.S. export controls to Iraq were tightened up in the late
1980s, there were still many loopholes. In December 1988, Dow Chemical sold $1.5 million of pesticides to Iraq, despite U.S. government concerns that they could be used as chemical warfare agents. An Export-Import Bank official reported in a memorandum that he could find "no reason" to stop the sale, despite evidence that the pesticides were "highly toxic" to humans and would cause death "from asphyxiation."
U.S. Had Key Role in Iraq Buildup
Trade in Chemical Arms Allowed Despite Their Use on Iranians, Kurds
By Michael Dobbs
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, December 30, 2002
http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/w...e&node=&contentId=A52241-2002Dec29¬Found=true
"Fresh details about how America helped to supply Iraq with weapons during the 1980s have emerged with the release of declassified documents from the period."
America helped Iraq to acquire chemical weapons
By Toby Harnden
Daily Telegraph 31/12/2002
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2002/12/31/wirq31.xml
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Anyway, some "plan": put in 30 odd years of loyal service for the US, then get greedy (or complacent) and then sit around in a shattered country with no armed forces worth speaking of, periodically getting bombed by your former bosses. What an inspiration to dictators everywhere.
Bet he dearly missed the Rummie "Saddam, I f@*kin` love ya man!" days of the 80s.
Re: Mike Moore almost got me in a fight
You are naive to post these ramblings:
You need to amend your:
"...Thanks Bush for spreading paranoia and misinformation..."
Under Bush there are two versions of the same report on Iraq's WMDs.
http://www.seattletimes.nwsource.co...ntelside10.html
The classified version is here:
................................................
"... the Director, Intelligence, Survelliance and Reconnaissance, US Air Force DOES NOT AGREE that Iraq is developing UAV's primarily intended to be delivery platforms for chemical and biological warfare (CBW) agents. The small size of Iraq's new UAV strongly suggests a primary role of reconnaissance, although CBW delivery is an inherent capability..."
The public version is here:
..........................................
"... Baghdad's UAV's - especially if used for delivery of chemical and biological warfare (CBW) agents - could threaten Iraq's neighbors, US forces in the Persian Guls, and then United States if grought close to, or into the US homeland ..."
Here is further omitted information that shows Bush lying:
"...The activities we have detected do not, however, add up to a COMPELLING case that Iraq is currently pursuing what INR (State Department's Bureau of Intelligence and Research) would consider to be an integrated and comprehensive approach to acquide nuclear weapons. Iraq may be doing so, but INR considers the available evidence inadequate to support such a judgment..."
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/ht...2_intel100.html
Bush lied in 2003 when claiming that WMDs existed in Iraq in his State of the Union address, since in his speech in Ohio -months before that- CIA's Tenent had this very language removed.
Rumsfeld -under Bush- lied in 2003 when he said he "...absolutely..." knew Iraq had WMDs, and exactly where they were.
Their claims are in contrast with the knowledge that Bush had, since Powell commented this on Feb 24, 2001:
(when Powell met with the Egyptian Foreign Minister to discuss the santions working on Iraq)
"...(Saddam Hussein) has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors..."
Chan,
...............
Bush killing in Iraq thousands of innocents for his oil for blood adventure that turns tragic,
beats your little puny:
You are naive to post these ramblings:
while not seeing around you and not thinking much.Kitty Chan said:
You need to amend your:
into:Kitty Chan said:
"...Thanks Bush for spreading paranoia and misinformation..."
Under Bush there are two versions of the same report on Iraq's WMDs.
http://www.seattletimes.nwsource.co...ntelside10.html
The classified version is here:
................................................
"... the Director, Intelligence, Survelliance and Reconnaissance, US Air Force DOES NOT AGREE that Iraq is developing UAV's primarily intended to be delivery platforms for chemical and biological warfare (CBW) agents. The small size of Iraq's new UAV strongly suggests a primary role of reconnaissance, although CBW delivery is an inherent capability..."
The public version is here:
..........................................
"... Baghdad's UAV's - especially if used for delivery of chemical and biological warfare (CBW) agents - could threaten Iraq's neighbors, US forces in the Persian Guls, and then United States if grought close to, or into the US homeland ..."
Here is further omitted information that shows Bush lying:
"...The activities we have detected do not, however, add up to a COMPELLING case that Iraq is currently pursuing what INR (State Department's Bureau of Intelligence and Research) would consider to be an integrated and comprehensive approach to acquide nuclear weapons. Iraq may be doing so, but INR considers the available evidence inadequate to support such a judgment..."
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/ht...2_intel100.html
Bush lied in 2003 when claiming that WMDs existed in Iraq in his State of the Union address, since in his speech in Ohio -months before that- CIA's Tenent had this very language removed.
Rumsfeld -under Bush- lied in 2003 when he said he "...absolutely..." knew Iraq had WMDs, and exactly where they were.
Their claims are in contrast with the knowledge that Bush had, since Powell commented this on Feb 24, 2001:
(when Powell met with the Egyptian Foreign Minister to discuss the santions working on Iraq)
"...(Saddam Hussein) has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors..."
Chan,
...............
Bush killing in Iraq thousands of innocents for his oil for blood adventure that turns tragic,
beats your little puny:
Kitty Chan said:
Kitty Chan
Muse
- Joined
- May 14, 2004
- Messages
- 826
Kitty Chan said:
I guess I was being too vague about the contained part. I was thinking about how one would think they could contain Saddam. Sorry about that.
I am still wondering if there is a answer to the children thing.
Kitty Chan
Muse
- Joined
- May 14, 2004
- Messages
- 826
How is it paranoia and misinformation that I have no problems with the US boarder guards??
Are you saying that if we were under Saddam he would let these boards continue??
The reason Bush said if you dont deal with Saddam now you will later is because Saddam had and probably still has plans and is pretty admamant about them. How is that wrong its just a fact.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Problem is I see and think too much, I listen to many sources not just the ones I agree with. I watched Michael Moore to see what he said. But my point still stands; I LIVE WHERE he says I dont lock my doors and I DO
But that lady lacks any thinking on her own as she is woo wooed by him to the point that she believes him who ran around a neighbourhood one afternoon to one that actually is knows. Even one of my friends whom is a fan of Michael said that alot of his stuff seemed slanted especially from a Canadian point of view.
Are you saying that if we were under Saddam he would let these boards continue??
The reason Bush said if you dont deal with Saddam now you will later is because Saddam had and probably still has plans and is pretty admamant about them. How is that wrong its just a fact.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Problem is I see and think too much, I listen to many sources not just the ones I agree with. I watched Michael Moore to see what he said. But my point still stands; I LIVE WHERE he says I dont lock my doors and I DO
But that lady lacks any thinking on her own as she is woo wooed by him to the point that she believes him who ran around a neighbourhood one afternoon to one that actually is knows. Even one of my friends whom is a fan of Michael said that alot of his stuff seemed slanted especially from a Canadian point of view.
The plans that Saddam had was to trade Iraq's oil for Euros.Kitty Chan said:
The plans that Bush has is to control and trade Iraq's oil for dollars.
Bush's first decision after invading Iraq and taking control of oil, was to switch to dollars.
Bush doesn't give a damn about human rights, because he supports a dictator equal to Saddam in Uzbekistan.
The losers in this Bush's game are the Iraqi people.
Your ten minutes of discussing Moore in a hotub, are peanuts.
Forget that.
Kitty Chan
Muse
- Joined
- May 14, 2004
- Messages
- 826
I guess its insignaficant that for once in many years the Iraqi people actually may get a chance to decide how to run things. It may not happen quick enough for the critics, nothing ever is good enough for them, but its just a little bit of a challange to meet all the needs and demands of a government over there.
The problem you say about Bush is easily solved. Release Saddam back and let him get into power again, Then all will be fine again, right. Send him a bunch of money and apologise to the people for disrupting them, they can go back to their prisons anytime. Saddam has to rebuild the palaces dont you know.
Re the other post what about the children and Saddam any ideas?
Also, when the troops went into the palaces, I believe there was not much left to find. There was so much stuff in those palaces, I wonder where it all went??
BTW I rather enjoyed my hot tub (not ten minutes either) and was not put out as you infer. And that was not the point. I was at a loss for words over her refusal to believe, shall we say "eye" witness for the "report" of Mr Moore.
The problem you say about Bush is easily solved. Release Saddam back and let him get into power again, Then all will be fine again, right. Send him a bunch of money and apologise to the people for disrupting them, they can go back to their prisons anytime. Saddam has to rebuild the palaces dont you know.
Re the other post what about the children and Saddam any ideas?
Also, when the troops went into the palaces, I believe there was not much left to find. There was so much stuff in those palaces, I wonder where it all went??
BTW I rather enjoyed my hot tub (not ten minutes either) and was not put out as you infer. And that was not the point. I was at a loss for words over her refusal to believe, shall we say "eye" witness for the "report" of Mr Moore.