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Dancing in public while black

quadraginta said:
If he wasn't arrested how could he be resisting arrest?
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Read responses in this thread after my post and you’ll get your answer.
My post was exasperated rhetorical, but, this is exactly what US police do.
Charge a person with resisting without actually arresting a person. As happened in this case.
 
Mr. Watkins was not under arrest but he WAS being detained, as the police clearly enunciated; a state where the police are attempting to ascertain whether a crime has been committed. The subject is not free to leave while being detained. From the officers' statements, it seems that they were under the impression that he was walking away while being detained. That is, legally speaking, resisting arrest, even if no true arrest ultimately takes place.

(The problem from the police standpoint, is that the police still need to to have "reasonable suspicion" of a crime to detain someone; and a 911 call about someone dancing - which isn't a crime - isn't going to be reasonable suspicion. By itself)
 
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REsisting arrest is a perfect charge, elegant and compact, because all you have to do is presume even that it might happen, and not tell the person, and presto changeo! He's done it.
 
cullennz said:
They got a call from some concerned citizen.

Personally have no issue with a couple of cops turning up to check it out, as if it happened to be an armed nutter in the street, people would be blaming them for not being vigilant if they didn't.

Then it turns into amateur hour from the cops and they don't even seem to care to check what the circumstances are.

Maybe they are just overhyped because of the protests. Or they could just be **** at their jobs.
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The problem with a call like that starts with dispatch:

"What is he doing ma'm that is suspicious?

I imagine the answer would be: "He's acting crazy."

Acting crazy how? Is he harming anyone or damaging property? Does he have a weapon?"

This is the age of city cops having a computer in every car. Dispatch could have given the responding cops more details.

And even if all they had to go on was 'acting crazy' there is no need for every officer in the country to start with an accusatory attitude when they arrive on the scene. But that's what they do. They've done it to me and I'm white.


I called the cops because a man at the park pushed my young son to the ground and ripped his foam sword away. I asked him why did he do that to my son and he claimed my son hit his son with the sword.

I didn't see it. I certainly didn't see a crying kid that had been hit. We retreated to the picnic table, I ignored the fact the man kept the sword but I did call the police because I thought the guy was dangerous.

When the police came they immediately started in on me, asking if I was a bitch essentially. Moms at parks are all bitches you know. :rolleyes:

It wasn't until other people watching the whole scene came up to the table to tell the cops they had witnessed the event and they were also upset that a man would push child down like that. I think my son was 4, certainly not older.

Only then did the cops go talk to the man and eventually asked him to leave the park. I felt sorry for his kid and wife that shuffled off with him, heads down, because I was sure this man was a domestic abuser.
 
Darat said:
And thankfully our courts have pretty much shutdown abuse of that by the police. The courts told the police that the likes of swearing at a police offcier, shouting at one and so on (when not in the commision of an offence) is not an offence in itself and the police need to grow up!
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The police here not only need to hear that message, they need role-play training until they figure it out.
 
Lplus said:
What I'm getting from these is that you all feel you should be able to tell a cop to get lost if you think he's asking for more than the information you think he has a right to ask for - and he should put up and shut up because he's got a gun and "powers".

Really?

So much for the principle of treating others in the manner you would want them to treat you.
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How many times do you need to kiss a cop's ass for needless harassment before you stop taking it and refuse to be belittled one more time?

I am empathetic with blacks reacting to cops asking for ID, step out of the car, you're going to be searched, all without saying what the problem was.

Cops don't need to act that way and it starts with them, not with the guy who's been stopped and asked for ID like he/she was a criminal.
 
PhantomWolf said:
Mostly this depends on your State. In general if you are not driving then you only need to give your name and address. Some States might require ID or more identifying information. If you are driving then Licence, Registration, and Insurance can be asked for. It's usually best to check what the local State law requires.

Anything beyond these require the Officer to have a reasonable suspicion of a crime having been committed, and they must be able to articulate that suspicion. If they can articulate a reasonable suspicion of a crime then they do have the ability to detain you and question you further about your activities.

One thing that Freemen on the Land do get right is that if you have been stopped by a cop and you don't wish to cooperate voluntarily you can ask if you are being detained, and if they say yes, then you can ask them what crime they believe has been committed for them to do so. If they can't tell you, then they cannot detain you.

If they arrest you then they must explain why they are arresting you, what law you have broken for the arrest to occur, through there are a few exceptions such as it not be viable to do so at the time, of the breaking of the law was obvious (e.g. you just shot someone in front of the cop.)

Final bits of advice:

* Unless they have a warrant or have arrested you, the answer to "Can I check your pockets/phone/bag/car?" is always "No."
* The answer to "Do you know why I stopped you?" or "Do you know how fast you were going?" is always, "No I don't officer, please tell me."

* The answer to "We want to ask you some questions..." is always "I want a lawyer."
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Trouble with that is they then threaten to take you to jail and sadly, they don't need charges to do that.
 
Lplus said:
And I don't think anyone should have to shrug it off, because I don't think it should happen in the first place. Still - turn the other cheek eh?
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When your job is being a cop, it is your job.

Nurses, for example, try not to take verbally abusive patients personally. It's their job. You don't walk out of the patient's room and say you won't provide medical care to the person.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
When your job is being a cop, it is your job.

Nurses, for example, try not to take verbally abusive patients personally. It's their job. You don't walk out of the patient's room and say you won't provide medical care to the person.
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Even minimum wage slaves working customer service are expected to smile and be accommodating when faced with a customer being a jerk.

Cops are here neither to serve nor protect the public. They have transitioned to serving statistics and protecting themselves while treating the community as the enemy.
 
Skeptic Ginger said:
When your job is being a cop, it is your job.

Nurses, for example, try not to take verbally abusive patients personally. It's their job. You don't walk out of the patient's room and say you won't provide medical care to the person.
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Isn't it odd that mail carriers and utility workers manage to work in the residential community without leaving behind a trail of dead dogs? Cops still haven't figured it out.
 
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