Cult Archaeology

Bluegill said:
I have a question. Last year I heard a story on NPR about a discovery off the coast of Cuba. In thousands of feet of water, researchers using sensing equipment (sonar, I guess) picked up very intriguing shapes on the ocean floor. It looked for all the world like cut stone blocks arranged in regular (and apparently non-natural) patterns.

Quite a few scientists who had seen the data said that it really looked like underwater ruins of some sort, but it was miles off the coast and in deep water. There were two theories:

1) The features were natural, just unusual

2) the features were man-made from thousands of years ago, but some unknown geological activity had sunk them.

The scientists interviewed seemed keenly interested in researching it before the "cult archaeologists" could start messing around. But the depth of the water makes is hard to get to--I think there was going to be some kind of research expedition this year.

Does anyone else know what I'm talking about, and have they heard any more news on it?

Well, first of all, you needn't worry too much about the cult archaeologists getting their first; the site is in Cuban waters, and even the scientists who discovered the thing couldn't follow through on a trip planned for July because of permit problems.

There's a whispered rumor that National Geographic will be taking a trip to Cuba next year, and is somewhat interested in the site. Until then, nobody knows anything. This is still a very fresh find, so be patient - I'm as eager to hear about it as you are!
 
LCBOY said:

A question. Wasn't there another city near Vesuvuis, I believe on the other side of Vesuvius. If so, why did Pompeii get remembered and not the other city? I remember watching a History channel episode many years ago on the Eruption of Vesuvius and they spoke of a second city, I think. It was a long time ago and my memory may be faulty.

The second city you dimly remember may be Misenum. At this point, I'm unaware of any other city.
 
LCBOY said:


I have a question about the Library at Alexanderia. It supposed held vast amounts of wrtitings that held knowledge from across the known world. I don't mean knowledge of aliens or Atlantis (I don't beleive in that) but knowlwdge in science, mathmatics, medicine, philosophy, poetry, etc. As it was expaline dto me by a friend the caretakers of the Library would meet people visiting Alexanderia and copy everything that they had in written form.b It's destruction meant ther loss of tremendous amount of knowledge. Is this true?

The destruction of the library and most everything in it was a tremendous loss. Most of the loss was in the form of historical accounts - scrolls and papyri, that could help us understand more about ancient cultures. I'm not so sure a lot of scientific knowledge was lost, however - it seems unlikely to me that the only copies of this or that modern (for the time) scientific text would be placed in the library. Of course, since it's all gone, there's really no telling what was in fact lost.
 
Re: The Sumerians

RichardR said:
Joshua:

I believe that Sitchin was supposed to have translated the ancient Sumerian texts, and (according to him), they show that humans are descended from aliens. It’s connected with this Planet X / 12th planet stuff.

For those unfamiliar...Sitchin wrote a book called The 12th Planet, in which he describes his interpretations of some Sumerian texts which talk about the creation of the world. He says that references to various gods and mythic places are in fact references to planets - 12 in all, with the Sun counting as the first, and earth's moon counting as a fifth planet.

According to Sitchin, the texts describe a large celestial event in which Nibiru, a sacred city often referred to, was actually a wandering planet that got caught by the sun's gravity. Spiraling in toward the sun, Nibiru passed Neptune, whose own gravity altered Nibiru's course and caused a bulge to appear in the planet's side. Upon passing Uranus, this bulge was ripped open, pieces of it becoming Uranus' moons. Nibiru then passed a planet between Saturn and Uranus, but it was a small one - Nibiru's gravity flung it out beyond Neptune, where it became Pluto. Nibiru continued on, passing Saturn and Jupiter without incident. It came to one special planet between Jupiter and Mars. Nibiru's gravity seriously damaged this planet in passing. Nibiru continued its voyage around the sun and back out into space, returning a couple thousand years later to rip the planet apart completely, with half of it becoming the asteroid belt, and the other half being thrown past Mars and becoming Earth. Nibiru's own moon got caught by this new planet and became its Moon. Nibiru was scheduled to return earlier this month...but of course it didn't, because this interplanetary ping-pong match didn't really happen.

RichardR said:
I presume that archeology has its respected peer-reviewed journals that would publish the details of any such translations. I had a couple of questions about that:

What are the titles of such peer reviewed journals?

I'm afraid I couldn't tell you. Several European universities have their own Sumerology departments; any translations would probably be published in those universities' bulletins.

RichardR said:
Did Sitchin or anybody else publish details of any translations that support the ancient astronaut theories? If so where, and what was the feedback from the archeological community?

(Or did he just publish his books?)

If you read the texts Sitchin used, you'd be hardpressed to find any planetary references. I can't find any mention anywhere of any orthodox Sumerologists trying to answer his theories - I believe they all decided it was best not to try after Sitchin announced that he was a Sumerian whose job was to prepare the Earth for the next coming of Nibiru.

RichardR said:
Has any scholar of Sumerian culture ever published any comments about Sitchin’s theories?

No, but lay persons have made comparisons. For example, Sitchin takes the word shem, as it appears in the texts, to mean "sky chamber" (which he interprets as meaning "starship"). Orthodox Sumerologists take shem to mean "name" in the context of "reputation". Similarly, he misinterprets the term anunnaki as "they which have come down to earth from above", but Sumerologists have translated the word as "descendants of the ruler". This sort of twisting of definitions can be found in many crack works, including, notably, those of Von Daniken.

RichardR said:
What other views are there on these old texts, and what is the best places to read about them?

As a matter of fact, you can read many translated and transliterated texts here. The specific accounts of creation Sitchin claims are an account of the solar demoliton derby described above can be found here and here.
 
I vote that we get Hal to make this thread "sticky", there's an amazing amount of information in it.

Can you recommend some resources on the Amazon tribes (the real ones, not the ones of legend)? I'm aware that there is some archeological evidence that aggressive, largely female tribes existed in the region and that the archeological evidence discounts many of the Amazonian legends, but I'm not sure where to look for further factual information.
 
LCBOY said:

A question. Wasn't there another city near Vesuvuis, I believe on the other side of Vesuvius. If so, why did Pompeii get remembered and not the other city? I remember watching a History channel episode many years ago on the Eruption of Vesuvius and they spoke of a second city, I think. It was a long time ago and my memory may be faulty.

Herculaneum, which also was destroyed.
 
Joshua Korosi said:


Well, first of all, you needn't worry too much about the cult archaeologists getting their first; the site is in Cuban waters, and even the scientists who discovered the thing couldn't follow through on a trip planned for July because of permit problems.

There's a whispered rumor that National Geographic will be taking a trip to Cuba next year, and is somewhat interested in the site. Until then, nobody knows anything. This is still a very fresh find, so be patient - I'm as eager to hear about it as you are!

I wait three months for an answer, and this is what I get?
:)
Thanks for responding. From what I remember about the story on NPR, it sounded very interesting. I hope National Geographic goes for it. I can wait a year. Delayed gratification is character building.
 
It might not be much of a consolation, but other supposed antedeluvian architechture has turned out to be natural in nature.

Do a google for "Yonaguni" and dig around for some that claim it's natural.. the science is more solid that on the woo woo sites that claim it's antedeluvian.
 
reprise said:
I vote that we get Hal to make this thread "sticky", there's an amazing amount of information in it.

Can you recommend some resources on the Amazon tribes (the real ones, not the ones of legend)? I'm aware that there is some archeological evidence that aggressive, largely female tribes existed in the region and that the archeological evidence discounts many of the Amazonian legends, but I'm not sure where to look for further factual information.

The Amazons, up till now, were considered part of ancient Greek mythology - a tribe of warrior women who roamed about Asia Minor. But don't count them out yet...I've found a very good page about them here that I think you'll be interested in.
 
Very interesting site Joshua,

I have read a couple of books on Atlantis a few years back, but found them very conflicting. They each purported Atlantis to be in different places.
1. Mediterranean near Greece
2. Off South American coast in the Atlantic

But then I read mentioned that it was in the Pacific Ocean.

Which do you feel is the correct location. Several of the artifacts supposedly turned up in Egypt, which seems to bear out the area as being in the Mediterranean.

In that case why was it called Atlantis ?

Do you have any books to recommend reading on the matter or can you direct me to sites on the web for me to investigate please ?

Thanks
Freda
 
Freda said:
Very interesting site Joshua,

I have read a couple of books on Atlantis a few years back, but found them very conflicting. They each purported Atlantis to be in different places.
1. Mediterranean near Greece
2. Off South American coast in the Atlantic

But then I read mentioned that it was in the Pacific Ocean.

Which do you feel is the correct location. Several of the artifacts supposedly turned up in Egypt, which seems to bear out the area as being in the Mediterranean.

In that case why was it called Atlantis ?

Do you have any books to recommend reading on the matter or can you direct me to sites on the web for me to investigate please ?

Thanks
Freda

My personal stance regarding Atlantis is that it didn't exist...at least not as such. The sources for the story of Atlantis (Plato's dialogues Critias and Timaeus) give very specific information about the era, location, size, and method of destruction of Atlantis; and although there are many people who claim that this or that site is the "real" Atlantis, there isn't a single proposed site in the entire world that meets the criteria as given by Plato. Of course, if Atlantis is fiction, it may have any number of inspirational sources - some say that Atlantis is based on the destruction of the island of Thera by the Santorini volcano. I don't share this belief, as neither of Plato's dialogues mentions volcanic-related phenomena as contributing to the island's destruction. But that's just me.

To understand my argument better, please read the opening post in this thread. It's a somewhat more detailed treatment.
 
Since this is no longer the "Politics, History, and Current Events" forum, I think this thread ought to be moved to the proper place. Admins?
 
Supercharts said:
I understand that ancient people ate with their hands. I understand that toilet paper is a recent invention. What's that all about then? :confused:

That's why we don't shake hands with our left hand, that's the one you use to wash your *ahem* backside. :D
 
Drat it. Forgot to ask my question.

How about those 500,000 year old spark plugs that were found in California?
 
1) How did the guy build the Crystal Palace?
2) Explain the Bimini Road.
3) Where is Atlantis?
4) Why are there no remnants of the Saurian civilization?
5) Where are the huge bits of the moon from when it rammed into the earth?
6) What is contained in the Hall of Records under the Sphinx?
7) Where are the records of the aliens who helped Egyptians build the Pyramids?
8) Where are the records of Atlanteans, specifically regarding pyramids, aliens, crystals, zero-point technology and submerged artifacts?
9) Have you ever visited this site, the source of most of my questions?
www.atlantisrising.com

If you like cult archaeology, this site will be like your Paradise.
 
peptoabysmal said:
Drat it. Forgot to ask my question.

How about those 500,000 year old spark plugs that were found in California?

This would be the "Coso Artifact", found by some geology fans who were gathering mineral samples to sell at their shop. One of the enthusiasts was cutting through a suspected geode when he found that it wasn't a geode, but a stone which contained the remains of a material like porcelain, surrounded by corroded copper and encasing a steel element. A creationist geologist claimed that the stone would've taken around 500,000 years to form.

Subsequent investigation is impeded by the disappearance of the artifact; however, examination of the well-publicized X-rays of the Coso artifact have indicated that the spark plug was of a type manufactured in the 1920's by Champion; therefore, the "stone" was likely something akin to hardened clay, and the artifact cannot be older than 90 years.
 
Dorian Gray said:
If you like cult archaeology, this site will be like your Paradise.

straightface.gif
 
Pyrrho said:
Moved by request.

Help! I'm being repressed by the free-speech-crushing moderative Gestapo of the JREF Forum!!!....

...oh, wait, I'm the one that asked...sorry. :D

Any more questions?
 
I heard as a child about a long hall or tunnel (I have no idea where or from what era, only that it was somewhat ancient) that was specially constructed to allow people to whisper from great distances and still be heard. Does this sound like something you've ever heard of?
Also, is there any archeological evidence for the claim that there used to be red haired people in South America, who possibly came from Polynesia (maybe Easter Island?
I apologize for the somewhat vague nature of my queries, and appreciate any time you have to share whatever you may know regarding these topics.
 

Back
Top Bottom