Crystal Cathedral files for bankruptcy.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Even though their salaries aren't that high, they're probably getting enormous perks. I once read that Joyce Meyer has all her expenses paid by her ministry, from housing to dry-cleaning. Her income goes straight into the bank and never has to be drawn upon.

Steve S

Not too many ministers own

one home and three condos

.

 

[154]

I wonder how good she'll think it is if she has to go out and get a real job instead of living off the sheep.

That would be good.

But she probably won't have to..

I'm sure they're raking in nice salaries and adding it to the debt.

Probably so, I would guess.

 

[Blue Mountain]

Thanks, Gord_in_Toronto. $80,000 is a good salary, but it's not ludicrously astronomical. $80,000 + $50,000 is $130,000 for the family; again high but not alarming. But one home and three condos ... that's pushing it. I wonder if the couple bought these holding themselves or if the church paid for them?

 

[154]

Somewhere at the Crystal Cathedral there is a pane of glass with my name on it. My grandmother "bought" them for all her grandchildren, but my parents and I had stopped attending Schuller's church before the Cathedral was built.

Interesting anecdotal addition!

...but a God who is not bigger than bankruptcy apparently.

Do you think God is troubled or surprised by this?!

It has been suggested it would make an excellent Skeptic League Headquarters.

Watch, it'll be a mosque..

 

[154]

I wouldn't write them off just yet. It's bankruptcy protection, designed to give the organization a chance to restructure its debt and formulate a repayment plan. They may come out of it in a couple of years once the economy improves.

Almost certainly. This much cash flow, even if currently adjusted,, will probably not be eliminated yet.

Although I would be interested to know how much the senior pastoral staff earns.

I would too. Someboy'll dig it up.

 

[154]

Schuller looks out for the interests of his family: eight members are on the payroll. Among them is his wife Arvella, who is executive program director of the Hour of Power; she is secretary of the 20-member Robert Schuller Ministries board. Her salary: $50,000. Schuller gets a salary of $80,000 and tax-exempt housing allowances of $43,500. The couple owns one home and three condos, and the ministry has extensive real estate holdings. Schuller draws no royalties from books and tapes sold by his ministry, but royalties from commercial book sales have garnered him some $2 million in the past 25 years.

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,965155-7,00.html#ixzz12lFZl700​

Whoop there it is

Any objections? I don't see any here. If accurate, quite modest in fact.

Even though their salaries aren't that high, they're probably getting enormous perks. I once read that Joyce Meyer has all her expenses paid by her ministry, from housing to dry-cleaning. Her income goes straight into the bank and never has to be drawn upon.

I'm sure there are other ample benefits, and given what we've seen of salary, if true, then I would expect similar modesty there as well, and I wouldn't begrudge them for it.

Thanks, Gord_in_Toronto. $80,000 is a good salary, but it's not ludicrously astronomical. $80,000 + $50,000 is $130,000 for the family; again high but not alarming. But one home and three condos ... that's pushing it. I wonder if the couple bought these holding themselves or if the church paid for them?

I don't think so, not necessarily. If that's most of what they've got after supervising a ministry such as theirs has been for as long as it's been, and grossing how many hundreds of millions by now is my guess? That's hardly pushing anything but a unusually surprising and maybe an almost unheard of example of modesty.

Unless there's more... probably... What other accounts and where, if any?

 

[Brainache]

This is one of those "Jesus wants us to be rich" type churches isn't it?

Perhaps it's time they re-thought their theology.

 

[edge]

This is one of those "Jesus wants us to be rich" type churches isn't it?

Perhaps it's time they re-thought their theology.

It's not the Church of the big fat wallet.
They have done some really good preaching.
I've watched and there's many others who are corrupt, try agaian.

 

[154]

This is one of those "Jesus wants us to be rich" type churches isn't it?

Perhaps it's time they re-thought their theology.

No, not really. Not TBN Benny Hinnish...

But a lovey-dovey, feel-good, flowery, kinda boring, but sometimes pretty good place.
I wouldn't say it was really bad in any way.

And not a Ted Haggard's place either..

 

[Orthoptera]

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,965155-7,00.html#ixzz12lFZl700​

I would like to point out to all that the article is from 1987: The 24-year-old numbers need to be considered in that light.

 

[154]

I would like to point out to all that the article is from 1987: The 24-year-old numbers need to be considered in that light.

The plot thickens..

Their numbers could be ten times as high now...

 

[Skeptic Ginger]

Even as big as that church is, it is decades old. It should have been paid off by now. I would guess Schuller and company have been living the high life on the backs of the penitent masses.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Crystal Catheral goin' down!

Crystal Catheral files for bankruptcy.

Yes, folks, the Greenhouse from Hell is going to be a disco in the not-to-distant future, with any luck at all.

 

[Blue Mountain]

I would like to point out to all that the article is from 1987: The 24-year-old numbers need to be considered in that light.

Good catch.

The Wikipedia article indicates that while the Cathedral was completed in 1980 (at a cost then of $18 million, it has been added to in recent years. The Prayer Spire was built in 1990, a Family Life Center also in 1990 and a Welcoming Center in 1993. The mortgage now stands at $36 million, with additional debs of $19 million, mostly (I suspect) from their television broadcasting.

As to their fundamental message, I don't know if they're one of the more fringe "health-and-wealth" types or the more traditional "Jesus loves you and you must believe in him" types, or if it's a mixture.

 

[Lisa Simpson]

They may not be as bad as Ted Haggard's church, but they aren't much good either. As I've said, my uncle donated probably around a million dollars to the church, but when he developed cancer, no one from the church could be bothered to help. I've lived in this part of OC my whole life and they are not a force for good or social change in the area. Even Rick Warren's church does more for people around here than Schuller does.

 

[CynicalSkeptic]

I would like to point out to all that the article is from 1987: The 24-year-old numbers need to be considered in that light.

If they gave themselves a modest 4% raise every year, they'd be making $197K and $123K this year. Still not completely outrageous.

Now if their raises were 10% per year, their 2010 salaries would be $716K and $447K. Again, not astronmical compared to pro athletes and movie stars, but an extremely comfortable salary, especially given the housing allowance, and other perks.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Now if their raises were 10% per year, their 2010 salaries would be $716K and $447K. Again, not astronmical compared to pro athletes and movie stars, but an extremely comfortable salary, especially given the housing allowance, and other perks.

And very christian of them to live in humble surroundings and share their worldly goods with the less fortunate.

Or something like that, anyway.

 

[Cainkane1]

If they have to sell the property what could the building be used for? A giant greenhouse?

 

[Fnord]

My pointless contribution:

The televangelist was in a great deal of trouble. His church was failing, he had put everything he had into the it, and he owed everybody. It was so bad he was even contemplating suicide. As a last resort he went to a Catholic priest and poured out his story of tears and woe.

When he had finished, the priest said, "Here's what I want you to do: Put a beach chair and your Bible in your car and drive down to the beach. Take the beach chair and the Bible to the water's edge, sit down in the beach chair, and put the Bible in your lap. Open the Bible; the wind will rifle the pages, but finally the open Bible will come to rest on a page. Look down at the page and read the first thing you see. That will be your answer, that will tell you what to do."

A year later the televangelist went back to the priest and brought his wife and children with him. The man was in a new custom-tailored suit, his wife in a mink coat, the children shining. The televangelist pulled an envelope stuffed with money out of his pocket, gave it to the Catholic priest as a donation in thanks for his advice.

The priest recognized the benefactor, and was curious. "You did as I suggested?" he asked.

"Absolutely," replied the televangelist.

"You went to the beach?"

"Absolutely."

"You sat in a beach chair with the Bible in your lap?"

"Absolutely."

"You let the wind rifle the pages until they stopped?"

"Absolutely."

"And what were the first words you saw?"

"Chapter 11."

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

If they have to sell the property what could the building be used for? A giant greenhouse?

They could grow some really great "goodies" in there, and avoid that pesky importation issue.

However, I hope the Insane Clown Posse takes it for their concert venue.