controll your dreams?

[Deetee]

This machine, however . . . I don't get the "picture" thing, either, but I think I can see how it may work otherwise. Waste of money, though, since you can do it pretty easily on your own.

The MoeFaux jpeg I printed off failed to work last night. Will try yours tonight Rebecca....watch this space!

 

[rebecca]

The MoeFaux jpeg I printed off failed to work last night. Will try yours tonight Rebecca....watch this space!

Hmm, maybe I'll hook up with Moe and we can produce the "Skepchick of your Dreams Machine." $$$$$$!

 

[LostAngeles]

It's fairly obvious that some portion of cognition remains active during dreaming, since dreams so often include external stimuli.

For instance, an alarm going off.

Or the Gore, no Bush, no Gore Florida issue on election night. Also if you catch me talking in my sleep, there's supposedly a chance you can get me to dream about pink bunnies according to my mother.

 

[TheERK]

I don't believe there is any such thing as lucid dreaming. The very logic of it is problematic. How can you be conscious of the fact you're dreaming when you are by definition unconscious?

And if those devices worked, everyone would have one, no doubt.

Posts like this convince non-skeptics that skeptics are closed minded.

 

[Jyera]

I need convincing that it is worth $136

With regard to the Tokyo-based Takara Co. "Dream Workshop" stand.

From the description and based on my personal experience to remember dream, the gadget does help to induce a desired dream. But it is a just a product of convenience.

At 22 percent success rate, and I feel it is a little low.
Similar result could be achieved without buying it.
At usd$136, I need much convincing.

I have investigated dreaming when I was around 12-16 yr old.

I used to will myself to remember my dreams.
I frequently find that I can remember that I had a dream but do not remember the content.

So I simply place a pen and paper on my bedside and told myself repeatedly that "I'll wake up and write down my dreams on paper quickly". That some times worked.

And my mother would tell me in the morning that I was talking while asleep, with hands held out and eyes closed shouting out for pen and paper.


- Jyera

 

[Jyera]

Recuring dream is controllerable

Many years ago, when I read Omni magazine regularly, (fine rag, BTW) they did polling of their readership on a number of topics.

One was lucid dreaming. A fairly large (25-30%) percentage of the responders claimed at least some ability to control their dreams. My wife has been able to do it for years, and for her, nightmares are the ones she can't control.

I found that I was not able to control what to dream in the night very well.
But I have found that I'm able to progressively control my feelings in a recuring dream.

Once I had this recurring dream. I'll walk up the stairs of a 10 storey building and jump off it. I'll wake up when I "closed" my eyes during the fall.

After a while, I could "perfect" the dream and enjoy it. I would jump off happily and enjoy the control of shutting my eyes to save myself just before "impact".

I don't remember any extremely fearful dreams. The fear of falling was in that dream, and it was recurring, so I suppose it counts as nightmare.

So I think that it is possible to control and influnence a recuring nightmare.

 

[belinda]

I don't think I'd be wasting my money on buying it, but I do think that external stimuli can affect dreams. I remember one extremely (at the time) scary dream I had which had a soundtrack to it....the soundtrack was of course the radio that was playing next to the bed.

I'm not sure about lucid dreams - I have had dreams which seemed to me that I "knew" I was dreaming so I would "think" cool - I want to able to do such and such - but usually that fails miserably. Maybe lucid dreamers are only dreaming that they can control their dreams if you follow the logic.

It's a bit hard to characterise - there is still a lot of debate as to what dreams actually are anyway and why the occur the way they do as well as what function (if any) that they have. Maybe when we figure that out, we'll also figure out what exactly what people who say they have lucid dreams are actually doing.

 

[FuzzyQuark]

I had a really strange dream a few weeks back. It was in incredible colour and detail, unlike the vague, misty types of dream I usually have. I had a feeling that I was probably dreaming, and thought that if it was a dream I could break the laws of physics and fly up into the air. I actually remember trying to fly in the dream, falling flat on my face and thinking that I couldn't be in a dream otherwise I'd be able to fly. I also tried banging my hand against a wall and remember that this hurt, which confirmed that I couldn't be in a dream. Shortly afterwards I woke up. I swear this is true, it seems to have been a one-off as I haven't had any similar dreams like this since. I can even remember the colours of buildings and trees in the dream, it was that intense.

 

[flyboy217]

Maybe lucid dreamers are only dreaming that they can control their dreams if you follow the logic.

Check out the studies of Stephen LaBerge. This was one of the stumbling blocks to getting lucid dreaming "accepted." There are ways of getting external verification that the subject is both dreaming and conscious.

 

[Suggestologist]

Hahaha. Oh my sides, they hurt. Only on such a forum as this can you find someone trying to debunk lucid dreaming.

By whose definition are people unconscious during dreams? Ah using "logic" to debunk experience (and many well-accepted clinical trials with Stephen LaBerge!).

But why am I arguing? Please carry on. I'm sure I'll get flamed for supporting such a woo-woo concept as... wait for it... lucid dreaming.

In case your post wasn't a parody, I'm going to pretend it was anyway.

Hmmm, unfortunately it probably wasn't a parody. After all, you have people like skepdic.com who have debunking articles about "Love", claim that daydreaming shouldn't be called an altered state of consciousness, and play term-deletion games with concepts like hypnosis.

 

[flyboy217]

Hmmm, unfortunately it probably wasn't a parody. After all, you have people like skepdic.com who have debunking articles about "Love", claim that daydreaming shouldn't be called an altered state of consciousness, and play term-deletion games with concepts like hypnosis.

I've always wondered about skepdic. I did notice the entry for hypnosis changed substantially (most notably, the condescending tone disappeared) at about the same time that Harvard med school published several articles on the clinical efficacy of it. Similarly, the lucid dreaming entry at one time ended with the sentence "Yawn." It seems to have since been retracted. Perhaps they should call it cyndic.com...

 

[TheERK]

Hmmm, unfortunately it probably wasn't a parody. After all, you have people like skepdic.com who have debunking articles about "Love", claim that daydreaming shouldn't be called an altered state of consciousness, and play term-deletion games with concepts like hypnosis.

Yes, damn those "people" like skepdic.com.

Seriously, what's wrong with debunking an article about love? Given it is one of the more complex and profound emotions, there's likely a lot of crap surrounding it. Are you trying to tell me that every article written about love is accurate?

Please link to what you're talking about concerning day-dreaming. Anything can be construed as an 'altered state of consciousness', like being hungry. Honestly, daydreaming is not really that altered--it's just not focused on whats going on. It's nothing like being intoxicated on some sort of drug.

Also, no clue what you're talking about with hypnosis. Perhaps you could clarify?

 

[Suggestologist]

Also, no clue what you're talking about with hypnosis. Perhaps you could clarify?

I'm talking about term-deletion. Oh, they say, there's no such thing as hypnosis; it's just suggestion ... oh, oh, and role-playing ... oh, oh, and mental absorbsion .... oh, yeah, and some other stuff -- But there's no such thing as hypnosis, no sir.

Daydreaming is referred to in the hypnosis article, at least it was the last time I read it.

In addition, his facts are simply wrong in places. I've sent e-mail, he hasn't corrected them.

He's also inconsistent when he refers to hypnagogic and hypnopompic states of consciousness (in their own articles), yet he seems to deny that there's anything at all that should be called an altered state of consciousness in the hypnosis article.

Notably, his article on NLP (which is basically a form of covert hypnosis, IMO) contains no NLP books in the references; which explains the many (accidental) misrepresentations within his article on the subject.

 

[TheERK]

Who ever said there was no such thing as hypnosis?

 

[Suggestologist]

Who ever said there was no such thing as hypnosis?

Lots O' uninformed skeptics. And some people who should know better; like Kreskin (the amazing one) and Spanos (author).

 

[Blondin]

I have never had any kind of control over what happens in a dream but there are two recurring "lucid" situations that pop up in a lot of my dreams.

The first is a sort of sense of amazement at what ever is happening in a dream. It's almost like I am experiencing the dream from 2 points of view, one of which is just a kind of spectator who is aware it is only a dream. This is kind of hard to explain but the feeling I experience at those times is a kind of wonder or awe at the inventiveness of my sub-conscious. Kind of like, "Wow, how did I come up with this?"

The other recurring situation happens when ever I try to read anything in a dream. I can't read in dreams. Signs, menus, newspapers, etc all contain gibberish in my dreams. They seem to be english words but they are disjointed and nonsensical (kind of like the nonsense strings you find at the bottom of spam emails). I sometimes feel a sense of frustration at first but then I'll realize I am dreaming and remember that I can't read in my dreams.

I am curious to know if anybody else ever has experiences like this.

 

[LostAngeles]

I have never had any kind of control over what happens in a dream but there are two recurring "lucid" situations that pop up in a lot of my dreams.

The first is a sort of sense of amazement at what ever is happening in a dream. It's almost like I am experiencing the dream from 2 points of view, one of which is just a kind of spectator who is aware it is only a dream. This is kind of hard to explain but the feeling I experience at those times is a kind of wonder or awe at the inventiveness of my sub-conscious. Kind of like, "Wow, how did I come up with this?"

The other recurring situation happens when ever I try to read anything in a dream. I can't read in dreams. Signs, menus, newspapers, etc all contain gibberish in my dreams. They seem to be english words but they are disjointed and nonsensical (kind of like the nonsense strings you find at the bottom of spam emails). I sometimes feel a sense of frustration at first but then I'll realize I am dreaming and remember that I can't read in my dreams.

I am curious to know if anybody else ever has experiences like this.

I've had the first and I've heard of the second. Supposedly, no one can read in dreams. Thing is, I'm pretty sure I have but I'm not entirely sure.

Then again, me and nearly everyone else I know dreams in color and we all know NO ONE does that.

 

[flyboy217]

I've had the first and I've heard of the second. Supposedly, no one can read in dreams. Thing is, I'm pretty sure I have but I'm not entirely sure.

I'm always curious to know what kind of an expert can tell you what is impossible to do in dreams. As noted, skeptics for a while completely dismissed the notion of lucid dreams. I just had a lucid dream last week where I read a page out of a book. I was almost as conscious as in waking life, and I could actually make out (what I thought were) letters and words.

Then again, me and nearly everyone else I know dreams in color and we all know NO ONE does that.

Really? Who knows that no one does that? I love how everyone does something that is clearly impossible.

 

[LostAngeles]

Originally posted by Lost Angeles
Then again, me and nearly everyone else I know dreams in color and we all know NO ONE does that.

Really? Who knows that no one does that? I love how everyone does something that is clearly impossible.

Supposedly, you dream in black and white, unless you're "creative" and thusly dream in color. I have yet to meet someone who dreams in black and white. I think it's a "well you're a very special person" myth.

I dream in color. I dream very vividly, especially around my period. I occasionally lucid dream. I have dream memory (either a dream I've had before relates to that dream or I have memories of things that happened before in the dream's timeline.) I have recurring dreams. I've woken up and still been dreaming, once to the point that I ended up going through a Sunday five times counting the actually living through the day. I've died in my dreams. I've died in my dreams and been stuck in a little limbo between sleep and awake.

Therefore, I must be either very creative, insane, or dead.

If there's 3,117 registered members and the 117 are sock puppets, I'm willing to wager that at least 2,500 of us do the same or have even more fun dream stuff.

 

[flyboy217]

Really? Who knows that no one does that? I love how everyone does something that is clearly impossible.

Supposedly, you dream in black and white, unless you're "creative" and thusly dream in color. I have yet to meet someone who dreams in black and white. I think it's a "well you're a very special person" myth.

I dream in color. I dream very vividly, especially around my period. I occasionally lucid dream. I have dream memory (either a dream I've had before relates to that dream or I have memories of things that happened before in the dream's timeline.) I have recurring dreams. I've woken up and still been dreaming, once to the point that I ended up going through a Sunday five times counting the actually living through the day. I've died in my dreams. I've died in my dreams and been stuck in a little limbo between sleep and awake.

Therefore, I must be either very creative, insane, or dead.

If there's 3,117 registered members and the 117 are sock puppets, I'm willing to wager that at least 2,500 of us do the same or have even more fun dream stuff.

Yeah, that's why I was wondering. I and everyone I've talked to dreams in color... it would seem pretty boring not to . I've been less good about remembering my dreams. When I used to cultivate lucid dreams back in the day, I'd usually have ~4/month.

I got quite lucky about 4 months ago, having several each night for a week, culminating in a night with 5-6 long ones. Mad fun