Merged Cold Fusion Claims

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Do you understand Ben M's post at all?

The material they use does not show that the neutrons were from the alleged cold fusion at all. The events could have happened at any time and not as a result of the alleged cold fusion.

David, you did not understand Ben M's post.
His post means that CR-39 can be sometimes pierced by neutrons of the background.

But neutrons of the background do not produce the "triple tracks" observed in the CR-39:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/090323110450.htm
Such triple tracks are tipically produced when nuclear reactions occur

Some nuclear physicists who analysed the CR-39 used in the experiment said that there is no doubt: nuclear reactions occurred into the electrolytic vessel used by Mosier-Boss.

I prefer to trust in what stated those nuclear physicists, since they analysed the plastic CR-39.
Ben M did not analysed it.

Do you think I have to trust what Ben M claims ?
 
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I may not be a physicist, but I can recognize an Appeal To Popularity when I see one.

None of what you said matters. Dozens, hundreds, or thousands of people chasing a myth will never change the fact it's a myth.
ElMondo, I read everything about cold fusion.
And along the years I have realized that some intriguing results are pointing out that cold fusion really occurs.

Dozens, hundreds, or thousands of esoteric people chasing a myth will never change the fact it's a myth.

But cold fusion is not chased by esoteric people. It's chased by scientists worldwide, among them some Nobel Laureate.
Do you see the difference ?
 
Some Nobel Laureates spent the later decades of their lives trying to prove that blacks were inferior to whites. There is no immunity or infallibility that comes with being a Laureate. I would bet that when you look at any list of Laureates chasing Cold Fusion that they are not really in their main field of study.
 
Some Nobel Laureates spent the later decades of their lives trying to prove that blacks were inferior to whites. There is no immunity or infallibility that comes with being a Laureate. I would bet that when you look at any list of Laureates chasing Cold Fusion that they are not really in their main field of study.

Generally, Nobel Prize in the Scientific categories is for 1 amazing invention or theory. The person could be an utter idiot in many other respects and many are (e.g. Josephson, Shockley who you eluded to and the one whose name I can't remember who tried to prove that HIV didn't cause AIDS).

As for Cold Fusion, there's 2 reasons why researchers go after it:
1) A practically guaranteed Nobel Prize
2) A whole big pot of gold, and the potential to make both environmentalists and energy suppliers very very happy.
 
Nickel is at bottom of NBE curve. Bottomed out = no energy. BS. QED.

EDIT: Now I see, the claim is to fuse nickel with hydrogen, hmm... But I don't think this'll work because you've got to get over that Coulomb barrier somehow.

Mike, perhaps we dont know some special conditions that occur into the neighborhood of nuclei, in some special conditions when resonance occurs.

Perhaps gravity can help the cold fusion reactions. Maybe gravity is not 1040 times weaker than electromagnetism as physicists supposed.
So, perhaps gravity can help some nucleons to get over the Coulomb barrier

Look at this link in Zpenergy:
http://www.zpenergy.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=3272&mode=&order=0&thold=0

The electromagnetism is 10^40 times stronger than gravity.
However, the range of electromagnetism actuation is very short, while the range of gravity is very large. Why ?

According to superstring theory, the range of the gravity actuation is very large because gravity is hidden in some of the more than 10 dimensions of the space.

Quantum Ring Theory exhibits some evidences pointing out that:
1- there are two sort of gravity: the atractive and the repulsive
2- they both have the same magnitude of the electromagnetism


Gravity with the magnitude of the magnetism was already detected by experiments:

Towards a new test of general relativity?
23 March 2006
Scientists funded by the European Space Agency believe they may have measured the gravitational equivalent of a magnetic field for the first time in a laboratory. Under certain special conditions the effect is much larger than expected from general relativity and could help physicists to make a significant step towards the long-sought-after quantum theory of gravity.
http://www.esa.int/esaCP/SEM0L6OVGJE_index_0.html [www.esa.int]



So, the space is filled with attractive gravitons g(+) and g(-), and repulsive gravitons G(+) and G(-). They constitute a "soup" of gravitons filling the space of the Universe.

But the repulsive gravity is a little weak than the attractive gravity. The relation between the repulsive force FGG and the attractive force FGg is:

FGG / FGg = 0,999 999 999 999 999 999 999 999 999 999 999 999

Therefore, as the repulsive gravity is a little weaker, then the gravitational soup that fills the space of the Universe results to be a little attractive, and 10^40 times weaker than the electromagnetism.
But as such soup is spread in the space of the Universe, this is the reason why the range of gravity actuation is very large, because in spite of both repulsive and attractive gravitons have the magnitude interaction of the electromagnetism, neverthless from the combination of those two different sort of gravitons it remains only a gravitational interaction 10^40 times weaker than electromagnetism.

Such assymetry of the gravity is also the reason why the antiparticles are not observed in the Universe, because, as shown in Quantum Ring Theory, the gravitons g(+), g(-), G(+), G(-) have interaction with the electric particles existing in the soup that fills the space.
If the Universe should be perfectly symmetric, the space would have to be filled with matter and antimatter, and the Universe could not exist.

The magnitude of the gravity, 10^40 times weaker than electromagnetism, observed experimentally firstly by Newton, has deviated along the centuries the physicists from the discovery that gravity and electromagnetism have the same magnitude, because the physicists never supposed that gravity should be formed by attractive and repulsive gravitons.

This is comprehensive, since the scientific method states that there is need to consider experimental data only, as measured by Newton, and so peculations (like repulsive gravity) are not acceptable.


But if gravity is really composed by repulsive and attractive gravitons, as proposed in Quantum Ring Theory, then it is obvious that the current theories of Physics are very far away of the true structure of the Universe.
 
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ElMondo, I read everything about cold fusion.
And along the years I have realized that some intriguing results are pointing out that cold fusion really occurs.

Dozens, hundreds, or thousands of esoteric people chasing a myth will never change the fact it's a myth.

But cold fusion is not chased by esoteric people. It's chased by scientists worldwide, among them some Nobel Laureate.
Do you see the difference ?

And now, that's an appeal to authority. Just changing the logical fallacy you employ does not change the fact you're employing fallacies instead of substantive arguments.
 
Generally, Nobel Prize in the Scientific categories is for 1 amazing invention or theory. The person could be an utter idiot in many other respects and many are (e.g. Josephson, Shockley who you eluded to and the one whose name I can't remember who tried to prove that HIV didn't cause AIDS).

As for Cold Fusion, there's 2 reasons why researchers go after it:
1) A practically guaranteed Nobel Prize
2) A whole big pot of gold, and the potential to make both environmentalists and energy suppliers very very happy.
Evil, I was not thinking on Josephson.
There are other Nobel Laureate, as Edward Teller and Julian Schwinger:

Apparently Edward Teller gave a speech at UC Davis in October of 2000
on cold fusion

http://www.mombu.com/science/physics/t-edward-teller-on-cold-fusion-1231685-last.html

Nobel Laureate Julian Schwinger declared himself a supporter of cold fusion and tried to publish a paper on it in Physical Review Letters; even he was rejected for publication
http://www.universetoday.com/49361/cold-fusion/
 
And now, that's an appeal to authority. Just changing the logical fallacy you employ does not change the fact you're employing fallacies instead of substantive arguments.

What substantive arguments are stronger than the results of cold fusion experiments ?

According to the scientific method, scientists have to consider what the experiments give to them, and not what the mainstream scientific community takes as the true
 
Evil, I was not thinking on Josephson.
There are other Nobel Laureate, as Edward Teller and Julian Schwinger:

Apparently Edward Teller gave a speech at UC Davis in October of 2000
on cold fusion

http://www.mombu.com/science/physics/t-edward-teller-on-cold-fusion-1231685-last.html

Nobel Laureate Julian Schwinger declared himself a supporter of cold fusion and tried to publish a paper on it in Physical Review Letters; even he was rejected for publication
http://www.universetoday.com/49361/cold-fusion/

It wasn't Josephson's support of Cold Fusion which I was using to justify him as an idiot (but right now the evidence on it is not looking good), the main plank I was using to justify calling Josephson a moron was his support of other major woo woo notions.
"There is a lot of evidence to support the existence of telepathy, for example, but papers on the subject are being rejected - quite unfairly"

"Quantum theory is now being fruitfully combined with theories of information and computation. These developments may lead to an explanation of processes still not understood within conventional science such as telepathy, an area where Britain is at the forefront of research."

"Broader approach", yes: let's not forget the version of fusion reported by Martin Fleischmann and Stanley Pons in 1989. You thought that that had been discredited perhaps? Wrong! It is true that a number of teams failed to replicate the experiment, but that does happen sometimes when the experimental conditions are critical. Other people persisted, and got results eventually. Why does one not hear about this? In a word, censorship: it is the practice of many editors to return such papers without sending them out to be refereed (I am surprised to learn that it is the opinion of the President of the Royal Society that that is the privilege of editors to do this if it fits their sincerely held prejudices, but it seems to me that this is a perfect recipe for slowing the advance of science).

Unlike the sceptics who prefer to criticise from their armchairs, I have gone ahead and visited no fewer than three laboratories where such research is going on, in order to get at the facts. My latest was a visit to the experiment of Thomas Claytor of LANL, who is measuring tritium production in a glow discharge with a view to finding out which electrode materials give the highest yield. (The sceptics will I suppose claim that he is adding the tritium somehow, in which case why don't they go along to the lab and see if that is what is in fact happening?)

Who will be the first editor of a major journal to bring this lunatic situation to an end, by being brave enough to publish such results as these? Then, maybe, there can be a concentrated effort to realise whatever potential there may be from this new energy source."

Josephson has a track record of being a major league moron, and suggesting conspiracies among the scientific community at the drop of a hat.
 
Some Nobel Laureates spent the later decades of their lives trying to prove that blacks were inferior to whites. There is no immunity or infallibility that comes with being a Laureate. I would bet that when you look at any list of Laureates chasing Cold Fusion that they are not really in their main field of study.

True. All anyone has to do is read up on Linus Pauling's advocacy of Vitamin C. Pauling was a highly intelligent man who's contributions to science that earned him a Nobel are unquestionably vital. But that doesn't change the fact that, despite his conviction regarding the health benefits of high dose Vit. C and his energetic advocacy of it, studies showed no appreciable benefit of it on the health issues he claimed it helped (for example, cancer, or preventing colds).

But at least that was marginally within his area of competence. What'd be worse would be to see a Nobel Laureate in, say, Literature, advocating for an unproven scientific concept. That would be well outside this hypothetical Laureate's field of study, yet I could easily predict that some people would make that very appeal to authority in defense of an argument.

The fact that a Nobel Laureate advocates for a given concept doesn't impress me if the advocacy is the only thing given for that concept's defense. What I want to see is a Nobel prize winner in that field give a good argument for why a concept is valid by giving evidence for that concept's validity. Mere advocacy is nothing.
 
So, it seems cold fusion is supported by a conspiracy of crazy Nobel Laureates
:D:D:D
 
What substantive arguments are stronger than the results of cold fusion experiments ?

None. That's why I'm saying that appeals to authority are hollow. It's the results of experiments and the subsequent analyses of them proving the concept that matter.

Which is why you should argue results rather than who's advocating for a concept.

According to the scientific method, scientists have to consider what the experiments give to them, and not what the mainstream scientific community takes as the true

You make the classic mistake of painting the "mainstream scientific community" as being 1. Monolithic and 2. Unchangeable by drawing a contrast between experimentation results and that "mainstream scientific community". The scientific community modifies and refines stances based on compelling research. It is the duty of the researchers to design their projects and communicate their findings in a way that's compelling enough and replicable enough to where the "mainstream scientific community" takes notice.

It is on those very researchers to prove their concept. And this goes back to your original post: It's the results that matter, not who's advocating for the field of study.
 
Generally, Nobel Prize in the Scientific categories is for 1 amazing invention or theory. The person could be an utter idiot in many other respects and many are (e.g. Josephson, Shockley who you eluded to and the one whose name I can't remember who tried to prove that HIV didn't cause AIDS).

I don't recall any Nobel winners trying to prove that HIV didn't cause AIDs. Peter Duesberg has done work in this direction, but AFAIK, he hasn't won any Nobels. And Nobel winner Kary Mullis was influenced by Duseberg's work, but I don't believe he's done any himself in that field.
 
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And Nobel winner Kary Mullis was influenced by Duseberg's work, but I don't believe he's done any himself in that field.

OK, I got my facts kind of wrong, but the fact he wrote the foreword for the denialist tome What If Everything You Thought You Knew About AIDS Was Wrong? certainly speaks volumes. Plus Mullis is a climate denier and believer in astrology.
 
OK, I got my facts kind of wrong, but the fact he wrote the foreword for the denialist tome What If Everything You Thought You Knew About AIDS Was Wrong? certainly speaks volumes. Plus Mullis is a climate denier and believer in astrology.

Oh, don't mea culpa over this; I had to look that up myself. I knew about Duesberg but didn't think he had won a Nobel. It was looking him up and mucking around on Google for a minute that led me to Mullis. I've never even heard of him before I searched.

And yeah... Mullis is outstanding in one narrow field, but goes so far off the rails in others. That's amazing.
 
The electromagnetism is 10^40 times stronger than gravity.
However, the range of electromagnetism actuation is very short, while the range of gravity is very large. Why ?

How does the electromagnetic force vary with distance? How is that qualitatively different to gravity?
 
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