CIT.....Time to call it a day

[bobloblaw]

Aldo speaks about how Boger apparently missed the impact despite claiming to watch the plane fully enter the building before exploding - Sean Boger ALSO thought it hit the overhead sign, the one Robert Turcios thought it pulled up near. Boger did not know about the pull-up. He tried to explain away that he didn't think the pilot had enough experience to make that maneuver so he deduced that it couldn't, he didn't see that it didn't. This would indicate he stopped watching and had to have missed what he claims was the plane entering the building.

Aldo is unique - you simply cannot make up crap like that.

 

[GlennB]

Thanks for all the support guys.

It was like living in the bizzare-o world for a few days there. I'm really quite astonished by the whole experience.

Welcome bob. Will you be going back *over there" after the suspension, or was that quite enough for a sane person ?

Cheers to you, and thanks for all the cool, calm and precise work you did there.

 

[bobloblaw]

Please, someone with access to the LCF, in reponse to Bitterman:

Can Bob or someone tell me where he got these exact quotes? I think I missed this......I think I would have remembered if Sean said he STOOD there....solid while the plane flew at the building......and impacted, and where he watched without hesitating......still watching as the plane "went all the way into the building....." and THEN he drops to the floor. I really missed that testimony.......that's "interesting" testimony. If it were true, I may believe the opposite of what Aldo is trying to prove!

Can someone post them for him please? I just tried to post them here but I can't post links yet. If someone were to look at my messages from yesterday or before I am sure the links are there.

 

[jaydeehess]

http://www.pentagonresearch.com/070.html

says he heard the metal entering the building

"I just looked up and I saw the big nose and the wings of the aircraft coming right at us and I just watched it hit the building," Air Traffic Controller and Pentagon tower chief Sean Boger said. "It exploded. I fell to the ground and covered my head. I could actually hear the metal going through the building."
Sept. 11 started out as a normal day in the Pentagon control towers. The crew, Boger and Spc. Jacqueline Kidd, air traffic controller and training supervisor, prepared for President George W. Bush to arrive from Florida around 12:30 p.m.

"We were watching television and saw where the World Trade Centers were hit," Boger, a former Military District of Washington and Fort Belvoir NCO of the year, said. Kidd knew that the Pentagon would immediately heighten security after the attack in New York, so she decided to get her lunch out of her car while she still could.

Before she left, Boger said to Kidd, "I'm surprised no one has ever flown into the Pentagon," Boger said to Kidd before she left, referring to the fact that so many planes fly around the Pentagon daily. He was talking about an accident, not a terrorist attack. "Keep your eyes on the planes," Kidd said jokingly leaving the office "There was no time to think," the tower chief said. "There wasn't time to be scared."

Kidd was on her way out to her car when the plane hit. Luckily, Kidd stopped by the restroom before going to her car. "They got us," Kidd said her first thought was. "The lights went out and the ceiling fell in on me," she said. Kidd returned to the bottom of the tower and tried to get to Boger. The stairs were covered with debris and the ceiling had fallen in around him. "I don't know how I got out, but I got out," Boger said. Boger got to the bottom of the tower and was still not sure what was going on. "I grabbed [Kidd] and we both fell to the ground," he said. "We looked back." "What happened?" Kidd asked. "A plane just flew into the Pentagon," Boger responded.

 

[bobloblaw]

Welcome bob. Will you be going back *over there" after the suspension, or was that quite enough for a sane person ?

Cheers to you, and thanks for all the cool, calm and precise work you did there.

I might give it a shot, I don't know.

It's disappointing, I kept to the skeptics forum and directly challenged things that were said that were proven to be factually incorrect. I was called all manner of names whilst being cordial with them. Aldo consistently pushes speculation and outright lies despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary and as soon as I point out that he is being deceptive I'm banned with no warning.

And how can you debate under those conditions?

I don't have a problem with JFK. If I had to say anything I'd probably say that his behaviour saddens me. Stundie caught on early and retracted what he'd be fooled into believing, and even Bitterman is now showing signs of cracking.

But JFK, you know.. well, I spent a fair bit of time refreshing the screen, waiting for replies and checking who was reading what and posting where. And JFK followed me around like a dog, but never responded after being whipped while pushing a CIT lie... So he was just waiting.. just sitting there waiting for me to say something to ban me for. And it happened quickly, too.

And it saddens me that that was his reaction. That he couldn't sit back and think "hrmm, well, maybe there's another explanation here", instead just reach for the suspend button.

How can you reach people like that?

So I don't know. I've got a week to think about it, I guess.

 

[bobloblaw]

says he heard the metal entering the building

You're not looking at the full quote. It's even more revealling.

I can't post links yet, but you can find this on John Farmer's website in the CMH FOIA section. It's NEIT299, an eyewitness account with the name redacted. Craig Ranke has identified NEIT299 as Sean Boger.

NEIT299 says:

[Redacted {Ranke identifies as Boger}] And so I am looking out at the road, and I see the traffic has liked stop, and I look out the window and I just hear a -- I just see like the nose and the wing of an aircraft just like coming right at us, and he didn't veer. And then you just heard the noise, and then he just smacked into the building, and when it hit the building, I am watching the plane go all the way into the building.
[Redacted {Interviewer}] Oh, my gosh.
[Sean Boger] So once the plane went into the building, it exploded, and once it exploded, I hit the floor and just covered up my head.

 

[jaydeehess]

Boger also stated;

As he was coming towards me it just seemed like he was tilting he aircraft to his right. It was almost like....not really going in nose first...it's just like almost like at an angle.

Which would either mean that the plane was in a severe yaw, or that it was coming towards the building at an angle despite Boger believeing it was coming straight in at closer to perpendicular to the building. Dom, who's post at http://forum.911movement.org/ar/t2263.htm I am using here, states that this description means a bank. Why do I have the feeling that Dom had never even haerd the term 'yaw' until recently?

 

[A W Smith]

You're not looking at the full quote. It's even more revealling.

I can't post links yet, but you can find this on John Farmer's website in the CMH FOIA section. It's NEIT299, an eyewitness account with the name redacted. Craig Ranke has identified NEIT299 as Sean Boger.

NEIT299 says:

[Redacted {Ranke identifies as Boger}] And so I am looking out at the road, and I see the traffic has liked stop, and I look out the window and I just hear a -- I just see like the nose and the wing of an aircraft just like coming right at us, and he didn't veer. And then you just heard the noise, and then he just smacked into the building, and when it hit the building, I am watching the plane go all the way into the building.
[Redacted {Interviewer}] Oh, my gosh.
[Sean Boger] So once the plane went into the building, it exploded, and once it exploded, I hit the floor and just covered up my head.

http://www.aal77.com/cmh_foia/neit299.doc

 

[jaydeehess]

http://z3.invisionfree.com/CIT/index.php?act=Print&client=printer&f=6&t=143

has the quote you show above.

Craig rewrites the statement to have Boger duck before the plane gets to the Pentagon.

It is one thing to say a person is mistaken, that they were fooled by illusionist tricks into not seeing a flyover. It is quite another to state that Boger is lieing, which is what Craig is saying with;

He admits to hitting the deck but strangely claims he did this AFTER watching the plane allegedly enter the building.
Since of course this is impossible with where he and everyone else saw the plane we have determined that he likely reacted as anybody would and hit the deck as soon as he realized there was a plane headed right towards him. (which is how he describes it and also how it would look approaching on the north side flight path)

 

[jaydeehess]

Note to Bitterman, if you are lurking.

The Boger quotes as to his seeing the plane enter the building and his hearing the metal grinding after he ducked, and his other quotes concerning his soild understanding that the plane did, in fact, hit and enter the building have been provided here as per your request at LC.

Still gonna follow the CiT party line?

 

[A W Smith]

http://z3.invisionfree.com/CIT/index.php?act=Print&client=printer&f=6&t=143

has the quote you show above.

Craig rewrites the statement to have Boger duck before the plane gets to the Pentagon.

It is one thing to say a person is mistaken, that they were fooled by illusionist tricks into not seeing a flyover. It is quite another to state that Boger is lieing, which is what Craig is saying with;

duck? duck to where? a plane is heading for you @ 530 mph. Where you gonna duck to? under a desk?

 

[Reheat]

I just got back from a lengthy trip to Ecuador. No, I didn't cause the Forum meltdown. Fnord.

Thanks for adding worthwhile comments to the insanity that pervades this place. Your comments are always interesting and add immeasurably to the purpose of this place. A very welcome respite from the usual troofer claptrap.

Of course, I agree with everything you've said. It would be great if more than %1 of troofers understood it!

 

[nicepants]

Hello JREF,

Just to give Aldo the ability to say he was right about at least one thing, I thought I'd create a JREF account now that I've been banned without warning over at LCF by JFK.

Actually, looks like you were just suspended by JFK for a week for stating that you believe Aldo is participating in a deception. (reported by Aldo)

Meanwhile, SPreston calls you a troll & a government shill and simply gets a written warning by JFK, no suspension, etc.

 

[jaydeehess]

duck? duck to where? a plane is heading for you @ 530 mph. Where you gonna duck to? under a desk?

I had actually started to write a post along the line of; 'if you understand you are about to die you might as well watch it happen rather than cower under a desk that you know will offer no protection at all'. He would have at most a few seconds to try and run (if a path actually presents itself). The average human can run at a top speed of about 10 MPH IIRC so in 5 seconds could get about 75 feet away. So Boger could not run, he's in a building, and closing his eyes would be as effective as ducking under a desk if indeed the plane is headed at him.

Instead Boger ducks after he knows that he is in danger only of flying debris. That is danger of injury whereas being hit by a 757 is absolute certain death.

then there is the 'this can't be happening' line of thought that makes people freeze. the impact possibly shakes him out of the 'deer in the headlights' moment and he then dives for cover from the debris/explosion.

Yet Craig would have us believe that it is unbelieveable that Boger did not duck and cover as sson as he sees the plane coming. Perhaps cowards are more quick to react in such a useless fashion and Boger is simply not a coward. Chuck Yeager was once asked if during any of the in flight difficulties he experienced did he panic. He replied that he was anxious but never paniced. Panic was useless and got in the way.

Speaking strictly for myself I know that my pragmatic, practical self would see it coming and flinch to run then stop, knowing full well that running or ducking would be useless if its coming at me and that I might as well watch it come. It would be absolutly fascinating and not everyone gets to go out of this world seeing such an awe inspiring sight.



This is the kind of event that falls between the instinctive reaction one operates on when , for eg. something enters our peripheral vision quickly and we jerk away, and seeing an incoming danger and knowing you have time to get out of harm's way. Boger would have time enough to understand what is happening and enough time to understand that he did not have time to get out of the way nor raise an alarm to others.

 

[e^n]

Can someone post them for him please? I just tried to post them here but I can't post links yet. If someone were to look at my messages from yesterday or before I am sure the links are there.

I posted the relevant link at the bottom of my latest post. Welcome to the forum.

 

[DGM]

duck? duck to where? a plane is heading for you @ 530 mph. Where you gonna duck to? under a desk?

Wasn't there a guy in the south (?) tower that did just that and survived? I can't remember his name.

 

[~enigma~]

Wasn't there a guy in the south (?) tower that did just that and survived? I can't remember his name.

Stanley Prainmath and the truther idiots call him a liar, shill and government agent.

 

[jaydeehess]

Wasn't there a guy in the south (?) tower that did just that and survived? I can't remember his name.

Yes, the plane missed him! Had anything hit his desk he'd have died there too.
He got lucky. He should never gamble again, slots, poker, lotteries. He has used up his lifetime allotment of luck already.

 

[Bobert]

OH SNAP!!!!!!!!!11!!!1!!!!!1!!!!!!!!1!!
http://s1.zetaboards.com/LooseChangeForums/single/?p=89946&t=337699

 

[DGM]

OH SNAP!!!!!!!!!11!!!1!!!!!1!!!!!!!!1!!
http://s1.zetaboards.com/LooseChangeForums/single/?p=89946&t=337699

What? Some of us can't see the stupidity directly (I'm banned).