Christopher Hitchens debates William Dembski on 11/18

[shadron]

Hitchens is such a powerful speaker, I can only guess that someone didn't do their homework when he was invited.

Perhaps I was unclear. When I said Hitchens was off the cuff, I meant that his debating was not delivered from notes; it was entirely extemporaneous, in contrast to Demski, who seemed to be reading speeches he wrote months ago. Demski was the one out to sea.

 

[shadron]

Seems that the College itself may have requested the removal to the person who made the videos available on YouTube (see red notice on the following page). Nonetheless, the full debate is available at their website in three parts:

http://www.pcawebcast.com/2010debate/

Not a college. The place is a megachurch in Ft Worth; the audience is an early teen group of parishoners at the church.

 

[Questioninggeller]

Not sure that new agers are proponents of creationism. But having been a Hindu and coming from India, I can tell you for a fact that while Hinduism has a creation myth like all religions, no one wishes it to be taught as fact in schools. They are very well aware that evolution makes more logical sense.

There are some people raised Christians who became Hindus and as Hindus reject evolution in favor of creationism. For example, Michael Cremo and Richard Thompson's Forbidden Archeology has a following among young Earth creationists like Kent Hovind and Carl Baugh.

 

[kuroyume0161]

Not a college. The place is a megachurch in Ft Worth; the audience is an early teen group of parishoners at the church.

Sorry. A bit late and I seem to have caught the advert at the top by accident.

 

[marplots]

I said, "Hitchens is such a powerful speaker, I can only guess that someone didn't do their homework when he was invited."

Then you said:

Perhaps I was unclear. When I said Hitchens was off the cuff, I meant that his debating was not delivered from notes; it was entirely extemporaneous, in contrast to Demski, who seemed to be reading speeches he wrote months ago. Demski was the one out to sea.

My phrasing was unclear. What I meant was that whoever invited Hitchens probably didn't know what they were in for. That's the person I think might not have done their homework.

So, I heartily agree. Dembski seemed to be phoning it in by way of his notes, while Hitchens was engaged and in touch -- best I've seen from him in awhile. I would very much like to hear what the students thought of it.

 

[Robert Oz]

Hitchens was engaged and in touch -- best I've seen from him in awhile.

It's such a joy listening to Hitchens do his thing... almost mesmerising.

Fellow forumites, what are some of your favourite Hitchens debates out there in Youtube land?

 

[Ocelot]

It's such a joy listening to Hitchens do his thing... almost mesmerising.

Fellow forumites, what are some of your favourite Hitchens debates out there in Youtube land?

The Inteligence squared debate on "Is the Catholic Church a force of good in the world" Where he spoke alongside Stephen Fry and against Ann Widecombe and Bishop John Onaiyekan

First part here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmFYpuYh6w0

 

[hgc]

The Inteligence squared debate on "Is the Catholic Church a force of good in the world" Where he spoke alongside Stephen Fry and against Ann Widecombe and Bishop John Onaiyekan

First part here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DmFYpuYh6w0

Ann Widdecombe is super-duper annoying, like nails on a chalkboard. The bishop is a yammering idiot.

 

[CurtC]

Not a college. The place is a megachurch in Ft Worth; the audience is an early teen group of parishoners at the church.

Close. Prestonwood Baptist Church is in west Plano, a suburb due north of Dallas, quite a way from Fort Worth.

The mostly teen audience were students of Prestonwood Christian Academy, a private school that's within the church.

By the way, kuroyume0161 linked to the debate at a hostmonster site, which seems to be down right now. Is that going to stay available?

 

[kuroyume0161]

Close. Prestonwood Baptist Church is in west Plano, a suburb due north of Dallas, quite a way from Fort Worth.

The mostly teen audience were students of Prestonwood Christian Academy, a private school that's within the church.

By the way, kuroyume0161 linked to the debate at a hostmonster site, which seems to be down right now. Is that going to stay available?

I don't know. The site link is to the Prestonwood Christian Academy (thus 'pca' in the URL). I guess they either are being hammered by people wanting to watch the webcast or think that it is becoming too negative for the purposes originally intended (too many people actually preferred Hitchens over their beloved Dumbski). ??

 

[phatred]

I watched half the video last night before bed, when I went on the Prestonwood website this mornining it said it has been temporarily removed. Does anyone have any other link to the video please?

 

[CurtC]

I just had a conversation with my friend who goes to Prestonwood Baptist Church, and whose daughter attends Prestonwood Christian Academy. In the midst of talking about other things, I brought it up.

Me: "Hey, your daughter still goes to PCA, right? I heard that Christopher Hitchens was there last week."

Him: "Is that the atheist?"

Me:"Yes, he was in a debate."

Him: [looking very serious] "And from what I heard from people who went to it [note: these would be his PBC friends], the atheist kicked the Christian's a**. I've talked to several people who went to see it, who were very dismayed about how it played out."

I added that Hitchens is a very impressive speaker, and that Dembski probably wasn't much match for him. But I was glad to see that apparently some of what Hitchens said sunk in. They're probably not going to be converted, but at least they've been exposed to good reasons, and shouldn't have the impression that atheists are just "mad at God" or whatever they usually think about us.

 

[Christian Klippel]

I just had a conversation with my friend who goes to Prestonwood Baptist Church, and whose daughter attends Prestonwood Christian Academy. In the midst of talking about other things, I brought it up.

[...snip...]

Thanks for sharing that. Good to hear that it seems it got some people thinking.

Do you think you could ask him one day what his friends thought about Dembski's "debating" style? That is, not debating at all but simply reading a script? Did they notice that and wondered why it was called a debate?

Greetings,

Chris

 

[Robin]

Ann Widdecombe is super-duper annoying, like nails on a chalkboard. The bishop is a yammering idiot.

Putting Ann Widdecombe in for the Catholics was throwing the debate.

I didn't think the bishop was an idiot. But what could he say?

 

[Robin]

Seems that the College itself may have requested the removal to the person who made the videos available on YouTube (see red notice on the following page). Nonetheless, the full debate is available at their website in three parts:

http://www.pcawebcast.com/2010debate/

Not any more. They are having to move it to a more powerful server.

They should just have left it on Youtube.

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Not any more. They are having to move it to a more powerful server.

"Junior's laptop is on fire, honey."

 

[soylent]

I always thought the christmas tree was a pagan thing?

Sort of. Evergreens(coniferous trees, mistletoes and so on) were seen by pagans as a symbol of renewal and as having some sort of power and/or energy to resist the cold, bleak darkness of mid winter. Cutting down a whole tree and dragging it into your dwelling is possibly a more modern invention.

Christmas presents doesn't appear to be christian either(e.g. see Saturnalia; but the romans probably stole it from someone else).

As already noted, the bible has things to say in condemnation of idols that may be interpreted as a christmas tree.

 

[Aepervius]

Not any more. They are having to move it to a more powerful server.

They should just have left it on Youtube.

Yep all I get is "accessW denied". Cue the conspiracy from me that it will not be put up again .

 

[CurtC]

Cutting down a whole tree and dragging it into your dwelling is possibly a more modern invention.

As the quote from the book of Jeremiah showed earlier in the thread, the Bible specifically talks about cutting down a tree then decorating it, as something the heathens do, so don't do that.

As already noted, the bible has things to say in condemnation of idols that may be interpreted as a christmas tree.

I have read before that some contorted interpretations of the Jeremiah passage argue that it's talking about idols and not decorated, chopped down trees, but that argument doesn't hold up to even slight scrutiny. Those verses are pretty plain - don't chop down trees, then fasten it in place (presumably a different place, like in town or your home), and decorate it.

Of course, that's the Old Testament, which Christians claim no longer applies to them, except the parts that they still like.

 

[jadey]

Yep all I get is "accessW denied". Cue the conspiracy from me that it will not be put up again .

They claim it will be available by Wednesday evening. It will be interesting to see if they provide a discussion forum, as I would love to hear the students reactions.