Christians Most Persecuted

[Psiload]

Yeah, that payback... it's a bitch.

 

[slingblade]

Well they must pretty bad at it then

Nope. One of them ruined my career. She was *very* good at it.

 

[Xephyr]

Woe is me...
Everyone's a victim...
Christian pope declares christians are most persecuted...

*yawns loudly*

 

[MG1962]

Nope. One of them ruined my career. She was *very* good at it.

Well if Christians are good at persecuting, explain the fact you even exist. I would expect something like 80 - 90% if the population to handle the other 10 - 20% with too much difficulty

 

[El Greco]

Actually there has been a BBC programme on that very subject.

 

[slingblade]

Well if Christians are good at persecuting, explain the fact you even exist. I would expect something like 80 - 90% if the population to handle the other 10 - 20% with too much difficulty

Look, I said my example was hyperbolic. I went for the extreme, to make a point.

But persecution isn't always about death, murder, or genocide.
It can also mean being denied a job, even though you are extremely qualified (top 4% in the nation in my skill area, thanks), because someone feels you think the wrong way about their beliefs.

 

[Aepervius]

Also, the early Christian church was a cult of martyrs. If I recall correctly early Christians did not consider a church to be sanctified until it had the body of a martyr buried in it (in or under the alter stone I think). This may have even led to early Christians purposefully insulting and aggravating the people in power in an attempt to create more martyrs.

It went as far as group of christian going to the local roman power and *asking* to be executed. I am not kidding you. Emperor or consul what-its-name executed some of them , and told the rest to go hang themselves.

 

[USEagle13]

I heard this last week and haven't seen a post.

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2010/12/16/pope-calls-christians-persecuted/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/16/AR2010121601955.html

The pope declares that Christians are the most persecuted. I've been more inclined to believe Christians have a persecution complex. According to the articles, he raises concerns about persecution of Christians in the Middle East. However, I don't see Christians any more persecuted than other groups who fall outside the mainstream group in a given cultural area. I suppose since Christians are the most populous religion, numerically they may be more persecuted because there are more of them.

What are others reactions?

While I do not always agree with the Pope.....

In a lot of Middle Eastern countries it is illegal to be found w/a Bible as well as even talking about Christianity in any positive manner. And in some countries Christians are killed at an alarming rate just for being Christian (kinda like a witch hunt).

Even in countries w/religious freedom it is very easy to find things everywhere in media and society in general that are very offensive to not only Christianity but even other religions.

This is the patience of the "Saints."

Matthew 11:6 "And blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me."

Luke 17:1 Then he said unto the disciples, "It is impossible but that offences will come: but woe unto him, through whom they come!"

Basically turn the other cheek and let God handle it.

Pope is just pointing it to anyone "not-in-the-know."

Most Christians should already know; or be aware of this as long as they can see or hear. Then again there is braille Bibles.

 

[slingblade]

In a lot of Middle Eastern countries it is illegal to be found w/a Bible as well as even talking about Christianity in any positive manner. And in some countries Christians are killed at an alarming rate just for being Christian (kinda like a witch hunt).

In a lot of Western countries, Muslims are being persecuted just for being Muslim. Kinda like a witch hunt.

Even in countries w/religious freedom it is very easy to find things everywhere in media and society in general that are very offensive to not only Christianity but even other religions.

Feeling offended isn't persecution.

(And I got news for ya--with nearly 80% of the US population claiming they're Christians, and 33% globally, a lot of Christians are actually involved in producing that offensive media. Chew on that.)

This is the patience of the "Saints."

Oh, they ran out of patience when god sent Katrina to destroy their stadium.

Matthew 11:6 "And blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me."

Luke 17:1 Then he said unto the disciples, "It is impossible but that offences will come: but woe unto him, through whom they come!"

Basically turn the other cheek and let God handle it.

Pope is just pointing it to anyone "not-in-the-know."

Most Christians should already know; or be aware of this as long as they can see or hear. Then again there is braille Bibles.

Oh, yes, please do let god handle it. By all means. That should be quite effective, and we should see marked change in attitudes very soon.

 

[USEagle13]

Not to be confused with prosecution.

Persecution is the systematic mistreatment of an individual or group by another group. The most common forms are religious persecution, ethnic persecution, and political persecution, though there is naturally some overlap between these terms. The inflicting of suffering, harassment, isolation, imprisonment, fear, pain or exclusion


Those so-called Christians that help promote those offences for false monetary profit are "wolves in sheep's clothing"

 

[angrysoba]

I think there's a fair bit of truth in it. Remember that the Pope is specifically talking about the Middle East where there is persecution and indeed in places like Iraq, Palestine and maybe Iran there is a lot of persecution of Christians.

That said, it is probably more dangerous to be Jewish.

Also for those who are glibly mocking the persecution of Christians in these parts, the alternative is to change your name which will mark you as a Christian and become a Muslim so it's not as if someone is bringing discomfort upon themselves by being Christian.

 

[USEagle13]

In a lot of Western countries, Muslims are being persecuted just for being Muslim. Kinda like a witch hunt.

No one is dragging Muslims out of their houses and murdering them for being Muslim or having a Koran in any Western countries I'm aware of.

The area I live in has a decent Muslim population compared to other areas, With many owning business and such; and everyone gets along fine.

And as far as the western "media" is concerned its an unwritten law now that you can make fun of any religious deity except Allah in "any" setting.

Why is this? Militant extremists use their threats and physical attacks to force us to change free speech policy.

Basically if your Muslim you need not worry as long as you do not have ties to militant groups. Same as any religion.

 

[HansMustermann]

It does, you're right, and the bible itself tells them that they will be persecuted for their faith, so they are set-up to expect it.

Actually, it seems to me like "help, the minority is oppressing us" is such a general trope, that I wouldn't even blame it on the bible. In fact, the quote that best defines that trope isn't from Matthew or Mark or Luke, but from Göring: "voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

That's it. If you can't say "let's go lynch some blacks" or "let's burn a few atheists" any more, you frame it as an us-vs-them situation where "them" are attacking "us". It becomes "help, the blacks are oppressing us whites" or "help, the atheists are oppressing us Christians." It's pretty much Bigotry 101 material by now.

And again, you can see it in action in lots of domains that weren't told by any sacred text to expect persecution. E.g.,

"Help, the women/feminists are oppressing us men! And they ruined the economy too by getting their own jobs!"

"Help, the Mexicans are trying to destroy our culture and push us out of our jobs!" (And before, it was the Irish, Chinese, and whatever.)

"Help, the libruls are trying to destroy the economy, kill your grandma, and sell America to the NWO!"

Etc.

 

[slingblade]

No one is dragging Muslims out of their houses and murdering them for being Muslim or having a Koran in any Western countries I'm aware of.

Persecute, (verb):

To pursue in a manner to injure, grieve, or afflict; to beset with cruelty or malignity; to harass; especially, to afflict, harass, punish, or put to death for adherence to a particular religious creed or mode of worship; To harass with importunity [...]

Can you see now that killing is only one means of persecution?
People don't have to be killed to be persecuted. They may be afflicted, harassed, or punished, as well, and not be killed. They may be denied housing, employment, promotion, and other civil or social benefits, based solely on their beliefs or the lack thereof. All of that is persecution, not just death.

Is this clear, now?

The area I live in has a decent Muslim population compared to other areas, With many owning business and such; and everyone gets along fine.

That it's not happening in your neighborhood, doesn't mean it's not happening at all. It may even be happening in your area, and you simply aren't aware.

And as far as the western "media" is concerned its an unwritten law now that you can make fun of any religious deity except Allah in "any" setting.

Why is this? Militant extremists use their threats and physical attacks to force us to change free speech policy.

Oh, yes, that has happened.

However, some Christians have also tried to force "policy" changes through threats or physical attacks. Some Christians have murdered abortion doctors, or bombed abortion clinics, or simply harassed the women who go to them, for instance. That many or most do not doesn't mean there are none who do.

Basically if your Muslim you need not worry as long as you do not have ties to militant groups.

Most people who persecute Muslims for being Muslim rarely check out their victim's possible ties to militant groups beforehand.

Same as any religion.

The same as any religion? How about Christianity, for example?

http://www.goddiscussion.com/15388/dispatches-return-to-africas-witch-children/

A year ago, Dispatches told the story of how children in Africa's Niger Delta were being denounced by Christian pastors as witches and wizards, and then killed, tortured or abandoned by their own families. All of this was done in the name of God and Christianity.

The original film caused international outrage.

Children as young as two years old are still being denounced as witches and wizards today … and horrific abuse continues. Five to six children are branded as witches every single day. Local schools refuse to accept children who have been branded witches, so the only educational opportunities come from charity.

An influx of Pentecostal Christianity has created extremism in many areas of Nigeria, and coupled with basic African superstitious beliefs, has prompted the increasing accusations of witchcraft.

The point being that no group, no ideology, no system of belief, is free from fanatics who persecute others. No one has exclusivity in this.

 

[slingblade]

Actually, it seems to me like "help, the minority is oppressing us" is such a general trope, that I wouldn't even blame it on the bible.

I can agree with most of what you said; however, I'm not exactly blaming the bible. I'm simply reminded of all the times I was in church and listened to the pastor exhorting us that we would be persecuted for our beliefs, and citing the verses.

Matthew 5:10-12 was especially quoted:
"Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness’ sake, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are you when they revile and persecute you, and say all kinds of evil against you falsely for My sake. Rejoice and be exceedingly glad, for great is your reward in heaven...."

I heard it so often that I actually began to look for it, but aside from a few kids in school (also Christians, oddly enough), I don't recall being persecuted, or even made fun of, for my beliefs.

 

[Weak Kitten]

It went as far as group of christian going to the local roman power and *asking* to be executed. I am not kidding you. Emperor or consul what-its-name executed some of them , and told the rest to go hang themselves.

I'm so glad someone else remembers this. My source was a book on the history of early Christianity that I borrowed for a friend. Much to my embarrassment I cannot remember the title or author (sad too, it was quite well written).

You wouldn't happen to remember your source would you? Most people would not believe that this was a historic fact, it's just too outlandish!

 

[blutoski]

Yeah, like others, I'm no fan of the Vatican, but I think the Pope is technically accurate with this statement.

I remember back in the '90s when the Taliban in Afghanistan were hanging Christian missionaries from construction cranes as public displays. Bibles burned in public bonfires. (We really need to get these people HBO or something.)

There's no denying that the West gives non-Christians plenty of grief, but those Islamist theocracies really get down to business. Not to mention China and its state anti-religion policy.

 

[MattusMaximus]

Christians aren't persecuted. There are billions of Christians. How could they be persecuted? In my opinion they do the persecuting.

To be fair, just imagine yourself as a Christian in modern-day Iraq - let's say they have a tough time of it.

That said, the "Christians are persecuted" meme that gets tossed around in modern U.S. politics is just a whiny attempt to have it both ways. Such whiners announce loudly that "U.S. is a Christian nation" (that is, it is founded upon their idea of fundamentalist Christianity) and then moan & groan about how "Christians are persecuted" in the U.S. Agatha's graphic in post #2 above says it best

 

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Christians do get attacked. Oddly enough it's not atheists doing the attack most often. This may be such a case.

Egypt bomb kills 17 at Alexandria Coptic church

 

[Marduk]

Many are in areas where they are the religious minority. Do you really think that a Christian in the middle of, say, Iran is going to have the same level of dominance and acceptance as one in the US?

To be fair, just imagine yourself as a Christian in modern-day Iraq - let's say they have a tough time of it.

then that is what "requesting asylum" is for