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Christian Ninja Greg Park aka ChosonNinja

scottbaioisdead

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Dec 29, 2008
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This is my first post here so i don't know if it's been covered before, there's a new breed of internet ninja guru touting Jesus and magical chi power and amassing a cult following of 24000 fans who reject anything scientific that disproves their master. this guy is a serious danger as children fall for this garbage "martial art" which he says is secret korean ninjutsu spread during the invasions of korea, i debunked his "chi spinner" with a video of my own as well as the old needle through the arm trick, but he has posted a few more nonsense videos that it would be nice if someone could respond to as he has blocked me and every other critic. it's the usual chi stuff break a brick with a glass, immovable arm and body physics that people don't want to accept as physics, heres his channel on youtube chosonninja mine is scottbaioisdead if you want to see any of my attacks on his brand of garbage. have fun guys, maybe we can get him to use his chi in the randi challenge
 
Ninjutsu most certainly were not impacted in any great way by Korean martial arts, and if they really mean a martial art from Korean, than ninjutsu would be the completely wrong word for it.

Ninjutsu traditions were influenced by many Chinese martial arts, as well as home-brewed techniques combined with anything that worked. The modern ninjutsu draws from the 'anything that works' part, and could be used to describe any modern stealth based combat or infiltration system. A revival of this tradition is ongoing with organizations such as SWAN. http://www.ninjitsuwarrior.com/index.html
 
You're correct ninjutsu was based on the Sonshi a Chinese classic specifically the Yohan 13th chapter dealing with spies. The idea of "modern" ninjutsu is nonsense to me. Ninja were specific people who performed specific tasks at a specific period in Japanese history. People like Greg Park are trying to make a few bucks off it, some of the jokes on youtube seriously think that entwining fingers will make them see in the dark or become invisible or even stop someone from attacking them. I try to handle these...I can't think of a word I can say legally that's still acceptable on a forum my usual Penn Jillette phrase won't fly, and I've been sued once by a "ninja" don't wanna let it happen again, but I try to handle these people by showing the facts about ninjutsu how it basically no longer exists outside the Bujinkan. Greg and a few others tied Jesus to ninjutsu saying there were Christian ninja who were persecuted, so if an atheist comments on them they play the religion card. America really needs a governing body for martial arts to prevent these people from preying on the uninformed
 
I'm talking about semantics. The term 'ninjutsu' was actually applied to many different and distinct codified fighting systems, and the modern use of the term is about that 'whatever works' history of some of those systems.

Modern ninjutsu talking about finger wagging techniques and other ninja magic (nin po) that ancient ninja used for a psychological advantage is just a few people trying to make a buck off of it. However, the people trying to keep alive the specific codified systems, like Bujinkan (who I have to thank for making Cheness produce a top notch ninja sword) and the Iga traditionalist, do have the best claim to the term 'ninjutsu'.

That doesn't mean I'm about to say that groups taking that 'anything goes' approach and finding what they believe to be the point of the warrior core of ninjutsu can't use the term either. The term means, and has meant, a hell of a lot of things to a hell of a lot of different groups. Hell, the Saiga (Saika) were at times, Buddhist ninja pirate snipers.

As for a governing body for accreditation, many groups use the Japanese ones. Seems reasonable enough.
 
just on a side note about martial arts trickery, does anyone know the trick to throwing a needle through glass? I've been throwing shuriken for years and i've seen some shaolin monks do the fake version, covering up a hole in the glass that the show to examiners, then another monk holds a balloon behind the glass and pops it with a needle held in his hand and then uses the needle to thread thread through the premade hole to show a needle thrown by the performer has passed though, but theres another version where you can't see a hole and a balloon is taped to a glass not held by anyone, this one i can't figure out, even with fake glass throwing a small needle is hard.
 
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tyr_13 said:
Ninjutsu most certainly were not impacted in any great way by Korean martial arts, and if they really mean a martial art from Korean, than ninjutsu would be the completely wrong word for it.

Ninjutsu traditions were influenced by many Chinese martial arts, as well as home-brewed techniques combined with anything that worked. The modern ninjutsu draws from the 'anything that works' part, and could be used to describe any modern stealth based combat or infiltration system. A revival of this tradition is ongoing with organizations such as SWAN. http://www.ninjitsuwarrior.com/index.html
Click to expand...

Are these guys purporting to be bujinkan affiliated, because if not, that makes me wonder....
 
scottbaioisdead said:
just on a side note about martial arts trickery, does anyone know the trick to throwing a needle through glass? I've been throwing shuriken for years and i've seen some shaolin monks do the fake version, covering up a hole in the glass that the show to examiners, then another monk holds a balloon behind the glass and pops it with a needle held in his hand and then uses the needle to thread thread through the premade hole to show a needle thrown by the performer has passed though, but theres another version where you can't see a hole and a balloon is taped to a glass not held by anyone, this one i can't figure out, even with fake glass throwing a small needle is hard.
Click to expand...

A needle / airgun pellet / any small projectile fired from off camera / off stage?
 
mikeyx said:
Are these guys purporting to be bujinkan affiliated, because if not, that makes me wonder....
Click to expand...

No, not that I'm aware of. However, I would be extremely loyal to any company that sent me on team building exercises to ninja camp, traditional or not. (You listening Wal-Mart Stores Inc?) I get the feeling that SWAN uses the term 'ninjustu' because 1. it sells, and 2. there really isn't any other term that comes close to what they are doing.

That said, I haven't gone out of my way yet to dig into SWAN's background or reviews. It is just something my brother found and thought would be neat.

Oh, and, STOP LOOKING AT ME SWAN! There, I said it. Now no one else has to.
 
It says "master camenisch is a certified(by whom?) modern ninjitsu(sic) instructor" after stating that ninjutsu was dead. so he basically said he studied and found something didn't exist but somehow magically certified him in the thing he said didn't exist. It looks like the standard case of throw a bunch of garbage together and call it ninjutsu because that name sells and people want to live out a ninja fantasy. Most of us call this LARPing. It looks like an attempt at SEALs hell week or SERE school, while pretending to be Japanese.
 
scottbaioisdead said:
It says "master camenisch is a certified(by whom?) modern ninjitsu(sic) instructor" after stating that ninjutsu was dead. so he basically said he studied and found something didn't exist but somehow magically certified him in the thing he said didn't exist. It looks like the standard case of throw a bunch of garbage together and call it ninjutsu because that name sells and people want to live out a ninja fantasy. Most of us call this LARPing. It looks like an attempt at SEALs hell week or SERE school, while pretending to be Japanese.
Click to expand...

I still maintain that ninjutsu is the proper term here, or at least an accurate one. They aren't pretending to be Japanese, and on that same page they make a pretty big deal about it drawing in techniques from all over the world. Calling it SEAL's hell week or SERE school would be less accurate because, those things exist as actual programs.

I'd actually like to try LARPing and have been looking into it. To call SWAN LARP is insulting to both. People who want to live out a ninja fantasy would be drawn to a romanticized version of traditional martial arts, not something that is supposed to be an evolving and modern form.
 
ninjutsu is the proper term here the same way african american is the proper term for dave matthews, both fit the description of the term but theres a huge common sense difference
 
wow i didn't even see the part about ninja mind science on the swan site.
* Psychic Attack and defense
* Divination
* Lucid Dreaming
* Telepathy
* Psychometry
* Students that are spiritually ready may chose to undergo an initiation into deeper levels of esoteric knowledge.
 
Let this be a lesson to me; always look into the people you are defending.

However, ninjustu just as accurately describes what he is doing as saying 'kung-fu' or martial art. The terms don't actually mean what people think they do. Common sense is often just plain wrong. People we called ninja and practicing ninjutsu often didn't call themselves that.

And yeah, Dave Matthews is African-American. What's your point?
 
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