Thanks for your reply, ilk. Previously, you had mentioned....
ilk said:
I am perfectly happy living my life in a completely non spiritual way, instead focusing on what I feel is positive for society.
Followed by...
ilk said:
Out of interest, why can I never win a Nobel peace prize or be "elected office" for my community? Because I am not "spritual"? What if by simply being a good person and doing good things I vastly improve the human condition, causing an end to war? Would I be eligible then? What makes me being a good person, just because I think it is right, somehow inferior to someone who is good because they think it's what a giant beard in the sky wants them to do?
Hmmm....you're perfectly happy living your life in completely non-spiritual way, and that's all well and good; I'm all for that, don't get me wrong. But you would do that instead of focusing on what you feel is positive for society? (these are YOUR words, not mine).
Of course I didn't mean to sound bitter and condescending in my previous post. Just so you know, my intent on these forums is to discuss such matters in a purely civil, intelligent, rationally coherent and respectful manner. I have no use for deliberate insults or ego bashing. With that said...and with all due respect:
Don't you think that was just a little bit on the selfish side when you said "...instead of focusing on I feel is positive for society?" Just thought I'd like to point out this little inconsistency on your part.
Again, I have absolutely no problems whatsoever even if that was the case; I personally know of people who don't even bother to vote and could care less about what goes on in the world around them...yet they are good, decent and honest hard working people. While I don't personally agree with that kind of naive and simplistic lifesytle myself, as long as they're honest, respectful and tolerant of others, what more could I ask of them?
Now think about this: Would Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. ever get to where he got thinking this way? Most likely not. He CLEARLY focused on what was positive for society ---regardless of his religious/spiritual beliefs.
I'm not the one to get all angry and upset at anyone who doesn't believe in god (or as you'd like to refer whatever he/she/it/they might be as "a giant beard in the sky" ---personally, I'd prefer a Jimi Hendrix style afro myself, but then again that's just my opinion

) So you can think and believe in whatever you want, I don't care. All that I (or anyone else for that matter) could ask of you is that you treat your fellow man with fairness, respect, tolerance, and dignity ---god or no god.
And if winning the Nobel Peace prize is your goal, I honestly and sincerely wish you nothing but the best of luck!
ilk said:
Regarding Mr. Covey, I am extremely wary of anyone who wants to sell me something. I would be much more receptive to you being proselytical about the actual methods, reducing the risk of promoting a cult of personality.
First off, Steven Covey does have a PhD, so perhaps it's more appropriate to refer to him as Dr. Covey. Secondly, for the record, I don't make a single red penny by promoting his website or any of his books. His ideals are simply those that I believe in most because they are time tested principles that have been proven to work for people of all different ethnic, cultural and religious backgrounds, time and time again ---and all presented in a rationally well written manner that doesn't even touch the topic of god or religion (well, honestly, except for the acknowledgement section where he "thanks god." But I'm sure most atheists can ignore that!)
And who said anything about spending money? Why not go to your local library and check it out for FREE? That way, even if you still have any doubts that I'm making any money off his products, I'd be GUARANTEED not to make a single penny by you reading his book. Sound fair?
Wishing you and yours a lifetime of wellness and prosperity, I remain...
TommyZ