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Celibacy for priests

SimonJohnMorgan

New Blood
Joined
Nov 27, 2002
Messages
19
I think I remember hearing/reading somewhere that the catholic church only said priests had to be single some stage in the middle ages, and this was because they were worried about losing land when they married, although I would imagine they made another reason up to justify it (i.e. say God said so)

Anyone know the facts?
 
SimonJohnMorgan said:
I think I remember hearing/reading somewhere that the catholic church only said priests had to be single some stage in the middle ages, and this was because they were worried about losing land when they married, although I would imagine they made another reason up to justify it (i.e. say God said so)

Anyone know the facts?

That's pretty much as I understand it too. the whole thing was about not losing property to a priest's off-spring or other dependants when he died.
 
Anyone know any more details than Hypocolius or myself?

At this rate I'm going to have to do a search on the web, and actively try and find out ... :eek:
 
SimonJohnMorgan said:
Anyone know any more details than Hypocolius or myself?

I'll have to start this reply by issuing the disclaimer that I have slept a little less than one hour last night so mistakes are more than possible.

The thing with priesthood and celibacy started out as an ideal in a very early period, by the 4th century at latest. Celibacy was encouraged for all clergy but required only for bishops and higher-ups.

The situation continued so for a long time but with the raise of the feudal system when kings and other nobles bestowed land to church there became the problem that in some places the church land became de facto heriditary. Some land was also lost when a priest-father gave it as inheritance to sons who were not clergymen themselves. The church fought against this progression by issuing a number of orders where it was explicitly made forbidden to have a son take his fathers job in church.

The complete marriage ban came in the 11th century as a result of so-called Clunyan Reformation movement that called for purifying the church from earthly influences. The movement was started in the 10th century in the rich monastery of Cluny. The change wasn't quick, and it took many decades if not centuries before there were no officially-married priests left. And they never really managed to get rid of "live-in housekeepers".
 
This is an area I believe that the Catholic church has been throughout history completely inconsistent about. Even in recent times it shows a remarkable ability to hold two beliefs simultaneously that contradict each other.

Recently in the UK for instance it has ordained Anglican priests who are married who have converted to Catholicism..

http://www.cwnews.com/news/viewrec.cfm?RefNum=7752

Also when the church was driven "underground" in Eastern block countries it allowed its priests to be married, but then changed it's mind.

http://www.byzcath.org/news/Poland/980511_Poland.htm


Celibacy seems to be a matter of convenience for the Catholic Church depending on the circumstances.
 
Universal phrase

Celibacy seems to be a matter of convenience for the Catholic Church depending on the circumstances

should be changed to

_________ (Fill in holy tenet) seems to be a matter of convenience for the __________ (fill in denominational description) Church depending on the circumstances.

Isn't this true for all religions? They all have a plethora of important rules and tenets to live by until it is inconvenient and then it is changed.

It is this kind of thing that makes me feel that no one really believes any of it. They all pay lip service and it is real important until it becomes inconvenient or doesn't fit the social culture of the day. Then the timeless rules and practices are easily changed.

What happened to eating fish on Fridays? We used to do it diligently in my house. It was important to observe that tenet. Does anyone pay attention to that anymore.


Bentspoon
 
From what I can gather, the rule imposing celibacy upon priests is not a tenet of Catholicism; it’s an administrative policy adopted by the Church. For Catholic priests, there’s obviously a theological dimension to celibacy that links the practice to venerable traditions of asceticism, but primarily it’s a matter of discipline and practicality in view of the demands the priesthood places on individuals and their personal lives. By way of analogy, consider the various restrictions on marriage that historically have been associated with military service in certain contexts.

Like any administrative policy, its scope of application is not absolute (for example, for various historical reasons, it applies strictly only to the Western Latin Rite and not other rites of the Catholic Church) and departures from the rule are made in the interests of expediency (for example, where an already-married Anglican priest converts).

Since administrative policies are first and foremost adopted for pragmatic reasons, the fact that exceptions are “a matter of convenience depending on the circumstances” is self-evident. That’s not hypocritical, it’s perfectly logical. Given that clerical celibacy is in no way an article of faith, I don’t see why its application or non-application should give rise to Darat’s inference regarding the Church’s “remarkable ability to hold two beliefs simultaneously that contradict each other.”
 
As a catholic friend told me about a number of subjects. "Its not biblical and it doesnt have to make sense, its catholicism."
 

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