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Caster Semenya should not be subject to testes

Matty1973

Critical Thinker
M
Joined
Mar 27, 2005
Messages
253
My sympathies do go out to the poor girl in the middle of it all, but this slip of the tongue by a BBC reporter did make me smile.

 
Yes :) -Testosterone must have been high on his mind.

But seriousy, don't you think it is unfair to the girls in the race to be beaten by a person that Hormonally is a man and that has the corresponding muscle structure? I'm not advocating to take his/her medal away, done is done but i don't think that she/he should be allowed to compete against women.
 
Ove said:
Yes :) -Testosterone must have been high on his mind.

But seriousy, don't you think it is unfair to the girls in the race to be beaten by a person that Hormonally is a man and that has the corresponding muscle structure? I'm not advocating to take his/her medal away, done is done but i don't think that she/he should be allowed to compete against women.
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Couldn't agree more.
 
Ove said:
Yes :) -Testosterone must have been high on his mind.

But seriousy, don't you think it is unfair to the girls in the race to be beaten by a person that Hormonally is a man and that has the corresponding muscle structure? I'm not advocating to take his/her medal away, done is done but i don't think that she/he should be allowed to compete against women.
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So she should be allowed to compete against men? I can't help but assume that such a thing would never happen. Also, this makes me wonder if this case will lead to somekind of official definition of what biology you need to qualify as male or female athlete.

Heck, is there even 100% working definition of what biology you need to qualify as a man or a woman? Seems like however you cut it a lot of individuals will be left drifting in "gender limbo".
 
Ove said:
But seriousy, don't you think it is unfair to the girls in the race to be beaten by a person that Hormonally is a man and that has the corresponding muscle structure? I'm not advocating to take his/her medal away, done is done but i don't think that she/he should be allowed to compete against women.
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I hear what you're saying, but where do you draw the line? Is it fair to swimmers to be beaten by Michael Phelps, whose physiology is extremely unusual and makes him ideally suited to swimming? Is it fair to Usain Bolt's competitors that he's so lanky and has extremely long legs? Where do we draw the line between a legitimate genetic advantage and an unfair one?
 
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Ian Osborne said:
I hear what you're saying, but where do you draw the line? Is it fair to swimmers to be beaten by Michael Phelps, whose physiology is extremely unusual and makes him ideally suited to swimming? Is it fair to Usain Bolt's competitors that he's so lanky and has extremely long legs? Where do we draw the line between a legitimate genetic advantage and an unfair one?
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This would be a valid point if, on average, men did not have physiological advantages over women.
 
lionking said:
This would be a valid point if, on average, men did not have physiological advantages over women.
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I can see your point, but a top-class female athlete must have physiological advantages over other women too. Where do you draw the line? When do those advantages become unfair?
 
Ove said:
Yes :) -Testosterone must have been high on his mind.

But seriousy, don't you think it is unfair to the girls in the race to be beaten by a person that Hormonally is a man and that has the corresponding muscle structure? I'm not advocating to take his/her medal away, done is done but i don't think that she/he should be allowed to compete against women.
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Don't you think it is unfair for short people to have to compete with tall people in running events?
 
lionking said:
This would be a valid point if, on average, men did not have physiological advantages over women.
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All top athlets have physiological advatages over average people. No matter how much I trained I would never have made much of a runner, is that fair?

You are thinking that some physiological advantages are fair and some unfair. How do you draw the line.
 
Men should compete against men, women against women. It's reasonably clear that Semenya is not a biological woman.
 
lionking said:
Men should compete against men, women against women. It's reasonably clear that Semenya is not a biological woman.
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Ah proving yourself by blind assertion.

Why is men compeating against men and women compeating against women fair but ignoreing many other things that create significant benefits fine? Why was it fair to have someone as gifted physologicaly as Phelps compete againt those less physiologicaly gifted?
 
lionking said:
I'll wait until there is a serious post on this matter before responding.
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I am serious. You are giving more weight to some physological advantages while ignoring others, but are not giving any rational for your distinctions.
 
lionking said:
It's reasonably clear that Semenya is not a biological woman.
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Is it? Does too much testosterone or whatever stop her being a woman, despite having a vagina and a womb? If men have physiological advantages over women, it's reasonable to assume all top female athletes must have traits bringing them closer to what we call a man than most women. Again, where do you draw the line?
 
Ian Osborne said:
Is it? Does too much testosterone or whatever stop her being a woman, despite having a vagina and a womb? If men have physiological advantages over women, it's reasonable to assume all top female athletes must have traits bringing them closer to what we call a man than most women. Again, where do you draw the line?
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Tell me, were you happy with the East German "female" athetes winning Gold Medals in the 1970's?
 
Ian Osborne said:
Is it? Does too much testosterone or whatever stop her being a woman, despite having a vagina and a womb? If men have physiological advantages over women, it's reasonable to assume all top female athletes must have traits bringing them closer to what we call a man than most women. Again, where do you draw the line?
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You've missed a word there... It is understandable, because it would invalidate your argument. Female athletes might be closer to a man than to a woman, but are no closer to male athletes than an average woman to an average man.
 
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