Can Trudeau Beat the Conservatives? Canadian Election... 2015?

[Horatius]

Horatius, I don't think it's necessarily that Canadians will care or not about experience. Rather, from what I've seen, it's just not an issue that makes or breaks elections. If he's better at the political game than Harper, he can win.

Is he? Those other guys weren't. We're going to have to find out.

Well, so far he seems ahead on points. The simple fact that the Conservatives came right out with attack ads against him, and sleazy ones at that, even though there's no election on, struck me as incredibly petty of them, and Trudeau's response clearly made him look like the more magnanimous person.

 

[squealpiggy]

Well, so far he seems ahead on points. The simple fact that the Conservatives came right out with attack ads against him, and sleazy ones at that, even though there's no election on, struck me as incredibly petty of them, and Trudeau's response clearly made him look like the more magnanimous person.

I wouldn't say that. My wife is a lifelong liberal and a teacher, and she thought the ads were funny and to the point.

Me, I thought they were silly and unproductive.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Here is the actual editorial.

And?

Two weeks ago the Canadian Science Writers’ Association, the World Federation of Science Journalists and several other groups sent an open letter to Harper, calling on him to unmuzzle federal scientists.

I strongly dislike the Star.

So what?

Can they do absolutely nothing right in your mind?

 

[squealpiggy]

And?

And nothing. I strongly dislike the Star. If it makes it any easier I also dislike the Sun.

So what?

Can they do absolutely nothing right in your mind?

Well they routinely give a platform to that clown (former Toronto mayor) John Sewell who has set up some committee on policing (committee members: John Sewell) despite his only qualification in the field being that he hates police. That should sum up their position of bias for you.

I figured that the actual editorial would provide a better baseline for the feelings of scientists than an editorial of an editorial in a left wing newspaper.

 

[Jimbo07]

Whether you like this ad or not, this is a different approach than the Conservatives. The problem with taking the high road is that you have to keep on that message. If you let the negativism overwhelm you, you become just another wannabe high-road has-been. He may want to be trying to send that new, young, dynamic message, but this is going to be a tough game to play.

The only saving grace is that it's more tactical than anything any of Harper's other opponents are offering (I really don't think Mulcair can sustain the Orange Crush, esp. in Quebec). For example, you're better off trying to own any of the issues your opponents could use against you (i.e. I'm proud to be a teacher, I'm a son (P.E.T. unsaid), I'm here to serve, etc.) It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out.

Love it or loathe it, Trudeau's response.

Just reading through his bio, I think he'll have a tougher time beating down the label of dilettante. I'd try to argue that he has a variety of experiences and perspectives (and, in some regards, mirrors my own life!).

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

And nothing. I strongly dislike the Star. If it makes it any easier I also dislike the Sun.

Well. I'm glad you cleared that up.

Well they routinely give a platform to that clown (former Toronto mayor) John Sewell who has set up some committee on policing (committee members: John Sewell) despite his only qualification in the field being that he hates police. That should sum up their position of bias for you.

Do you not think that maybe that's a rather small sample size?

I figured that the actual editorial would provide a better baseline for the feelings of scientists than an editorial of an editorial in a left wing newspaper.

And what did it say that was different? Geez.

 

[Horatius]

Love it or loathe it, Trudeau's response.

Just reading through his bio, I think he'll have a tougher time beating down the label of dilettante. I'd try to argue that he has a variety of experiences and perspectives (and, in some regards, mirrors my own life!).

Yeah, and he kind of stepped in it a bit with that ad. "I worked hard to be the choice of Liberals". Well, no, the point is, you actually didn't.

Other than that, it seems okay. I hope the high road keeps up.

 

[TubbaBlubba]

Trudeau must have the worst barber in Canada.


What the hell, he's leader of a political party! Can't he at least get his hair cut, properly and regularly?

 

[lane99]

No, he can't win. Except for perhaps in the boxing ring, he's no match, in any other way, for Harper.

So Harper, at the polls, will KO Trudeau, just as he did the previous Great White Liberal Hope.

And, btw, let's remember the Liberals are a rump party now. The better question will be can Trudeau even beat the NDP.

 

[squealpiggy]

Whether you like this ad or not, this is a different approach than the Conservatives. The problem with taking the high road is that you have to keep on that message. If you let the negativism overwhelm you, you become just another wannabe high-road has-been. He may want to be trying to send that new, young, dynamic message, but this is going to be a tough game to play.

The only saving grace is that it's more tactical than anything any of Harper's other opponents are offering (I really don't think Mulcair can sustain the Orange Crush, esp. in Quebec). For example, you're better off trying to own any of the issues your opponents could use against you (i.e. I'm proud to be a teacher, I'm a son (P.E.T. unsaid), I'm here to serve, etc.) It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out.

Love it or loathe it, Trudeau's response.

Just reading through his bio, I think he'll have a tougher time beating down the label of dilettante. I'd try to argue that he has a variety of experiences and perspectives (and, in some regards, mirrors my own life!).

Although the Liberal ad takes the high road he always seems a bit amateur dramatics. In his head he's making the rousing speech before the climax of a war movie, but in reality he's in drama club making the rousing speech before the bell goes for recess.

And that's not about his age, it's about his acting ability.

By the way he's sat in a classroom because he's a teacher, I get that. But he taught drama. What's with the equations on the board behind him?

 

[lopeyschools]

Yeah, and he kind of stepped in it a bit with that ad. "I worked hard to be the choice of Liberals". Well, no, the point is, you actually didn't.

Other than that, it seems okay. I hope the high road keeps up.

More like he simply waited while the other liberal leaders and power players were gored to death in the political thunderdome.

 

[Jimbo07]

No, he can't win. Except for perhaps in the boxing ring, he's no match, in any other way, for Harper.

So Harper, at the polls, will KO Trudeau, just as he did the previous Great White Liberal Hope.

And, btw, let's remember the Liberals are a rump party now. The better question will be can Trudeau even beat the NDP.

So, do you have a reason to believe this, or is this just what you want to happen? At the moment, Trudeau himself (although maybe not his economic policy) is polling higher than both Harper and Mulcair. There's a reason Harper's going after him.

You may be right, but on what basis do you make your assertions?

By the way he's sat in a classroom because he's a teacher, I get that. But he taught drama. What's with the equations on the board behind him?

That's what I'm trying to dig up. What did he teach? His own site says he taught French and Math. A HuffPo article says he taught drama, but also taught math. I agree with their point, though. What's wrong with teaching drama?

Also, if this is high school, teachers are often brought in as ringers for other subjects. He wasn't teaching a graduate course in quantum field theory!

More like he simply waited while the other liberal leaders and power players were gored to death in the political thunderdome.

That is a valid strategy. It worked for Ed Stelmach in Alberta... came right up the middle at the convention, didn't he?

 

[Horatius]

That's what I'm trying to dig up. What did he teach? His own site says he taught French and Math. A HuffPo article says he taught drama, but also taught math. I agree with their point, though. What's wrong with teaching drama?

Well, in their defense, it is a lot harder to convey "Drama" on a blackboard

Also, if this is high school, teachers are often brought in as ringers for other subjects. He wasn't teaching a graduate course in quantum field theory!

Indeed. My grade 9 math teacher, where you'd do the sorts of simple algebra shown in the add, was normally the art teacher. And it showed!

 

[Segnosaur]

That's what I'm trying to dig up. What did he teach? His own site says he taught French and Math. A HuffPo article says he taught drama, but also taught math. I agree with their point, though. What's wrong with teaching drama?

I think the theory is that if you're only teaching drama, then you might have very limited skills with which to deal with the problems that Canada has to deal with.

If someone were a businessman, or at least taught economics, they could understand financial issues better. If someone taught science or math, they might at least have a firm grasp at data analysis, or could understand the technical issues facing the country. Knowing only acting doesn't really give much in the way of background skills.

Not saying that this is the case with Trudeau... its just an assumption that some might make.

 

[Segnosaur]

Well, so far he seems ahead on points. The simple fact that the Conservatives came right out with attack ads against him, and sleazy ones at that, even though there's no election on, struck me as incredibly petty of them....

Yeah it is rather strange that they started the attacks so... early. Didn't they do that before the last election too (launching ads even before the election was called)?

Not sure what their thinking is. Perhaps they think that they need to challenge his popularity early before it gets too entrenched. Or maybe its a fundraising thing... whip up support early to get people to donate.

 

[Segnosaur]

No, he can't win. Except for perhaps in the boxing ring, he's no match, in any other way, for Harper.

I wouldn't go that far.

He's young. He's photogenic. He's made some blunders, but he's handled himself better than many thought he would. He certainly stands a chance .

So Harper, at the polls, will KO Trudeau, just as he did the previous Great White Liberal Hope.

The Liberals had a few things going against them in the previous election though... they may have had a "new" leader, but they had really only been out of power for a few years at the time of the last election... not nearly enough time for the party to shake off all the scandals and related bad memories.

Now, with a majority mandate behind them, its the conservatives that need to worry about people remembering scandals and such.

I'm certainly not guaranteeing a liberal win... at this point they don't really have much of a power base to fall back on. But a victory is certainly not out of the realm of possibility.

 

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Yeah it is rather strange that they started the attacks so... early. Didn't they do that before the last election too (launching ads even before the election was called)?

Not sure what their thinking is. Perhaps they think that they need to challenge his popularity early before it gets too entrenched. Or maybe its a fundraising thing... whip up support early to get people to donate.

How about: http://www.internationalskeptics.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=9169580#post9169580

 

[TubbaBlubba]

Canada pioneered quantum politics.

In most countries, there's either a win for the progressives, the conservatives, or some other people.

But in Canada, there's the possibility of a progressive-conservative win!

 

[squealpiggy]

Canada pioneered quantum politics.

In most countries, there's either a win for the progressives, the conservatives, or some other people.

But in Canada, there's the possibility of a progressive-conservative win!

The PCs are only provincial though. And led by Tim Nice But Dim Hudak.

 

[Fitter]

The PCs are only provincial though. And led by Tim Nice But Dim Hudak.

Has anyone Alison Redford? Or any of the other provincial PC leaders?