British consrvatives: not like American conservatives

[Puppycow]

Coming from a country where "conservative" usually means anti-gay bigotry among other things, I was surprised and encouraged to read this article about Britain's conservatives:

British Conservatives lead charge for gay marriage

LONDON — Americans watching the latest push for social change in Britain might feel as if they had stepped into an alternate political universe: Here, the Conservatives are leading the charge for same-sex marriage.

Gay couples in Britain won the right to civil partnerships in 2004, which granted them nearly the same legal status as married heterosexual couples while avoiding the controversial use of the word “marriage.” But Prime Minister David Cameron and his Conservative-led coalition have launched a historic drive to grant gay men and lesbians the option of also entering into civil marriages, touching off a surprisingly fierce uproar in largely progressive Britain and fueling a rebellion on the right as the party comes under heavy fire from traditional allies in the British clergy.

Yet challenging tradition appears to be exactly Cameron’s point. The proposal, put forward this month despite the lack of a strong clamor for marriage within Britain’s gay community, is nevertheless emerging as the cornerstone of a bid by the 45-year-old prime minister and other young leaders on the right here to redefine what it means to be a modern Conservative.

“I don’t support gay marriage despite being a Conservative,” Cameron said in a recent landmark speech on the issue. “I support gay marriage because I am a Conservative.”

What else is different about British conservatives compared to American ones? Do British conservatives care about abortion? Do they care about gun rights? Do they deny the theory of evolution and climate science? Do they pander to the religious? Do they want to abolish the NHS? What else is different about them?

 

[Beerina]

Well, the middle-of-the-road party over there is called the Liberal Democrats, so go figure.

 

[megaresp]

What else is different about British conservatives compared to American ones? Do British conservatives care about abortion? Do they care about gun rights? Do they deny the theory of evolution and climate science? Do they pander to the religious? Do they want to abolish the NHS? What else is different about them?

This answers (most of) your questions...
http://toryreformgroup.tumblr.com/post/8423223989/david-cowan-what-does-conservative-party-stand-for

Of course, what they say in opposition versus what they do in government aren't necessarily the same thing.

As a general rule I'll think you'll find UK conservatives (use of small 'c' deliberate) are more 'liberal' than in the US.

 

[commandlinegamer]

Uh, it's the US which is bizarre in referring to left-wingers as liberals.

 

[Oliver]

Well, the middle-of-the-road party over there is called the Liberal Democrats, so go figure.

Actually liberalism pretty much is the middle of the political center everywhere else as well. Who knows why many Americans see liberalism as the "far left radical socialsts".

 

[Jack by the hedge]

Do British conservatives care about abortion?

They leave that to the Catholics.

Do they care about gun rights?

Hardly anyone cares about gun rights. They do care about fox hunting.

Do they deny the theory of evolution and climate science?

Deny evolution - definitely not. Only a tiny number of religious cranks over here do that. Climate change denial has more traction.

Do they pander to the religious?

Only in the same way all politicians soft-soap any potential block vote. Although traditionally the Church of England was described as 'the Tory party at prayer'.

Do they want to abolish the NHS?

They're keen to privatise what they can, but they don't appear to have the desire to ultimately destroy it.

 

[Tomtomkent]

Actually liberalism pretty much is the middle of the political center everywhere else as well. Who knows why many Americans see liberalism as the "far left radical socialsts".

Beause they were never taught about Bismarks horsehoe/table in history class?

 

[angrysoba]

Coming from a country where "conservative" usually means anti-gay bigotry among other things, I was surprised and encouraged to read this article about Britain's conservatives:

British Conservatives lead charge for gay marriage




What else is different about British conservatives compared to American ones? Do British conservatives care about abortion? Do they care about gun rights? Do they deny the theory of evolution and climate science? Do they pander to the religious? Do they want to abolish the NHS? What else is different about them?

Many of the interests of the Conservative Party are very different to American conservatives.

Gun rights is a complete red herring in this case as Britain is not a country founded on taking up firearms against their rulers as America is. There is next to no "gun debate" in the UK. Guns are bad and unwelcome in the UK, basically.

Abortion is also very minor. There are some who are very much against abortion but there is essentially bipartisan support for abortion.

Gay rights is tricky. Most Conservatives have, until recently, liked to present themselves as homo-skeptic - for want of a better word. There used to be quite draconian measures against homosexuality but these days being anti-gay is not going to win votes. The leader of the Scottish Tories is an open lesbian, although this counts for little as more Scots are open lesbians than they are open Tories. I don't know whether Cameron is genuinely on board about gay civil rights but probably his policies are much more gay-friendly than any previous Tory government.

I haven't really been following what's going on with the NHS enough but it is looking very, very bad from what I can see. I think the move towards privatization is being pushed hard. Bad business if you ask me.

Climate change - the Tories are probably officially supporters of stopping climate change. As with just about every other politician in the world this is probably only lip service. They won't do anything. Those who don't believe in climate change are considered a bit fringe.

Absolutely nobody who disputes evolution is taken seriously on this belief in Britain. I seriously cannot think of one person in the UK who says evolution is false.

 

[Mojo]

Actually liberalism pretty much is the middle of the political center everywhere else as well. Who knows why many Americans see liberalism as the "far left radical socialsts".

Someone (I thought it was someone like Peter Cook although I've seen it attributed to Clem Attlee) once said that America has two parties: the Republicans who are a bit like our Conservative Party, and the Democrats who are a bit like our Conservative Party.

 

[Damien Evans]

Someone (I thought it was someone like Peter Cook although I've seen it attributed to Clem Attlee) once said that America has two parties: the Republicans who are a bit like our Conservative Party, and the Democrats who are a bit like our Conservative Party.

The Democrats are a bit like the conservative party, the republicans are way to the right.

 

[Rolfe]

.... more Scots are open lesbians than they are open Tories.

Absolutely true! And they're less likely to be frowned upon for their orientation, too!

Rolfe.

 

[WildCat]

Actually liberalism pretty much is the middle of the political center everywhere else as well.

And everyone is above average too.

 

[Soapy Sam]

Absolutely true! And they're less likely to be frowned upon for their orientation, too!

Rolfe.

I'd be a lesbian if I had passed the physical.

 

[Seismosaurus]

What else is different about British conservatives compared to American ones? Do British conservatives care about abortion? Do they care about gun rights? Do they deny the theory of evolution and climate science? Do they pander to the religious? Do they want to abolish the NHS? What else is different about them?

Abortion is a fairly depoliticised issue in British politics. When it's debated the parties generally have an open vote on the issue, letting everybody vote their conscience. Thus far, the votes have gone pretty solidly in favour of abortion and all the wrangling has been around how late it should be allowed, which has generally followed the viability limit.

Very few on any side care about gun rights in Britain. We have what the US would regard as ultra-draconian gun restrictions, and every change in the law over the last 30 years has only restricted it more. Something like 90% of the population are perfectly fine with that. Britain has never had much of a gun culture in any case - my whole life I have never known a single person who owned a gun.

There are some creationist types here, and schools have some freedom to teach creationism - and some do. Again, it's not an especially hot button issue with the voters.

Similar on climate change, really. There's no real big political debate about it here. You will probably find a proportion of the public who doubt it, but it's not a big controversy. As a teacher, I can tell you first hand that climate change is routinely taught in schools as the accepted scientific theory.

Scrapping the NHS - now that IS a big issue. The perception is that the right would really like to abolish it if they thought they could get away with it. But the NHS is a big deal with the voters - they love it. Anybody who openly tried to abolish it would be slitting their own political throat. Right wing governments are relentlessly accused of slashing funding, though in truth they increase funding, they just don't increase it by as much. They have, over the years, tried to bring in some sort of "internal market". Much controversy is generated as a result.

 

[Architect]

Abortion is a fairly depoliticised issue in British politics. When it's debated the parties generally have an open vote on the issue, letting everybody vote their conscience. Thus far, the votes have gone pretty solidly in favour of abortion and all the wrangling has been around how late it should be allowed, which has generally followed the viability limit.

Very few on any side care about gun rights in Britain. We have what the US would regard as ultra-draconian gun restrictions, and every change in the law over the last 30 years has only restricted it more. Something like 90% of the population are perfectly fine with that. Britain has never had much of a gun culture in any case - my whole life I have never known a single person who owned a gun.

There are some creationist types here, and schools have some freedom to teach creationism - and some do. Again, it's not an especially hot button issue with the voters.

Similar on climate change, really. There's no real big political debate about it here. You will probably find a proportion of the public who doubt it, but it's not a big controversy. As a teacher, I can tell you first hand that climate change is routinely taught in schools as the accepted scientific theory.

Scrapping the NHS - now that IS a big issue. The perception is that the right would really like to abolish it if they thought they could get away with it. But the NHS is a big deal with the voters - they love it. Anybody who openly tried to abolish it would be slitting their own political throat. Right wing governments are relentlessly accused of slashing funding, though in truth they increase funding, they just don't increase it by as much. They have, over the years, tried to bring in some sort of "internal market". Much controversy is generated as a result.

I concur, saving for that I do know quite a few people with guns (hunting, vermin, etc.) however I sense no appetite for fewer restrictions thereon.

 

[Rolfe]

I know some people with guns. I don't know anyone with a gun fetish. Some of the attitudes on display from US posters here just horrify me.

Rolfe.

 

[Puppycow]

Scrapping the NHS - now that IS a big issue. The perception is that the right would really like to abolish it if they thought they could get away with it. But the NHS is a big deal with the voters - they love it. Anybody who openly tried to abolish it would be slitting their own political throat. Right wing governments are relentlessly accused of slashing funding, though in truth they increase funding, they just don't increase it by as much. They have, over the years, tried to bring in some sort of "internal market". Much controversy is generated as a result.

I often hear the argument from conservatives that they are not really proposing cuts but smaller increases. However, even a nominal increase may be a cut in real terms if it doesn't keep pace with inflation and population growth.

 

[Seismosaurus]

I often hear the argument from conservatives that they are not really proposing cuts but smaller increases. However, even a nominal increase may be a cut in real terms if it doesn't keep pace with inflation and population growth.

Add to that the fact that medical costs tend to rise because new treatments are being developed all the time, so in most cases the amount that you can do for a patient now is vastly more than it was thirty years ago. You can spend more per head of population in real terms and still find yourself falling behind.

Then there's the question of how well you spend it - the NHS spends far, far more on administration and bureaucracy now than it did thirty years ago.

Ultimately we could probably spend our entire GNP on the NHS and still not have a perfect system.

 

[Howie Felterbush]

Very few on any side care about gun rights in Britain. We have what the US would regard as ultra-draconian gun restrictions, and every change in the law over the last 30 years has only restricted it more. Something like 90% of the population are perfectly fine with that. Britain has never had much of a gun culture in any case - my whole life I have never known a single person who owned a gun.

Messrs Holland & Holland would disagree with you.

Purdey, Webley and Scott, Westley-Richards, BSA...Holy crap, some of the finest guns in the world were (and still are) produced in England. No Africa bound hunter worth his leopard skin hatband would even think of heading for the Dark Continent without a trip to Holland & Holland for a double rifle in .375 H&H. Try showing up on the moors on The Glorious Twelfth without a matched set of Purdey 12 bores; might as well go without your breeks! And don't even think of climbing into your howdah for a tiger hunt without a fine Webley break-top to scrape Shere Khan off the side of your elephant if things get sticky.

You guys are the original "Gun Culture", with a heavy emphasis on culture. Beautiful stuff; well-made with a fine attention to detail. Not just good guns, but good looking guns.

 

[Rolfe]

Cultured guns, yes. Gun fetish, not so much.

Rolfe.