Cont: Brexit: Now What? 9 Below Zero

[Arcade22]

Britishers have been living under the yoke of the tyrannical eurocratic monster for such a long time that they forgot how manage themselves without some directive regulating them and their bendy bananas and kippers.

Like any backwards developing country subject to sudden and rushed decolonisation they probably need a couple of years of political conflict and communal violence.

 

[a_unique_person]

Why is that a reason to vote no?

Why would they vote to allow Parliament to pause for a week so that they can't attend a conference they aren't allowed to go to?

 

[BobTheCoward]

Why would they vote to allow Parliament to pause for a week so that they can't attend a conference they aren't allowed to go to?

Because they are not motivated by their own self interest, they don't have much business to do, and it is nice.

 

[psionl0]

Common law originates with the laws passed by the Monarch. Common law precedes the appearance of Parliament. The introduction of Parliament and its development as the body that passed laws in the country resulted in what we call statutory laws.

Common law is also known as judge made law and arises from decisions made by the courts. No court ever gave the monarch their powers. These were presumed to be a God given authority. Monarchs make statute law - not common law.

 

[psionl0]

Edited by kmortis: 

Removed previously moderated content and response.

Since nobody is challenging the SC's authority to rule on the proroguing, that decision stands. My point is that they didn't do so on the basis of any existing law, they created a new law.

If it make you happy then you can call this decision an example of "common law".

 

[zooterkin]

Because they are not motivated by their own self interest,

Citation required.

they don't have much business to do,

Citation required.

and it is nice.

 

[The Great Zaganza]

There was a party political broadcast the Brexit party this evening. Farage complained that May's deal was still giving the EU too much power over the UK and that Johnson is just pushing for something very similar. With time running out I waited with bated breath as to what Farage's plan was.... It turns out he wants a "clean break" so that the UK will get all its power and sovereignty back.

That's it. Farage is selling no deal as if it is a deal. But it is not. There will need to be negotiations to get trade deals, travel, residency, customs etc etc

He is a snake oil salesman.

I assume Farage has the same demand with regards to the the UN, WTO, ICJ, Commonwealth and NATO.
How else will the UK have actual sovereignty ?

 

[Darat]

I assume Farage has the same demand with regards to the the UN, WTO, ICJ, Commonwealth and NATO.
How else will the UK have actual sovereignty ?

We never needed those in the past!

 

[Lothian]

I assume Farage has the same demand with regards to the the UN, WTO, ICJ, Commonwealth and NATO.
How else will the UK have actual sovereignty ?

Any deal with another country is a surrender deal and only a traitor would advocate one.

 

[Nessie]

Common law is also known as judge made law and arises from decisions made by the courts. No court ever gave the monarch their powers. These were presumed to be a God given authority. Monarchs make statute law - not common law.

In the UK common law is law that was introduced centuries ago, before laws were being written as statutes. What you call "judge made law" is called case law and sets precedents regarding how existing laws are enforced. Parliament makes statutory laws.

 

[Nessie]

Edited by kmortis: 

Removed to comply with Rule 12

Since nobody is challenging the SC's authority to rule on the proroguing, that decision stands. My point is that they didn't do so on the basis of any existing law, they created a new law.

If it make you happy then you can call this decision an example of "common law".

No, the SC ruling is now part of case law and it clarifies an already existing common law.

 

[Nessie]

I assume Farage has the same demand with regards to the the UN, WTO, ICJ, Commonwealth and NATO.
How else will the UK have actual sovereignty ?

He just hates Europe. He likes the rest of the world. That is because Europe was never part of the British Empire, but the rest of the world was.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

Hell, I think it is the greatest constituoinal crisis since The Great Civil War...

Yes, but apparently that's not 'important'.

I'm dragging myself out of the Bob Hole.

 

[P.J. Denyer]

Ok let me see... reasons for Brexit.

We save 350m a week.... and lose far more in GDP
We take back control of our borders... but have to leave the land border wide open to comply with the GFA and all thr others the same to comply with WTO rules
We take back sovereignty of our law... and then undermine the judiciary who oversee it and promise to break it when ee dont like what it says.
We take back control from the undemocratic EU ... and our unelected PM suspends our own elected parliament so they wont pass legislation he doesnt agree with
And.... well there was something about vaping and buying carrots from Botswana. And ... well thats about it.

Don't forget all those better Trade Deals the rest of the World were going to be queuing up for. Although we're currently begging countries to roll over the EU deals before we crash out of the 147(?) deals we are currently part of.

Still at least the Brexiters might not riot if we give them everything they've been told to want.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1177281682585640960

Sir John Major has found a way around the Benn Act (an Order of Council from Privy Councillors) which he suspects Boris Johnson will use use to leave the EU on October 31 without a deal. His speech tonight:

Quote embedded in tweet.

This is worrying, because although it would be challenged and see the government back in the Supreme Court, it could take us over the deadline and see us crash out without a deal.

 

[Tolls]

Because they are not motivated by their own self interest, they don't have much business to do, and it is nice.

That you don't know what business they have does not mean they have no business.

There's a whole parliament website to find out what business they have.

For example, when the Parliament was non-prorogued they were forced to shelve legislation around domestic abuse. That is now back on the cards, so needs working on.
It is not the only piece of legislation that was stopped.

So stop JAQing off, and actually look into these things.

There's a whole website to explain all this to you, including what work the MPs are doing (It's Friday so not much today), and pages for what legislation is being worked on, and what draft legislation is being prepared.

All of which was shelved because of Johnson, and they lost a week of work (or more). And Parliament are claiming that week back off the Tory party. Seems fair to me.

So please just stop asking this nonsense and put some effort in.

 

[Lothian]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1177281682585640960



Quote embedded in tweet.

This is worrying, because although it would be challenged and see the government back in the Supreme Court, it could take us over the deadline and see us crash out without a deal.

I have also heard people say that it wouldn't stop the Benn Bill working.

There is also talk of a new measure next week aimed at addressing the Prime ministers statement that he will not write the the letter. Listening to the radio last night, I can't remember the particular Tory grandee being quized but I got the impression that, (they did not specifically say this), Boris may simply, resign as Prime Minister if he got to the stage where the law required him to sign. Not sure how it would work out of if it could possibly work out this way but if he stood down and someone else signed the letter to the EU Boris could then later get re-elected as leader and go into a General election as a man of principle.
That may be his plan but it could be that measure next week flips things round so that the default becomes that we remain if nothing is done.
I am clearly guessing, previously we appeared to have a limited choice of paths. Under Boris it is more chaotic and it does seem like anything could happen.

 

[Squeegee Beckenheim]

It's being reported that Johnson is planning to invoke the supremacy of EU law over UK law in order to avoid asking for an extension

 

[GlennB]

It's being reported that Johnson is planning to invoke the supremacy of EU law over UK law in order to avoid asking for an extension

That would be hilarious So hilarious I find it hard to believe he'd do it.

It might also see him in a long process appealing to the EU for a judgement, while his opponents nip over the road to the UK's supreme court.

 

[Darat]

I have also heard people say that it wouldn't stop the Benn Bill working.



There is also talk of a new measure next week aimed at addressing the Prime ministers statement that he will not write the the letter. Listening to the radio last night, I can't remember the particular Tory grandee being quized but I got the impression that, (they did not specifically say this), Boris may simply, resign as Prime Minister if he got to the stage where the law required him to sign. Not sure how it would work out of if it could possibly work out this way but if he stood down and someone else signed the letter to the EU Boris could then later get re-elected as leader and go into a General election as a man of principle.

That may be his plan but it could be that measure next week flips things round so that the default becomes that we remain if nothing is done.

I am clearly guessing, previously we appeared to have a limited choice of paths. Under Boris it is more chaotic and it does seem like anything could happen.

If he resigned then that would give the opposition parties the chance to go to the queen, so I don't think he'll risk that.