Cont: Brexit: Now What? 9 Below Zero

[Garrison]

If the deal on offer is a bad one, then the UK doesn't accept it, and trades instead under WTO rules. This applies to all countries (and protectionist trading blocs) that the UK negotiates with. This is very simple and obvious: only the petulant foot-stamping remainers seem unable to understand it.

Ah another 'I know you are what am I?' response from you.

And now you are suggesting not only do we trade on the worst possible terms with the EU but the rest of the world as well if they don't recognize the specialness of the UK, not so much simple as simple-minded.

In which case it's not really "bad".

Well of course as you, hopefully, understand if its worse than what we have now then yes its bad.

 

[Ziggurat]

Post-Brexit the raw materials or components might come from sources that were previously non-compliant with EU standards and therefore avoided.

Why would they? Only if there’s a cost savings which would offset the regulatory burden.

But, no doubt, this is why you were careful to say "if the product doesn't change".

That burden applies to EU producers too, they don’t get a pass on recertification if their products change. You cannot simultaneously argue EU rules are a huge burden when the UK is out but not a huge burden when they are in.

If the UK has to observe EU rules on such matters in order to export chicken casseroles then we are accepting their rules. If we don't then the product cannot be exported to the EU.

But now producers have a choice they didn’t have before.

 

[Ziggurat]

You still have no clue do you? This has been explained numerous times over the years...

Sent from my SM-M305F using Tapatalk

Even if I assume you are right, this post is still an utter failure, containing no useful information about the subject at hand.

 

[Andy_Ross]

Foreign Secretary has told UK diplomats not to “sit next to EU counterparts" at any international meeting or event.

Petty much?

 

[ceptimus]

And now you are suggesting not only do we trade on the worst possible terms with the EU but the rest of the world as well if they don't recognize the specialness of the UK.

No. Exactly the opposite. I'm suggesting that we trade on the best possible terms on offer. If the offered terms are worse than WTO then we stick with WTO.
Remainers are now adopting a masochist stance where they want us to accept terms that will make things as bad as possible: they want the country to suffer just to prove that the remainers were right.

 

[The Don]

No it wouldn’t. It’s already been certified to EU standards. It’s the same product. It doesn’t need to get recertified if the product doesn’t change.

As for small producers, well, you are providing a good argument for why EU membership is a bad deal. You don’t get a break on regulations by being a member.

The products would still have to be explicitly recertified because the UK wouldn't be compliant.

You don't get a break on regulations as a member but you don't have to bear the expense of certification.

 

[Lothian]

No. Exactly the opposite. I'm suggesting that we trade on the best possible terms on offer. If the offered terms are worse than WTO then we stick with WTO.
Remainers are now adopting a masochist stance where they want us to accept terms that will make things as bad as possible: they want the country to suffer just to prove that the remainers were right.

Got any evidence or is this yet another Brexiteer lie?

 

[Ziggurat]

The products would still have to be explicitly recertified because the UK wouldn't be compliant.

You don't get a break on regulations as a member but you don't have to bear the expense of certification.

Give me an example of how you think this works, with a specific product certification requirement.

 

[Darat]

In which case it's not really "bad".

As I posted it depends on your starting point. Compared to WTO it may not be bad, but compared to the old EU deal it may be.

 

[Lothian]

Because the "bad" deal is still better than the WTO rules and regulations.
.

In which case it's not really "bad".

Jesus, didn't take long for standards to hit Rock bottom. Have brexiteer expectations fallen that far?. Less than a year ago Boris was saying

I say to all the doubters, dude, we are going to energise the country.....We are going to take advantage of all the opportunities it is going to bring in in a new spirit of can-do, and we are once again going to believe in ourselves and what we can achieve."

And now you are setting WTO as the benchmark for good. What happened to getting better deals than we currently have? Where is your can do? Why are you resigned to a worse deal that we have? Why are you dismissing the Brexit campaigners as a bunch of liars? Why do you no longer believe brexit can give us better deals than we had? The easiest deals ever. Where has you optimisation and belief gone?

 

[Lukraak_Sisser]

No. Exactly the opposite. I'm suggesting that we trade on the best possible terms on offer. If the offered terms are worse than WTO then we stick with WTO.
Remainers are now adopting a masochist stance where they want us to accept terms that will make things as bad as possible: they want the country to suffer just to prove that the remainers were right.

No deals will be offered that are worse than WTO, but the main choice will be between the 'worse than now but still ok, but you need to keep following the EU rules' deal from the EU, the 'bend over and take it' deal from Trump or WTO.

All of which will be worse than the current deals, as the UK has severely weakened its position in the international market.
And since the first option will go agains brexit jingoism as 'betrayal', you're about to bend over and take it.

 

[Lothian]

No deals will be offered that are worse than WTO

Of course they won't. However repeat it enough and then the brexit lemmings will then see WTO or a marginally better deal as a fantastic result.

 

[jimbob]

Of course negotiation 101 works a lot better from a strong position, and the UK does not have that.
But sure, threaten to harm your economy a lot. I'm sure that will work better this time.

I have for a long time thought this is the Johnson's attempted negotiating approach:
In case you are unfamiliar with this scene - the language is NSFW.


ETA: The link works when I preview the post but not when I read my post:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_JOGmXpe5I

 

[Darat]

Jesus, didn't take long for standards to hit Rock bottom. Have brexiteer expectations fallen that far?. Less than a year ago Boris was saying

I say to all the doubters, dude, we are going to energise the country.....We are going to take advantage of all the opportunities it is going to bring in in a new spirit of can-do, and we are once again going to believe in ourselves and what we can achieve."

And now you are setting WTO as the benchmark for good. What happened to getting better deals than we currently have? Where is your can do? Why are you resigned to a worse deal that we have? Why are you dismissing the Brexit campaigners as a bunch of liars? Why do you no longer believe brexit can give us better deals than we had? The easiest deals ever. Where has you optimisation and belief gone?

I think we will see a form of schizophrenia. Anything better than WTO will be be portrayed as a betrayal, as "brexit in name only" because of course it will mean we've agreed to something with the EU which by definition has to mean it is bad., rather than "it's a better deal than WTO".

 

[Andy_Ross]

When diplomats sitting alongside diplomats from EU countries is seen as a bad thing, any kind of deal at all with the EU will be seen as a betrayal.

 

[The Don]

Give me an example of how you think this works, with a specific product certification requirement.

After Brexit, UK bodies any CE certification done by UK bodies will no longer be recognised. All products will have to recertified by a body recognised by the EU.

 

[Garrison]

Got any evidence or is this yet another Brexiteer lie?

Ceptimus doesn't do evidence, its just him getting in early to blame Remainers when Brexit turns out to be a fiasco.

 

[Garrison]

No. Exactly the opposite. I'm suggesting that we trade on the best possible terms on offer. If the offered terms are worse than WTO then we stick with WTO.
Remainers are now adopting a masochist stance where they want us to accept terms that will make things as bad as possible: they want the country to suffer just to prove that the remainers were right.

Another lie, the best terms on offer were the ones we already had as a member of the EU, its the Brexiteers who are insisting on worse terms.

 

[abaddon]

Another lie, the best terms on offer were the ones we already had as a member of the EU, its the Brexiteers who are insisting on worse terms.

I don't think it is actually a lie. Ceptimus really seems to believe that the UK will get better deals with everyone. Because the Empire.

 

[Ziggurat]

After Brexit, UK bodies any CE certification done by UK bodies will no longer be recognised. All products will have to recertified by a body recognised by the EU.

CE certification is mostly done by the manufacturer, not by any recognized body. The only thing that changes in those cases is the manufacturer will have to transfer the Technical File for the product to somebody within the EU, but there is no additional certification needed. During the transition period, UK certifying bodies will still be valid, we shall see what happens after that. I doubt prior certifications will expire, since I see no provision in the rules for certification expiring if the certifying body simply goes out of business.