Bigfoot DNA

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Calm down big boy. I don't like it any more than you do. I'm a skeptic. However, we must be logically honest and the fact is that there are thousands of eyewitness reports.

I agree that most are probably BS, however, you would have to prove all of them to be BS in order to claim that BF doesn't exist. Then the next day, another report will be presented.

So you're trying to prove a negative which is an impossibility, get it?

I fail to see how anyone can be swayed into believing in Bigfoot based on the crap they read regarding eyewitness reports. Page after page of reports coming in from Backwoods county, USA, where John Smith caught a fleeting glimpse of a "muscular giant" in his yard whilst listening to Bruce Springsteen and drinking vodka Redbulls.

People claim to see all kinds of crap: Elvis, John Lennon, Nessie, all over the world.... all we can take from this is something we already know: most people are silly buggars.
 
Again, you are making it a personal affair and not addressing the issue...

So let me ask you again. If you prove that one report is false, does that mean that all other reports are also false?

How is this a valid way of determining anything?

So, I can just make up a story about seeing Bigfoot and it'd be back to the drawing board for the skeptics simply because they'd have to prove my story wrong before being able to discount it?
 
for all intents, all proof is based on probability. Once a certain threshhold of probability is reached, a proposition is considered to be proved or at least settled. This threshhold will vary with the proposition, the consequences, and the individual. While the old saw "you can't prove a negative" is strictly true, a probability of '0.0000000000' is not the standard for proof.

I can't prove I'm not going to be hit by lightning today if the standard is 0.000000000000. What I can say is that when the weather forecast is clear and sunny for the next few days, where I live, in this season, I'm not going to be hit by lightning. So you may not consider that proof, you should at least consider it a settled question. If new evidence appears, it could be reopened. But for now it's a settled question.
 
I have trouble responding to every point and comment that's brought up. To some of them I ave no idea what to say. things like "there is not a molecule of evidence for Bigfoot".

All I can say is there is.

Yep, but the real issue is this: what does and does not constitute as being "good" evidence?

There is a ton of "evidence" for Bigfoots existence, but the problem is that its all bollocks of the purest form. The fact that people are still clinging onto the PGF as being the holy grail of Bigfoot evidence is hilarious and embarrassing at the same time.

Most Footers watch Finding Bigfoot religiously and act like they're witnessing groundbreaking research, i'd rather watch 2 Broke Girls, and thats a crock of *****.
 
The factual part is up for debate, but I greatly value honesty. Anyway, I guess I can post some "credible" ones from the BFRO. It's really up to you to decide if they're credible though.

*Courtesy of BFF & the BFRO*


Northern Ontario
YEAR: 1992

SEASON: Fall

MONTH: October

DATE: 4th

PROVINCE: Ontario

COUNTRY: Canada

LOCATION DETAILS: hwy 11 north to northbay then the transcanada hwy to Cochrane then west about 100 miles

NEAREST TOWN: Cochrane

NEAREST ROAD: Trans-Canada Hwy

OBSERVED: First I have never told anyone about this sighting untill this year. I working for the durham regional police and have since 1979. I was going moose hunting and my friend was driving we had been on the road about 9 to 10 hours going to Igness Ontario. We were about 100 miles west of Cochrane Ontario on the Transcanada hwy.This area has the bush cut back some 30 to 40 yards on each side of the road when i noticed an animial coming out of the north side of a ditch area and run across a two lane hwy. We were about 100 yards away and moving up fast as we were driving at about 65 to 70 mph (100 to 115 klms). This animinal ran across the road on two legs and were about 20 yards away. By the time it crossed the road my friend turned to me and said "what the hell was that." I said don't you know that was a sasquach/a bigfoot. He turned to me and said it was not. I'm not going to have people call me nuts, so I said OK? What was it? He said a man in a fur suit. We argued about this for a few minutes, even though we were about 100 miles away from the nearest town. We never said another thing about it till this year, and he stll says he has never seen anything. Now let me describe this animal. It was about 6 to 7 feet tall, very long and muscular arms that went down to its knees. It was covered in fur that reminded me of moose hair. It did turn to look at the truck we were driving -- a chevy 4x4 . It looked like it was as tall or a little bit taller than the cab of the truck. It only took about 5 or 6 steps to cross the two lane hwy and down into the ditch we were passing. This was at night between 7 and 10 pm.

OTHER WITNESSES: two however my friend still says he say he saw nothing as he does not want to be called nuts

TIME AND CONDITIONS: between 7 and 9pm cold and crisp about 37 degrees

ENVIRONMENT: this is northern Ontario Canada its all pine forest cedar/evergreens.this area is as far as i can tell at night fairly flat in this area


Follow-up investigation report:

I spoke with the witness over the phone and found him to be direct and forthright. He has been a Police Officer since 1979 and has been hunting since he was a child.

The witness provided a little more detail with regards to the description of the creature. He describes it as a female because of breasts that were in the lower chest area, heavy legs and buttocks, about 300 - 400 lbs., 7 feet tall and arms that hung down to the knee area. He further adds that it had the same colour and texture of hair as a moose, being black with coarse hair. Apparently it had less hair on the chest area and a partially hair covered "hominid" face. The witness says that he could see muscle definition on the arms and shoulders.

As it crossed the road in front of their vehicle it turned its upper torso to look at them and then continued to make its way into the tree line on the south side.

The entire sighting took about 10 seconds. He advised that he had a camera with him in the vehicle, but did not even think of it at the time due to the disbelief in what he was seeing.


Northern Ontario
YEAR: 2003

SEASON: Fall

MONTH: October

DATE: 14

PROVINCE: Ontario

COUNTRY: Canada

LOCATION DETAILS: Take Hwy 17 North from Sault Ste Marie, Ontario about 15 miles to a town called Heyden. Turn right or go east on the Ranger lake Road about 12 miles to the Northland Lake Road. Turn right and follow the dirt road about a mile to a dirt road that leads to a communications tower and turn right. Follow this road about a mile to a small "y" and turn left. Go down a hill and cross the creek and follow the path to the first "y". Turn left and follow this path south for about 1/4 mile to a clearing. I saw the creature about 50 yards East of the clearing. I can show you on a map if you like.

NEAREST TOWN: Searchmount, Ontario, Canada

NEAREST ROAD: Ranger Lake Road

OBSERVED: Before I start, let me give you my background.
I am 50 yrs old, have 2 kids and 2 grandkids, have been married for over 29 yrs and have been a Toronto Police Officer for over 28 yrs. I started shooting when I was 7 yrs old, started hunting woodchucks and rabbits when I was 9 or 10 yrs old. I did alot of fishing, canoeing, boating, camping and hiking when I was a kid. I started hunting Deer and Bear when I was about 14 or 15 and have every year since, and started hunting Moose about 14 years ago. My parents were Salvation Army Officers and were transferred all over Canada. I have done all of the above all over Canada during my younger years and continue now in Ontario where I permanently reside in Ajax which is just 10 minutes East of Toronto. For the last 10 yrs I have hunted Moose about 30 miles N/E of Sault Ste Marie, Ontario near a small town called Searchmount near Northland Lake.

Over the years I have seen all kinds of wildlife but have never laid eyes on what I saw last week while hunting Moose. I thought I was losing my marbles and that thought was reenforced when I told my brother in law (my hunting partner)the story. I later told my wife over the phone my story and she was intrigued by my story. She apparently told a coworker who found your site on the internet. When I called her to tell her I was on the way home she told me of your site and that there were several sightings in Ontario. That's when I realized that maybe I wasn't just seeing things or losing my head. When I got home I checked out your site and figure your the only people I can tell my story to that won't think I'm completly nuts. Anyhow... to my story.....sorry....it's a little long but it doesn't make sense if I don't tell it all.....

My brother in law and I were hunting Moose just N/E of Sault Ste Marie. On Tuesday 14 Oct 2003 I went up an old trail to where it came to a dead end. I got stuck on my ATV in the mud but managed to get out and turn around. I went part way back down the trail to where I found a clearing and parked on the West side where I could see about 200 yards North and South. I stopped there at about 7:45 am. I put out some Moose cow in heat urine scent on the surrounding trees and a few minutes later did a Moose Cow call on my horn. I looked at my watch which said it was 8:05 am. At about 8:15 am it started to rain. I didn't want to get my gun wet so I put it back in the gun boot on my ATV. The rain helps hide my scent but at the same time makes it noisey in the bush with the water hitting the ground, leaves, trees etc. At 8:30 am I started hearing footsteps and snapping twigs coming from the N/E of my position.

The rain noise disguised this noise until it was very close to me and because of this I wasn't ready (gun still in boot). All of a sudden I heard the destinctive sound of a Bull Moose raking his rack on the brush very close. I looked to my left and saw a huge bull raking his rack about 70 yards from me. I reached back and pulled my gun from the boot but dropped the boot cover on the top of my ATV which made a banging noise. When I turned back to where the Moose was, it took off back into the dense brush. I thought this was a bit strange because I have seen several Moose in the past that just stood there. They don't seem to be afraid of anything and just stand there. I've had them stand in front of me for several minutes before walking off into the bush in the past and couldn't understand why this one took off so fast. I stayed still for about an hour hoping he would come back. During that time I called on my horn and heard him rake his rack on the bush twice and grunt at me as he headed off in a Southerly direction through the bush. It turns out there was a gulley just out my line of sight that he used to walk around me and disappear.

I was later able to raise my brother in law on the radio who showed up and went to where I had seen the Moose. He checked the bush and found fresh tracks which showed the Moose had gone around me in this gulley which was just out of my line of vision. He suggested that I sit near where the Mooose had come out and see if he might come back. I then crossed the clearing and sat on my ATV about 5 yards from where I saw the Moose and sat facing East. Again I sprayed some Moose Cow in Heat urine scent on the trees around me and did a few calls on my horn. By this time it was around 12:30pm. I had decided that I would sit there for the rest of the day hoping to see the Bull come back. While there I ate my lunch, got off the ATV a few times to stretch my legs, had a few cigarettes and even had a little snooze. During this time my back was to the gulley that the Bull had used to walk around me. At about 1:30pm I started hearing heavy thumps behind me every now and then. Every time I heard one, I would turn around but there was nothing there. I should mention that it was still raining. The sound of the rain hitting the ground or the leaves was quite loud but these thumps were much louder. They sounded like a stone or something heavy hitting the ground, but every time I turned around, I saw nothing.

At about 5:25pm I got off the ATV to stretch my legs and have a smoke. I put my gun on the front bag of the ATV to make sure I had it within reach and stood in front of the ATV facing the gulley which was to my rear prior to this. While I was having my smoke I started hearing the destinctive sounds of footsteps coming from the gulley (snapping branches and leaves crunching). I kept my eyes on the gulley while I reached for my rifle. I thought the Bull was coming back. When I looked into the gulley about 40 yards straight in front of me I saw what I thought was a man walking towards me. He was stooped over and looked like he was having trouble walking in the bush. He grabbed a tree and swung himself around and ducked or dove down behind some thick brush. The total time of this took 3 to 5 seconds and he disappeared. He looked to me as if he was dressed all in black with a black toque or a balaclava on his head. The reason I though he was wearing a toque was his head seemed to be long at the back like a man wearing a toque. It looked like it was wearing a jacket and the front of his jacket was open half way and I could see a different color of lining showing around the neck area. It looked like it was light gray or almost blue on the chest area in the shape of a 'V'.

I couldn't really say how tall it was because his legs were behind thick brush and I could only see to about mid thigh. But I would have guessed at the time that he was anywhere from 5'8" to 6' tall. But he was about 40 yards away and it's hard to judge height or size in the bush when you're not sure of the distance. His arms seemed too long for a man but he was extremley muscular, like a body builder with the typical 'V' shape build. There was definetly no fat on him at all. I could see the different muscle groups on his upper body and arms bulging out and could see that it had a washboard stomach. When he grabbed the tree I saw that he had hands, not paws. He swung around the tree and dove for cover as if trying to hide from me. As I said earlier, it was a dull day and was raining and he looked wet. He was covered with black or dark brown hair and it looked like the hair was stuck to him fairly closely because he was wet. What also gave me the body builder impression was that he seemed to have no neck, or he had so much muscle on his shoulders that it gave that appearance. On top of all this his shoulders were extremley broad.

There was a line of dense brush leading off to my left from where it dove into which carried on for about 30 - 40 yards. About 10 to 15 seconds after it went behind this brush, I heard a hoarse, raspy cough followed by a long, hoarse, sad sounding howl. It sounded like a wolf howl but much deeper than any wolf I've ever heard. The sound came from about 20 yards from where I first saw it dive for cover.

When I first saw it, I thought it was a man maybe lost in the bush. But my first thought was "Why isn't he wearing any orange" and "if he's lost, why doesn't he just ask for help". But the howl made me realize quickly that this was no man. The next thing going through my head was "What the hell was that?". That was no Moose. It was definetly not a Wolf or a Bear. It was like nothing I had ever seen in 35 years of hunting. What it looked like to me was a Gorilla or very close to one, but it walked upright, not on all fours. I stood there motionless for almost an hour and a half waiting to see if it would show itself again.

During that time I remembered a show I saw on the Discovery channel about a month before this trip about a man and his son that were hunting in British Columbia where they saw a large animal throwing rocks at them. They took off and reported it to whoever and they later figured out it might be a Bigfoot warning them to get out of his area. I then thought about the loud heavy thumping noises behind me and realized that maybe this creature was throwing something at me. After a while it started to dawn on me that I may have just seen a Bigfoot and I started to get just a little scared. I normally leave the bush after dark when hunting but this night I left about a half hour prior to make sure I had lots of time. I was going to go back to that area the next day looking for that Bull but I couldn't bring myself to go anywhere near that spot. That's the first time in 35 years I have ever been afraid in the bush.

Since then I have wondered if this thing I saw is what scared the Bull away. Like I said earlier, I have seen many Moose in the bush and have never seen one run from me like that. Interestingly though, from where the Bull ran off to where I saw this creature was only about 50 yards.

Another thing...I don't know if this means anything or not....Where I was sitting I saw a large, probably Moose leg bone laying on the ground about 5 feet from my ATV. It wasn't cut or sawed, it had been broken or snapped. It looked to be about at least a year old.

ALSO NOTICED: The Moose was about 50 yards from where I saw the creature.
I found a large bone where I was sitting. It looked like it may have been a Moose leg bone which was broken or snapped, not cut. It looked to be about a year old.

OTHER WITNESSES: My Brother in Lsw was at the site prior to me seeing it but had left about 5 hours before the sighting

OTHER STORIES: No.

TIME AND CONDITIONS: 5:30pm, dull, rainy, daylight

ENVIRONMENT: Heavily wooded with various trees (oak,maple,pine,spruce,poplar,cedar and juniper) lots of thick underbrush, some spots are very marshy, some are very rocky, lots of streams and ponds in the area. Parts of the area were logged years ago but are growing over now. Some parts are being logged as we speak. There is an Ontario Provincial Police Communications Tower about a mile away high up a hill.


Follow-up investigation report:

What an interesting sighting and excellent witness this was. He seems to have seen a sasquatch. It might have spooked the big bull moose he saw; it probably threw rocks towards him – he heard them as they ticked leaves and twigs during flight and then thudded to the ground – and he heard it’s hoarse, sad howl just 40 yards away.

I called the witness, JS, October 20th, just after reading his report, and only 6 days after his sighting. I asked how he felt about this thing he’d seen, and whether he thought it was possible he’d actually seen a person.
“No. No way. If anything it was a gorilla. No way it was a human. It was no animal I’ve ever seen in the bush,” he said emphatically.

He said the thing was very muscular, “like Arnold Schwarzenegger in a ninja suit.” The dark hair on it was plastered against its body because it was wet from the rain. “That thing could have ripped my head off… he was powerful,” he said. But it didn’t seem especially big; he thought it was about his height, about six feet, not eight-nine feet like he’s been reading. But it was hard to tell, he said, because it was about 40 yards away and he could only see it from about mid-thigh up, and it was somewhat stooped. The only variation in the creature’s coloration he noted was a grayish tone on the chest and down its front.

JS was struck by the extraordinarily large size of the animal’s hand, which he saw when it grabbed the, approximately four inch, tree that it used to pull itself up and around as it came to the top of the awkward hill it was on. The hand wrapped entirely around the tree, and it had an opposable thumb. Then the creature ducked into a line of brushy cover. “I got the impression he was trying to get out of sight,” JS said. After a little while the vocalization came from within the cover – a raspy cough-like beginning followed by a sad sounding howl. “That was no bear, that was no wolf, that was no moose,” he told me in describing his thinking at the time.

“I was supposed to sit there for the next three days to finish the hunt off and wait for that bull, and I didn’t want to be there… I’ve never been that scared in the bush in my life.”

“You may have put me in the skeptical type category until last Tuesday… you see the shows on TV and you go, yeah right, you know. Until you see one yourself. The whole week up there I was thinking, ‘now who the hell do you tell?’”

JS does two hunts every year for deer, bear, and moose. “I’ve been in the bush my whole life… I’ve never seen any thing like that, or heard anything like that… A couple of weeks ago if you’d have asked me, I’d have said, BS, there’s no such thing… If I had to go just on the sighting itself, no noise, nothin’, I’d say it was a gorilla. But there’s no gorillas in Canada. And it didn’t walk on all fours. It was upright, you know.”

JS decided to hunt in another spot the rest of the week. He didn’t get his moose.

Northern Ontario
YEAR: 1993-94

SEASON: Fall

MONTH: September

DATE: 1-7

PROVINCE: Ontario

COUNTRY: Canada

LOCATION DETAILS: Red Gut Bay, Rainy Lake, ONT, Canada

NEAREST TOWN: 45 kms east of Fort Frances

NEAREST ROAD: Kings Highway 11-71

OBSERVED: What I saw when I was 14 years old is still hard to believe to this very day, it was around the first week of September I headed out to do some bird hunting like I had done years before with my grandfather. On this day he figured that I was old enough and wise enough to do this on my own now. So I went to the same old skidder trails that I have hunted since I can remember. I went out at approx: 7:00am with my 410 shot gun and my little mixed dog which was very aggressive and had run ins with bears, moose deer and everything else that lives through out the bush in northern Ontario {Red Gut Bay, Rainy Lake} since we were both young in the vast forest I had been hunting for about an hour or two with no results {Grouse} very odd for these trails which had always carried a large population of birds. I tried three or four different trails when my dog began to act very nervous and skittish on the fourth and most northerly trail, I knew something was near most likely a bear since I was starting to smell what I can only describe as a wet dog mixed with a garbage smell, it was more intense the farther up I walked the trail. With in seconds my mean little hunting dog which would and had chased or fought off anything we had come across before because she was so protective of me had suddenly took off like a greyhound in a race down back the trail when I had just started to call her name "Tina" when I heard the tall grass about three feet high in those grown over trails begin to shuffle when what I will say was a huge man-like creature which was at least twice as big and tall as any bear I had seen before or seen since. This, what I can now call a "Bigfoot" stood up, glanced at me for a second then calmly crossed into the other side of the trail in what I think was maybe two or three steps. I was 6 feet tall at that time it would have taken me half a dozen or so steps to cover that kind of ground with old logs and rocks hidden under that grass. It made almost no noise as it did so. The most outstanding features on this creature was the size of it's upper body but mostly the dark almost grayish black eyes, large ridges over its eyes were the eye brows would be, big brownish red lips, yes I was this close and scared to death even to scared to think about running or using the shotgun that was in my hands. I think I stood there for a minute or so I think maybe longer frozen with fear, the thing that may have snapped me out of this was where is my dog, my best friend that had took off so quickly. On my very fast way back down the trail I heard large branches being broke as if it was running from me as fast as I was from it. I asked myself a hundred times what the hell that could have been, now I am certain it was a Bigfoot, with it's reddish black hair or fur and walking upright with human features there was no way it could be anything else period! I have kept this secret for a long time not even telling my grandparents when I got back to the cabins. I was so stressed about this that I did not hunt for two years after that, and have never went back to those trails since.

ALSO NOTICED: bad smell, really bad

OTHER WITNESSES: no

OTHER STORIES: Only on your website, but I'm just learning more on the computer

TIME AND CONDITIONS: Approx time 8:30-9:00am weather was wet and damp visibility was great

ENVIRONMENT: Thick pine forest, with small rock faces, very remote part of Rainy Lake


Follow-up investigation report:

The witness was staying at his grandfather's cabin in Red Gut Bay. He took his dog and went grouse hunting on Indian Island which is situated on Rainy Lake not far from the cabin. He used a long abandoned trail that lead from the waters edge into the interior of the island. Since the trail has not been used for many years, grass about 3 feet high has grown over it. The area is totally secluded and contains all sorts of game such as moose, deer, bear, lynx, rabbits, skunks and lots of blueberry and raspberry bushes.

When the witness and his dog came upon the creature, he said that he must have startled it because it had the look of "surprise" on its face. He froze in his tracks when he saw this creature rise up from the left side of the trail where the grass meets the brush. He thinks it was possibly lying down or sitting. It rose up and just looked at him. He was approximately 20 - 30 feet from it and describes it as follows:

- approximately 8 feet tall
- 500 - 600 lbs.
- heavy thick torso
- massive defined muscles in its arms, shoulders and chest
- no neck
- reddish/black hair all over the body
- dark leathery face with short, patchy 1" hair all over the face except the nose, eyes and lips
- dark, sunken "lifeless" eyes with a pronounced brow
- thick reddish/brown lips
- wide slightly pug nose
- smelled of wet dog and garbage
- leaves and twigs stuck in its hair leaving an ungroomed appearance.

The duration of the encounter was about 5 seconds and during that time it made no sound. It just strode across the trail from left to right and then into the brush. He remembers it swinging its heavy arms as it walked, reminding the witness of the "Patterson" footage. The witness then ran back down the trail from where he came and he could hear the creature running in the opposite direction snapping and breaking branches as it ran through the brush.

California
YEAR: 2005

SEASON: Summer

MONTH: August

DATE: 8/20/2005

STATE: California

COUNTY: El Dorado County

LOCATION DETAILS: trail from Wright's Lake to Enchanted Pools

NEAREST TOWN: Wright's Lake

NEAREST ROAD: Wright's road

OBSERVED: I used to live in Camino, CA and would go up into Desolation Wilderness as often as I could. The trout fishing was really incredible and it left a wonderful lasting memory with me. Since moving from the area, I hadn't been there in several years. I talked to a friend of mine about going up and camp overnight and do some stream fishing. He agreed and also invited another friend along for the ride.

We got up there in the early afternoon and hiked upstream from Wright's lake and then set up camp. A couple hours later a ranger came by and informed us that we hadn't actually made it into Desolation Wilderness yet, and that we needed to keep hiking for a while. We broke camp and then the 2 guys that were with me, suggested that we go into Placerville and get a room. Apparently they weren't up to camping and fishing after all. I said no thanks and that I wanted to come up here, to come up there and fish, not go party somewhere in town. So they left and I went up the hill farther. The ranger had suggested a great camping and fishing location, but because it was starting to get later in the afternoon, there was no way I would make it all the way before dark. He gave me a general location of where it could be found and what trails to take to get there, but when most of the area is large (football field size) sheets of granite, the trails are only marked with stacks of rocks and they are few and far between.

I ended up getting lost a bit, but I could hear the stream flowing over rocks to the north of me. I walked in another half mile or so and located the stream. Below me about 35 feet down a granite cliff was a stream that did have a pool in it, right on the tree line.
I thought what a beautiful place that would be to have a campsite and then picked my way down the steep cliff side. I set up my camp directly next to the pool and also with the treeline and some very dense woods about 6 feet away to the north. The pool was on the east side of me. I started fishing as soon as my tent was back up and had a gorgeous finish to a very nice day. Then after it got dark, I climbed into my sleeping bag looking to the east to the Crystal range, I think it is called, and watched as the glow of a full moon worked it's way up over the top of the granite mountains. Once it was over, my day was complete and I decided to go to sleep. That was at 10:30 pm.

As I started to drift off to sleep, I heard what can only be described as a very low rumbling growl. When I go into a wilderness area, especially a place I know has bears really thick, I always carry a handgun with me. On this occassion it was a .45 compact. When I heard the growl, it really scared the crap out of me, because it was so close. I jumped up, with my .45 in hand and looked out the top of the screen mesh on the tent. I could see a dark mass about 4 1/2 feet tall, right at the edge of the tree line, 6 feet from my head. I yelled some really loud obscenities and started climbing out of my tent. Once I was clear of the door I brought up my pistol and fired into a dead tree a few feet away from what I thought was a big black bear. As soon as the pistol went off, it turned and ran back into the brush, but it didn't seem to go very far and that concerned me. Bears will usually run like heck and for a long time when they get a shot that close. This seemed to go maybe 50 feet or so into very thick brush. I could hear it thrashing about as it moved deeper into the trees, but then it just stopped. It all went quiet for about 15 minutes or so and then I tried going back to bed. Shortly after I started hearing what sounded like somewhat large rocks, hitting in the water, just above the pool I was camped beside. It would happen every couple of minutes or so. It was the sound of not only the splash, but also of the rock hitting other rocks, submerged in shin deep water. That "cracking" sound. This really concerned me, thinking the "bear" may be circling my campsite and trying to get at me from a different angle. I got out out my tent on several occasions, and was trying to see if I could make out any movement on the other side of the stream but nothing. I usually keep a small flashlight in my tackle box, which I had, but it was one of those small "shake it" and it charges up the cell and lights up for a few minutes. Not much of a flashlight really and worse yet, the handle is clear and so when I would turn it on, the handle would light up too, actually making it harder to see. I had a full moon though and the area is surrounded with stark white granite slabs, and so except in the darkest of the woods, I could see pretty clearly. This went on like this until 2:00 am. That was when I got another "visit". I didn't get to see it, this time, but I heard movement really close to my tent again, same place as the first time, and when I yelled at it, I got a return of something that sounded like an "Ooof" "Ooof", but really deep sounding. I jumped out of my tent again thinking I was going to see it again, but didnt. Still, I put another shot into the dead tree and off it went crashing through the brush again. Again it only went about 50 feet back. There was something odd about the way it sounded when it was running too. I didn't catch what it was though until I listened to the footsteps of a bipedal walking from your site here. It was only on two feet!! It concerned me enough to realize that it didn't sound like a 4 legged animal at the time, but I didn't know what was different until I heard your recordings. Anyway, still thinking I was dealing with a rogue bear, I started trying to figure out what it wanted with me. Was I camped on it's trail to the water? Was it used to finding food in tents? Desolation is a very high traffic place. This particular place was a ways off the trail and it didn't appear to have much in the way of hikers. Hikers usually leave some kind of sign, trash, fish hooks, something to say that they were here before, but this place was very clean.

So I decide to take my sleeping bag out of the tent and move over to the middle of this big slab of granite that I am on. There is about a 4 foot tall ledge facing the woods where all the activity was going on. But now the treeline is 50 feet away and not 6. Figuring this would give me some advance warning if I got charged. The rocks kept flying, and I kept trying to sleep with one eye open, hoping the sun would come up soon, and checking my watch all night long. Then "she" showed up. It was 4:40 am and something woke me. I heard movement at the tree line again and I looked to where it all started from. I didn't see anything but then I looked at my tent. Standing right next to my tent was the "creature?". My tent is about 4 feet tall maybe a little less and what I saw was more than twice as tall. At first I couldn't see any features, just the outline. Then it took a couple of steps towards me. I almost pee'd my pants right there. I picked up the .45 and took a shot off to the left of it. It stopped and looked at me. Then it started walking towards me again. It was very fast. I don't mean that it was running, it's just that the steps were so big, the distance was closing very fast. Had it been a bear, I would have shot it immediately, but honestly, I don't think my .45 would have been able to stop it. One shot would definitely not killed it or stopped it in its tracks. Then as it was approaching me, I took another shot, but this one much closer. I could see it very clearly at this point and yes I did pee my pants. The second shot made her stop again, and then she took off running to the northwest through an area of mostly granite slab and dotted with scrub pine. This was the last time I saw her. She ran off out of sight at great speed. I stayed up the rest of the night until it got light enough for me to hike back towards Wrights Lake to the South West. For the remainder of the darkness I pretty much stayed put with the ledge to my back and my gun in my hand, and shaking in my skin. I have not been able to sleep right since then, and for the next couple of months after the incident, I couldn't sleep at all. Everytime I closed my eyes, I would hear the growls and the rocks splashing and then see her coming at me. I would be willing to take someone back up there to show where it happened, but only during daylight hours. I have been a hunter and fisherman most of my life and have seen what I thought, was every animal in the woods at one time or another. Nothing like this has ever shown it's face before, and I hope it never does again.

There was another incident however. On December 13th, 1992 up in Snow Mountain Wilderness area, above Elk Creek California. I would be willing to talk to someone about this also.

ALSO NOTICED: There was so much going on. At first, there was the growl heard right outside my tent, and when I jumped up and looked out the rain fly on top, I could see it, crouched down. This is what made me intially think it was a large bear. It was a large mass about 4 1/2 feet tall tucked in the treeline about 6 feet away. When I jumped out and yelled at "it" and then fired my .45 into a dead tree a few feet away, it ran away into the brush, but only about 50 feet back into the woods. This I thought was unusual, because a bear will usually take off running and not stop until sunrise! After about 15 mintues it got really quiet and I assumed it had left the area. But thats when the rocks started landing in the water just upstream about 20 yards. This went on all night long. Just as I was ready to get back to sleep, another rock or two would hit the shallow stream and make a splash as well as the rock on rock "cracking" noise. That was followed up by another visit at 2:00 am and then the biggy at 4:40am.

OTHER WITNESSES: No. Unfortunately it was only me.

OTHER STORIES: no not in this area, and I have been going there for many years. When I lived in the area I used to go into Desolation wilderness all the time. Just about every weekend that I wasn't working during the summer months. I've camped there at Wright's Lake as well as with my stepson at Dark Lake. There was one time when we spent the night at Dark Lake, that we had footsteps all around our campsite and it kept us up all night, not knowing for sure what it was, and there was some wood knocking going on then too. But other than that, the only other time where I had an encounter was a hunting trip into the Snow Mountain wilderness area up above Elk Creek, California. That will be a whole different episode!

TIME AND CONDITIONS: from 10:35pm until 4:40am the following morning.

ENVIRONMENT: It is primarily glaciated granite, surrounded by sparse high altitude pine trees. You know how the trees start getting thin and scraggly when you get up above 7,000 feet.

Follow-up investigation report:

This credible sighting lasted long enough for the witness to make some focused observations. I interviewed the witness by telephone, and asked for some clarifications and other observations not given in the report, based on my notes from the original information submitted. The conversation lasted an hour and a half, discussing a variety of subjects; some not related to the encounter. I undoubtedly did not ask all the questions about the encounter that I could have, and in writing this report from my notes, other questions about movement and morphology have come to mind. I will be in contact with the witness, and may possibly have him take me to the site sometime in the next few weeks. This report may be updated as I learn more about the encounter.

The witness is ex-military, having had training as a sniper; this training involves observation as much or more than it does weapons proficiency. It can be assumed that the witness is excellent at judging distance and size, as well as relative features of the terrain.

In a phone conversation with the witness, the investigator obtained the following information:

Description:

When the figure got within about 15 feet of the witness, the bright full moonlight illuminated the front of it and allowed this witness to see some details of the face shape, among other things. The animal's face was "similar to a human," with the nose being slightly wider, and the lips about the same proportion as human. The nostrils faced downward, not outward like a gorilla. The lower jaw was wider and larger in proportion to the head than a human. There was hair on the face and jaw, similar to a beard, about 1-1.5" in length. The hair on the head, shoulders and arms was considerably longer, ranging from 3-8". The hair was not thick like fur, as the skin could be seen through it in places. The witness said that he could see breasts, and decided that it was a female based on that observation; "Breasts were large and saggy, but everything was for the most part, proportionate. They weren't excessively large. Yes, I saw the nipples, brown in color".

The eyes appeared brown, with no whites showing. Eyes were about the same size in proportion to the head as a human. The level of the mouth was about even with the shoulders. The arm length was longer than human, with the fingertips not quite reaching the knees.

The head was conical in appearance from the side, but the "cone" was not evident when facing the animal. The back of the head appeared mainly flat coming down from the peak of the "cone" toward the shoulders. (The above description is as related by the witness sitting on the ground 15' away from the animal, looking upwards at it)

Movement:
The arms were carried low while walking both at a "normal" pace and when retreating rapidly; they did not bend at the elbow as much as a person moving rapidly. The walking strides were particularly long, covering a lot of distance quickly, but not in a jerky or forced manner. The fast retreat involved more arm motion, and when asked specifically about whether at any time both feet were off the ground (running; vs. one foot in the air at a time being considered walking), the witness thought that they might have been off the ground at the same time, but wasn't certain. The overall motion while moving rapidly was said to be a loping motion. Before the retreat, the animal turned it's head rapidly and looked toward the treeline. This movement was stated to involve only the head, which turned sideways parallel to the shoulders, followed by the body in the same direction, at which time the animal began it's rapid retreat in that direction. It reportedly did not head directly toward the treeline and cover, but headed off over the granite keeping the same general course until it was out of sight.

Sounds:
The initial growl was very loud, and deeper in timbre than the witness could imitate. The witness said that it seemed that the growl was directed at them, and not an ancillary growl in general. The "oof oof" sounds were also very deep, each lasting about a half second, separated by as much time (from witness's imitation).

Other:
Height is estimated at 84"-90" (7'-7'6"), based on the relative height when compared to the tent, which measures 42" tall. Witness said that it was about twice as tall or a little more than the tent when standing next to it.


Rock throwing came from the same strip of trees where the 4.5' tall mass was initially seen. This strip of trees was about 15' wide near the tent, and narrowed to about 6' where it reached the stream. The strip of trees widened as it got further from the stream; pie shaped. The initial sound of the animal running away went into the thicker section of the strip away from the stream.

There was no indication that there was more than one animal involved, or in the area. The audible rock throwing did not occur while the animal was in sight.

No smells were mentioned.

No eye reflection was mentioned.

When asked about whether the animal had any expression (anthropomorphic) on it's face as it approached, the witness said that it had none that they could discern.

Exchanges of topo maps and aerial photographs have pinpointed the location of the incident.

Added Oct. 25:
I returned to the location with the witness, and took pictures and measurements. I reconstructed his campsite with flagging tape to show orientation of the tent, and relative location(s) of the animal. I also videotaped his accounting of what happened. We found the bullet holes in the stump, and they lined up exactly with the spot where he said he was standing outside his tent. We also found a depression in the ground, 8'x6' x 3' deep, in the general location that the rocks were being thrown from. I tossed a couple baseball sized rocks into the stream from there, and the witness said that was similar to the sound that he heard. We did a quick survey of the area, and found a couple foot shaped depressions, but they were old and could have easily been made by a hiker. No tree-breaks, stacking, isolated limb breaks or other suspected sasquatch related behavior was noticed. Any tracks left from the encounter would have been obliterated by the winter snow and runoff. Some of the measurements were off from the witness's estimations; the stump was about 24', not 6' from the tent door. The treeline was about 15' at the closest to the tent. The animal did approach within 15' of his hiding place, though. It should be mentioned that the terrain in this area is three-dimensional. There are ledges and slopes and steps everywhere; the location where the witness was sitting on the granite against a ledge was actually several feet lower in elevation than the water level near his tent 25' away. The spot where the animal was standing next to the tent was almost a foot higher than the ground the tent was on, and the base of the stump was over 2' higher than the ground at the tent. The spot where it stood 15' from the witness was a little over a foot higher than the ground at his location. While the terrain in that area has a lot of open space on the granite, the drainages and cracks and canyons are very thick with trees and brush. There are nearby grassy meadows and swampy areas, as well as mountain lakes and streams. We noticed bear tracks on route to the site, and there was evidence of deer, so this area can support large animals at least in the summer. Clarification on the amount of light available at 04:30 that night: the full moon was at the back of the witness and not diffused by trees. In the clear air of the mountains or desert, a full moon is bright enough to allow you to read a book; this is based on the personal observations of both the witness and the investigator.


ETR - Debunked Georgia Sighting

Literally anyone with a brain can type this nonsense and pass it off as being some sort of report/evidence...

Taking this seriously is a waste of time, i'd rather watch Wayne Rooney combing his brand new fringe....
 
Most Footers watch Finding Bigfoot religiously and act like they're witnessing groundbreaking research, i'd rather watch 2 Broke Girls, and thats a crock of *****.
Not in my experience if the BFF is an indication of most footer's attitudes towards the show, it causes deep embarrassment and chagrin as well it should.
 
That's funny. I know a bed and breakfast owner who's had experiences of her own. She's pretty rational, but after living in a remote area in Texas for years, she now believes in the chupacabra.

Does that mean I should believe in it?

Isn't the Chupacabra just some sort of wild canine? I'd buy that more than i'd buy into Bigfoot.
 
Not in my experience if the BFF is an indication of most footer's attitudes towards the show, it causes deep embarrassment and chagrin as well it should.

I barely got through the whole 60mins when it aired here in the UK a few weeks ago...

Seriously, the Discovery channel seems to be losing its grip on reality these days. That being said, Beast Man is a guilty pleasure of mine, I actually don't think Pat Spain is a bad fella.
 
What Parn says about probability is reasonable. How many sightings do you have in relation to the human population world wide and specifically here in the U.S.?

If these sightings are related to misidentification, then I would ask if there is any kind of wild life native to these other areas of the world that could be mistaken for sasquatch? Are there sightings in Great Britain?

Just one historical one that I know about in Scotland, but other than that, I can't say I the I recall reading anything recent. Great Britain does not have any native large predators although they do have big cat reports. There is a precedence for that in the history of exotic pet ownership in the 1970's to explain their presence if one is ever caught.

If the phenomena was mainly hallucinatory then it seems one would find the reports evenly distributed world wide and that is not the case.

So, Gigantor, in relation to that database, maybe you have the cart before the horse. I would try to figure out a way to provide some kind of statistical relevance to the reports, discard all of the old ones, and start from scratch if I wanted the data to be meaningful. Since man is bipedal I think it would end up being a very, very small percentage of reports that would make the cut.
 
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So, I can just make up a story about seeing Bigfoot and it'd be back to the drawing board for the skeptics simply because they'd have to prove my story wrong before being able to discount it?

Are you seriously attempting to claim that all reports are false? :eye-poppi
 
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Are you seriously attempting to claim that all reports are false? :eye-poppi

Yep. Are you seriously trying to claim that Bigfoot is lurking in the backwoods of the USA, constantly eluding science and evading the laws of nature? I find that to be more mindboggling than my belief that every report is bollocks...
 
What Parn says about probability is reasonable. How many sightings do you have in relation to the human population world wide and specifically here in the U.S.?

If these sightings are related to misidentification, then I would ask if there is any kind of wild life native to these other areas of the world that could be mistaken for sasquatch? Are there sightings in Great Britain?

Just one historical one that I know about in Scotland, but other than that, I can't say I the I recall reading anything recent. Great Britain does not have any native large predators although they do have big cat reports. There is a precedence for that in the history of exotic pet ownership in the 1970's to explain their presence if one is ever caught.

If the phenomena was mainly hallucinatory then it seems one would find the reports evenly distributed world wide and that is not the case.

So, Gigantor, in relation to that database, maybe you have the cart before the horse. I would try to figure out a way to provide some kind of statistical relevance to the reports, discard all of the old ones, and start from scratch if I wanted the data to be meaningful.


There are "British Bigfoot" reports, wildman stories are rife throughout European folklore, but they have no relation to the modern Bigfoot legend, its just that people try to connect the two.

The Scottish story that people are confused by is the Grey Man of Ben Mac Dui, but this story has its roots firmly in the area of the supernatural rather than the Bigfoot phenomena.

The lines between the wildman stories of European folklore and that of the modern Bigfoot legend have been blurred by a need for the creature to be real as far as the believers are concerned.
 
With regards to British big cats, I have observed a large black cat in the fields in Surrey about 2 years ago when I was working away from home, they are here, its not much of a suprise.

People did own them, and some people still do, illegally. An Alligator was siezed from a house near Liverpool this week.
 
I can see that, but then it gets in to terminology and what was called what , and the various descriptions that you have of bigfoot now.

I just think it would really be hard to ever rely on reports unless you had a type specimen to validate the observation.
 
@Jodie. Thanks for the advice, but I'm not trying to prove anything with the database. I started it as a way to learn PHP/MySQL programming and I've achieved that.

It is cool to be able to search the reports easily though.

I have to tell you, I'm impressed with your transformation and can't help to wonder if you've had any visitors this spring?
 
I can see that, but then it gets in to terminology and what was called what , and the various descriptions that you have of bigfoot now.

I just think it would really be hard to ever rely on reports unless you had a type specimen to validate the observation.

The only story in the UK that I can say matches the modern Bigfoot legend is of the Tarbock Ape, but this story is most certainly just modern folklore.

Liverpool is rife with Werewolf stories, especially from the 1700-1800's. Speke is a district in Liverpool which seems to have a rich history in Werewolf-lore.

Mind you, i've yet to see any ape's in Tarbock or any wolves in Speke!
 
and how do you know this? (you might want to review the list of fallacies)



No. In fact, I'm a skeptic.

I don't know it, its my opinion, but if i'm to stand by my belief that Bigfoot doesn't exist, then i'd be hard-pressed to give any credence to some random eyewitness report regarding Sasquatch being real, no?
 
@Jodie. Thanks for the advice, but I'm not trying to prove anything with the database. I started it as a way to learn PHP/MySQL programming and I've achieved that.

It is cool to be able to search the reports easily though.

I have to tell you, I'm impressed with your transformation and can't help to wonder if you've had any visitors this spring?

I haven't , but right on schedule my neighbor had 6 yellow M&M's, an unbroken bird's egg, and a beer bottle cap left on her deck a few nights ago. The mystery continues and ironically once I put up my game cam on my brother's deck, the activity moved.
 
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