Moderated Bigfoot- Anybody Seen one?

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Another case of proponents being in a place where it was unlikely any humans would be.

With the water splashing, sounding like a rock being thrown into the river - beavers make that sound. They can make a "slap", "kerplunk", "kaboosh", "slorp", and a "foosh" among other sounds depending on what they're up to. Easy to spot them and the different kinds of rings they make in still water, but in a running river it is more difficult.
 
parnassus said:
... I am surprised that Ketchum has not published her data somewhere, which would have given her a foothold, and created a long-lasting schism within the cult...
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“Scientists generally are eager—they can’t wait—to tell their colleagues about their findings,” King says. “But in patent law, if you publish a finding, it becomes ‘prior art.’ So you cannot patent a gene sequence once you’ve published it. As a result, those people who are trying to patent don’t talk. You go to a scientific meeting, and you ask them a question, and they’ll say, ‘I can’t answer that. There are intellectual property rights issues.’ This whole rich culture of biomedical research, this culture of cooperation and communication, is now being strangled.”
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1242062/pdf/ehp0109-a00030.pdf

Maybe Melba is trying to patent the genuine bigfoot DNA before asking Wally Hersom to back her "clone a bigfoot" project? :D
 
GT/CS said:
That's why it's so much fun to watch the "bigfoot is human' DNA soap opera. The 'footers high priest (Meldrum) finally had to step in to try to put a stop to it, and he'll probably be successful, so by this time next year the staus quo should be reestablished.
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I really don't think anything is going to come of either study.
 
parnassus said:
every unwitnessed event becomes a bigfoot act.
I was almost hit by a falling pine cone yesterday. Was bigfoot sending me a messagehttp://bigfootevidence.blogspot.com/2012/06/watch-this-bigfoot-throws-rock-at.html?
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Word. That is the entertaining part. "I felt like something was watching me and all of the sudden there was a thrashing in the bushes and I heard BI PEE DULL footsteps and and and....


If you dont know what it is. Bigfoot. Didnt see anything. Bigfoot. Left out food = gone. Bigfoot!

Then you have things like this bundle of joy.
 
Castro said:
“Scientists generally are eager—they can’t wait—to tell their colleagues about their findings,” King says. “But in patent law, if you publish a finding, it becomes ‘prior art.’ So you cannot patent a gene sequence once you’ve published it. As a result, those people who are trying to patent don’t talk. You go to a scientific meeting, and you ask them a question, and they’ll say, ‘I can’t answer that. There are intellectual property rights issues.’ This whole rich culture of biomedical research, this culture of cooperation and communication, is now being strangled.”
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1242062/pdf/ehp0109-a00030.pdf

Maybe Melba is trying to patent the genuine bigfoot DNA before asking Wally Hersom to back her "clone a bigfoot" project? :D
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I have speculated that she was trying to patent a bigfoot DNA test. However, the elapsed time frame is much too long for that, imho. IANAL but once you have submitted a patent application, you have established first rights. And if she had the right answer, she could have submitted that long ago.

No, I think she is looking at a bunch of human DNA and scratching her head, saying, I know the answer is in this data somewhere, but where?

You have to be joking about the clone a bigfoot project.

I get the sense that Wally's money may have bought her some new equipment, but I think that Hersom is smart enough to demand that Ketchum show him the peer-reviewed meat before he tosses another hundred thou into the black hole. Speaking of Hersom, I wonder what his level of frustration is nowadays. I think he has backed every major player in this game, except maybe Bill Munns. At some point, he has to take a hard look at the results. Bigfootery has been riding high on Wally, and the TV money, but the public's taste is fickle. If Bigfoot were an IPO, I'd take my profits and run. If Moneymaker is smart, he'd sell the BFRO; it'll never be worth more than it is right now.
 
The head exploding is actually a reasonable proposition, but the impetus is more likely high blood pressure combined with too much blow up the nose.
 
Don't know too much about woolyboogers other than what I found at the first page of a quick Googling. Among some NSFW definitions that clearly would not apply, it included "A person who is one evolutionary step lower than a redneck." and "a booger (bogeyman) that is very hairy. This type of person usually has a lot of facial hair".
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=wooly booger
http://neologisms.rice.edu/index.php?a=term&d=1&t=2030

So, no bigfoot here. No fringe subject, no bigfoot.

I have the impression shadow people are more recent bits of lore or urban folklore, legend, whatever. I believe I first heard about it in the late 80's, but I may be mistaken or just poorly informed. Sure, I bet someone can twist older myths and force-fit them in to shadow people babble, as footers do with bigfoot and myths from several parts of the world. Shadow people's decriptions are not similar to bigfoot's (again I bet one can find "intersections" between them, especially the paranormal bigfoot folks).

So, I really don't think there is or were, as you wrote, "a deeply ingrained belief in the existence of "shadow people" or "woollyboogers", as they were called back then before the name bigfoot came into popular usage." I think its quite possible you built these connections quite later by confusing and blending some unrelated bits of lore. Its also possible that your memories of the accounts are not exact. Its been a long time since you heard them.

Another comment:
You wrote
"As far as the Nephilim are concerned, I'ld heard a new theory a couple of years ago that this is what people were calling the Neandertal when we co- existed together in Israel."
First, its not a theory. Its just a fantasy. Theories are based on facts, on evidence, they can be tested and used to build predictions.
Second, its a fantasy built over ignorance and data cherry-picking. Neanderthals were strong, more muscular than the average H. sapiens, but they were also shorter.
Third, following the above line on ignarance and cherry-picking, Neanderthals were long gone by the Bronze Age, so the odds that the folks who compiled myths to build the OT or the people who created these myths or even the people who built the oldest cities in the Middle East having ever met a Neanderthal are very very very slim.

Fringe subjects such as bigfoot are built over ignorance, cherry-picking and distortions. I hope you can see that very little can be trusted from those sources.
 
Correa Neto said:
Don't know too much about woolyboogers other than what I found at the first page of a quick Googling. Among some NSFW definitions that clearly would not apply, it included "A person who is one evolutionary step lower than a redneck." and "a booger (bogeyman) that is very hairy. This type of person usually has a lot of facial hair".
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=wooly booger
http://neologisms.rice.edu/index.php?a=term&d=1&t=2030

So, no bigfoot here. No fringe subject, no bigfoot.

I have the impression shadow people are more recent bits of lore or urban folklore, legend, whatever. I believe I first heard about it in the late 80's, but I may be mistaken or just poorly informed. Sure, I bet someone can twist older myths and force-fit them in to shadow people babble, as footers do with bigfoot and myths from several parts of the world. Shadow people's decriptions are not similar to bigfoot's (again I bet one can find "intersections" between them, especially the paranormal bigfoot folks).

So, I really don't think there is or were, as you wrote, "a deeply ingrained belief in the existence of "shadow people" or "woollyboogers", as they were called back then before the name bigfoot came into popular usage." I think its quite possible you built these connections quite later by confusing and blending some unrelated bits of lore. Its also possible that your memories of the accounts are not exact. Its been a long time since you heard them.

Another comment:
You wrote
"As far as the Nephilim are concerned, I'ld heard a new theory a couple of years ago that this is what people were calling the Neandertal when we co- existed together in Israel."
First, its not a theory. Its just a fantasy. Theories are based on facts, on evidence, they can be tested and used to build predictions.
Second, its a fantasy built over ignorance and data cherry-picking. Neanderthals were strong, more muscular than the average H. sapiens, but they were also shorter.
Third, following the above line on ignarance and cherry-picking, Neanderthals were long gone by the Bronze Age, so the odds that the folks who compiled myths to build the OT or the people who created these myths or even the people who built the oldest cities in the Middle East having ever met a Neanderthal are very very very slim.

Fringe subjects such as bigfoot are built over ignorance, cherry-picking and distortions. I hope you can see that very little can be trusted from those sources.
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I wasn't there before 1962 to vouch for what they called them, or to know if they were talking about the same things but those terms; woollybooger, shadow people, and bigfoot were used interchangeably by my grandfather when describing a couple of past family stories and some others from the area. I got the impression no one doubted him, combined with my father thinking he saw one, it confirmed it in everyone's mind, I'm sure. I don't know what else to say about it.

The first time I heard the so called theory was from Simcha Jocobovici. According to the him, the word "giant" was misinterpreted since there wasn't an exact translation into Greek. It was something along the lines of the other descriptors used of "mighty men" or "tyrant". I don't know Aramaic to verify the error and it depends on whose opinion you read whether that is accurate. However, HS and Neandertal did occupy the Levant for thousands of years before the Neandertal disappeared in the last HS occupation.

It's really no different than what everyone has been saying about my stories that over time, words take on different meanings, stories morph the real into the surreal i.e. the Nephilim become so called "fallen angels". The best way to rationalize exterminating an enemy is to make that enemy less than human, if that was really a contributing factor to the Neandertals' demise.

I always thought the biblical stories were based on much older stories that were passed down by word of mouth. It seemed reasonable to me that the so called Nephilim could be a racial memory of when we coexisted with another species. Is it fact, who knows? I don't think it's likely it could ever be proven.
 
parnassus said:
every unwitnessed event becomes a bigfoot act.
I was almost hit by a falling pine cone yesterday. Was bigfoot sending me a message?
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This sounds like " a category B Encounter" to me. I hope that you file a report with the appropriate authorities.. um.. organization ?

I had a squirrel run into the road in front of me yesterday. It stopped in the middle of the road not sure which way to go .. then reversed course toward what I am sure must have been the source of its willingness for enternal peril ?
 
This may not be the right place to discuss this, but I'll raise it anyway.
What is the typical behavior of a lapsed cult member? Seek to maintain relationships in the cult? Seek support from non-believers? become an active denouncer?
eh?
?
 
Wow, great question parn. I don't know the answer. But I sure think this productive ground to plow!

Grief is involved for sure so you probably have elements of the Kübler-Ross model (five stages of grief) or other grief models. There are some long-time posters here that were 'footers before so we do have some examples. The most recent - I am uneasy about.
 
Jodie said:
I wasn't there before 1962 to vouch for what they called them, or to know if they were talking about the same things but those terms; woollybooger, shadow people, and bigfoot were used interchangeably by my grandfather when describing a couple of past family stories and some others from the area...
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Not until the 1960's though. In fact, probably not until after 1967. Maybe not until 1970. Why Bigfoot? If Woollybooger was good enough for 1942, why wasn't it good enough for 1970? If someone had a convincing Woollybooger encounter, why wouldn't he stick to the name until 1970? Is Woollybooger not glamourous enough for 1970? Woollybooger didn't get a spot on TV? Would have thought that if one had a face to face run in with a Woollybooger, they'd be pretty damn sure it was a Woollybooger. That they'd be confident enough to remain adamant it was a Woollybooger, despite the 1970 movie star status of Bigfoot.

Was Patty that close to a Woollybooger, it was obviously one and the same? It doesn't seem like it. And if the description is vague enough to include Bigfoot, how certain can they be that they ran into Woollyboogers in the first place? I'd be more impressed by the story if the old timers had told you- "It was a Woollybooger. Dunno what this newfangled hippie Bigfoot thing is supposed to be. Probably some b******* made up by some drunk west coast cowboys. But, Woollyboogers... they're real. We've seem them."
 
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Jodie, you (actually we all) must be very careful regarding confirmation bias and memory (the interpretation of memories, to be more precise).

Woollybooger, for example, sounds more like a term used for a particulary frightening or ugly-looking wanderer, boogeyman. Something children must stay away from. In my childhood, here in Brazil, it was the "homem-do-saco" (man with the sack). An unkempt vagabond that would kidnap children, carrying them in the sack. Seems a similar tale, with a similar role. Shadow people are a different sort of lore. So, I think you should entertain the possibility of being wrong in you interpretation of the whole thing.

As for Simcha's ideas... Well, I believe here we have a nice example, a nice case of something where one must use critical thinking. Yes, its OT but the principles can and should be applied to bigfootery.

He's been involved with some interesting documentaries, but I have the impression that in some cases he's relying way too much on some Biblical accounts being real and exact. Then he looks at the archeological data and picks the bits (quite often tiny) he believes that match with his interpretations. The link between Akrotiri eruption and the Exodus, as well as his Spanish Atlantis are, IMHO, examples of this.

It seems a similar thing is happening regarding the Neanderthal-Nephilim link, but I must say that everything I know about it are second-hand accounts found after a quick googling. Assuming his point on the translations is correct, there are some very big problems.

First, its based on something very weak- the Nephilim being real, having existed and not being antyhing other than pure myth. It also requires the Nephilim (actually their legend) having been native to what is nowadays Israel and not a bit of lore from somewhere else, an older bit of lore inherited from another older civilization, from another part of the Middle East, as it happened with the Deluge myth. Second, it ignores the fact that Neanderthals lived in the Levant tens of thousands of years before the first cities were built there. It also requires some cultural continuity betwee these early people and the proto-Israeli people and AFAIK, there are no good evidences for this. Thus the Nephilim-Neanderthal link seems to be built on belief and wishful-thinking. Sure, I may be completely mistaken, but if you want to dig deeper on this, I suggest you to ask about it to the forum's resident expert on Levant-related stuff, Marduk. But, if I am correct, once you look deeper in to it, its nothing but a castle of cards. Like many things in bigfootery.
 
AttorneyTom said:
This sounds like " a category B Encounter" to me. I hope that you file a report with the appropriate authorities.. um.. organization ?

I had a squirrel run into the road in front of me yesterday. It stopped in the middle of the road not sure which way to go .. then reversed course toward what I am sure must have been the source of its willingness for enternal peril ?
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according to Moneymaker, bigfoot chases deer in front of vehicles: the lazy way to get a kill.
 
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