Bicyclist assaults NYPD officer

[Bell]

Okay, after Googling the complaint and watching the video a few more times, it indeed looks like Pogan was moving to intercept Long. I can't make out Pogan's instruction, but I'm not sure if the camera would pick that up over the noise of all the yelling people.

It still is unclear to me - from that video - if Pogan slammed Long to the ground, or if it was an accident where they both ran into each other. It does look like Long, at the very last moment, was steering back into the direction that Pogan was coming from. Maybe to avoid the storm drain?

It's a though call, especially since everything happens very quickly.

 

[davefoc]

Okay, after Googling the complaint and watching the video a few more times, it indeed looks like Pogan was moving to intercept Long. I can't make out Pogan's instruction, but I'm not sure if the camera would pick that up over the noise of all the yelling people.

It still is unclear to me - from that video - if Pogan slammed Long to the ground, or if it was an accident where they both ran into each other. It does look like Long, at the very last moment, was steering back into the direction that Pogan was coming from. Maybe to avoid the storm drain?

It's a though call, especially since everything happens very quickly.

Bell, I just took another look at the video and I have a hard time imagining what you are seeing. Pogan clearly accelerated into the cyclist. The cyclist turned to avoid him. It would easily be possible by stepping through the video one image at a time to quantify the acceleration. Two quick steps followed by a purposeful brace for pushing off is obvious in the video. It is also absolutely clear that the Pogan intended to knock the cyclist off the bike. After he braced himself, he extends his arm to knock the cyclist off (I single stepped and screen captured the image that shows an extended arm). I appreciate the fact that many in this thread have attempted to discern possible reasons for the policeman's actions but this is just about as clear cut case of an unjustified assault by a policeman that I have ever seen barring as has been noted many times before some precipitating event that wasn't captured on camera.

Over the years I have been a bit of an apologist for various police actions. I just don't see any legitimate defense of this action.

As to your comment that the cyclist seemed to be turning in the direction of Pogan at the last instant:
Of course, he had corrected his course to avoid Pogan by steering away from Pogan. When he was nearly alongside Pogan and was at a point where he would have passed Pogan if Pogan had not accelerated into him the cyclist turns back to a straight path to continue his ride.

As to your question of whether Pogan slammed the cyclist to the ground: Pogan didn't push the cyclist to the ground. Pogan pushed the cyclist off his bicycle. The cyclist was thrown to the ground by gravity. From the video it appeared that Pogan's momentum caused him to follow the cyclist after the cyclist was knocked off his bike. I don't think there is evidence to suggest that Pogan pushed the cyclist toward the ground after the cyclist had been knocked off his bike.

I do not think it is an exaggeration that death was a plausible outcome of this event. There appeared to be a sign post very near where the cyclist crashed to the ground. It is easily imaginable that the cyclist's skull would have been crushed if the cyclist had slid into that pole.

 

[Bell]

Bell, I just took another look at the video and I have a hard time imagining what you are seeing. Pogan clearly accelerated into the cyclist. The cyclist turned to avoid him. It would easily be possible by stepping through the video one image at a time to quantify the acceleration. Two quick steps followed by a purposeful brace for pushing off is obvious in the video. It is also absolutely clear that the Pogan intended to knock the cyclist off the bike. After he braced himself, he extends his arm to knock the cyclist off (I single stepped and screen captured the image that shows an extended arm). I appreciate the fact that many in this thread have attempted to discern possible reasons for the policeman's actions but this is just about as clear cut case of an unjustified assault by a policeman that I have ever seen barring as has been noted many times before some precipitating event that wasn't captured on camera.

Thanks for your lengthy reply, Davefoc. I have watched the video a couple of more times and I now agree that Pogan knocks Long off his bicycle.

Over the years I have been a bit of an apologist for various police actions. I just don't see any legitimate defense of this action.

That's why I wanted to try and really see what happened. I have a great deal of respect for cops. It is easy to cry police brutality when an incident involving cops turns nasty.

As to your comment that the cyclist seemed to be turning in the direction of Pogan at the last instant:
Of course, he had corrected his course to avoid Pogan by steering away from Pogan. When he was nearly alongside Pogan and was at a point where he would have passed Pogan if Pogan had not accelerated into him the cyclist turns back to a straight path to continue his ride.

As to your question of whether Pogan slammed the cyclist to the ground: Pogan didn't push the cyclist to the ground. Pogan pushed the cyclist off his bicycle. The cyclist was thrown to the ground by gravity. From the video it appeared that Pogan's momentum caused him to follow the cyclist after the cyclist was knocked off his bike. I don't think there is evidence to suggest that Pogan pushed the cyclist toward the ground after the cyclist had been knocked off his bike.

I see that now. Also, slamming in the ground was a poor word choice. I meant knocking him of his bicyle (resulting Long to fall to the ground).

I do not think it is an exaggeration that death was a plausible outcome of this event. There appeared to be a sign post very near where the cyclist crashed to the ground. It is easily imaginable that the cyclist's skull would have been crushed if the cyclist had slid into that pole.

That was my first thought when I first saw the video, how violent the crash was. Luckely Long escaped fairly unharmed. But that also made me skeptical about the incident. Because the outcome was so violent, that could maybe influence how people watch the movie. Also the fact that it all happened very fast.

Eta: Weird how one's POV changes the perception of the incident. When I first assumed Pogan was walking to the curb, it seemed totally convincable that he started running to avoid Long. After reading the complaint, it is very clear that Pogan stares down Long and tries to intercept him.

 

[davefoc]

One thing we haven't discussed in this thread is just how screwed Pogan is. Past the issue of whether he deserves it or not, he has suffered a major blow early in his life.

Any kind of police work seems impossible. Even private security stuff seems like it might be difficult to come by because of the need to be bonded in some of that stuff.

The felony convictions that are likely to follow seem like a major impediment to many different kinds of jobs.

We're in the middle of a significant economic downturn so even people that don't have felony convictions are having trouble finding work.

He might be rejected from even entry level retail sales work because of the filing a false police report thing.

I was thinking that he might be able to catch on as some kind of bounty hunter.

 

[Rasmus]

One thing we haven't discussed in this thread is just how screwed Pogan is. Past the issue of whether he deserves it or not, he has suffered a major blow early in his life.

Any kind of police work seems impossible. Even private security stuff seems like it might be difficult to come by because of the need to be bonded in some of that stuff.

The felony convictions that are likely to follow seem like a major impediment to many different kinds of jobs.

We're in the middle of a significant economic downturn so even people that don't have felony convictions are having trouble finding work.

He might be rejected from even entry level retail sales work because of the filing a false police report thing.

I was thinking that he might be able to catch on as some kind of bounty hunter.

I don't think there is a lot to discuss there. Yes, he's pretty much screwed. If guilty, he deserves it. It's not like he forgot to pay a parking ticket or something. He assaulted another person, risking their life, all the while hiding behind the uniform that was meant to protect the law. He then went on to lie about what happened, further abusing his position as a policeman.

There's some people that I'll hold to a higher standard than others, doctors and police officers are among them. My life depends on their trustworthiness, and I take my life very seriously.

 

[Molinaro]

I see, so you had police escort and you were performing a service which everyone agrees is respectful. You weren't just doing it because you all had agreed amongst yourselves that this is what you'd do regardless of what anyone else thought or where they had to go or what they had to do. Well, that's different, then.

Police on bycicles accompanied every critical mass I joined. How about you actualy make sure you know what you are talking about before throwing the scarcasm around, ok?

Everyone agrees that stoping traffic for a funeral procession is ok? When was that survey done?

 

[Monketi Ghost]

One thing we haven't discussed in this thread is just how screwed Pogan is. Past the issue of whether he deserves it or not, he has suffered a major blow early in his life.

Any kind of police work seems impossible. Even private security stuff seems like it might be difficult to come by because of the need to be bonded in some of that stuff.

The felony convictions that are likely to follow seem like a major impediment to many different kinds of jobs.

We're in the middle of a significant economic downturn so even people that don't have felony convictions are having trouble finding work.

He might be rejected from even entry level retail sales work because of the filing a false police report thing.

I was thinking that he might be able to catch on as some kind of bounty hunter.

Cops are supposed to stop assaults, not be assaultive. No excuses, this fellow should not be among us to serve and protect. His poor judgement in the use of his physical authority is evidence that he needs a new line of work. Exact same way that my dojo instructors cannot simply punch students in the head; they're trained and equipped to be an offensive threat, so they should have the most restraint.

 

[Piggy]

Police on bycicles accompanied every critical mass I joined. How about you actualy make sure you know what you are talking about before throwing the scarcasm around, ok?

Everyone agrees that stoping traffic for a funeral procession is ok? When was that survey done?

Hmmm... have you checked out the recent videos of CM in Atlanta? Cops had to be brought in to force the CM crowd to obey the traffic laws.

Unlike escorted funeral processions, they set out to intentionally break the law, and like spoiled brats got all sniffy and insulting when they weren't allowed to do it.

And unlike funeral processions, they were doing it to be deliberately disruptive and confrontational, and without the benefit of a longstanding tradition which concedes a fitting respect to those in mourning.

Do you know anyone who disagrees with yeilding to funerals? Have you ever seen a funeral procession run lights without a police escort to properly direct traffic, thereby endangering everyone else on the road?

I don't think so.

I certainly don't, and haven't.

On the other hand, I've seen the CM yahoos in Atlanta and Athens clog the streets and disrupt traffic for no other reason than to call attention to themselves, and in the process create ill will toward people like me who want to share the road rather than selfishly grandstand.

And that's what I'm talkin' 'bout, Willis.

 

[Uncayimmy]

A police officer who was videotaped knocking a man off his bicycle and onto the ground during a cycling event in Manhattan last summer has been fired, the Police Department said.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/20/nyregion/20cop.html?ref=nyregion

Though an AP correction says he resigned in lieu of being fired.

 

[davefoc]

I love those defense attorney statements. So sincere.

I had a couple of thoughts about this incident that occurred to me recently. I was riding my mountain bike along a park road and there were two people coming towards me.

I noticed that in an effort to pass by them with the widest possible separation I actually steered towards them for an instant which startled them I think and then I made a hard turn away from them in the opposite direction. In other words I set up a steep turn with a shallow turn in the opposite direction.

It seems likely that something like that may have happened here. The police officer noticed a slight turn towards him and then went into rage mode because of the apparent turn towards him by the bicyclist and then he couldn't or at least didn't control that rage after the bicyclist had made a clear cut turn away from him.

This incident reminded me of an incident from my college days. There had been riots on the UCLA campus over the Viet Nam war. I didn't take part but I saw one of the police officers that had been involved in controlling the crowds walking past the area where I was getting on my motorcycle. It is not my nature to look away when somebody looks at me and my returned stare was enough to set the guy off. He came at me with his club and attempted to jam it at my balls. I blocked the club with my books and they were knocked to the ground. He turned and left and I picked up my books, got on my motorcycle and left. The incident suggests what I guess is fairly obvious; Crowd control duty has the potential to put a police officer at high risk for inappropriately violent behavior.

So combining the two ideas (that the cop actually did sense that the bicyclist was attempting to commit an act of aggression against him and that the cop was potentially in a highly agitated state) the cop's actions may not have been that far out of the norm for human beings.

My sense of it even before I had these thoughts about the incident was that the cop should be cut some slack on the assault. But if it were up to me the guy would spend at least a few years in jail over the false police report. I doubt that he will and that will not be a good result for people of New York.

 

[Mojo]

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/02/20/nyregion/20cop.html?ref=nyregion

Though an AP correction says he resigned in lieu of being fired.

A police officer who was videotaped knocking a man off his bicycle and onto the ground during a cycling event in Manhattan last summer has been fired, the Police Department said.

...

The shoving incident, which gained widespread attention after it was videotaped and posted on YouTube, embarrassed the Police Department.The video has been viewed on YouTube nearly 2 million times.

The Metropolitan Police seem to be taking appropriate action:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/feb/24/police-public-surveillance

Last Friday I sat as a JP, judging an unemployed man accused of assaulting a policeman, mostly in view of a council street camera. He had earlier been refused legal aid and the Crown Prosecution Service had denied him advance access to the pictures. He only saw them when we did, during his trial.

He told us that a passerby had also filmed the incident on a mobile. He was right. We saw the photographer on the council tape. The defendant said police had demanded the person's mobile and deleted the pictures. When asked in court, the officer confirmed that this was the case, the reason being to stop police being on YouTube. From the casual way it was agreed in open court, it seems it is normal Met practice to seize mobiles in order to delete pictures involving them.

Our magistrates court was not the forum to question the principle, but should London police be destroying evidence that might help courts come to a proper decision?

 

[Whiplash]

It has to be a nightmare to be a police officer these days. I'm not going to defend the guy anymore, he was clearly wrong, and I was wrong in my early judgement. But still, it's just got to be a nightmare to be a cop of any kind. People constantly looking over your shoulder, judging every single thing you do.. taking videos and putting them online.

I still want to salute anyone who get's into this line of work, despite the animosity and hatred they will suffer from some. They are true heros.

 

[CriticalThanking]

Do you know anyone who disagrees with yeilding to funerals? Have you ever seen a funeral procession run lights without a police escort to properly direct traffic, thereby endangering everyone else on the road?

I actually have met 1 person who disagrees with the policy.

Motorcycle officers here sometimes supplement income by escorting funerals. Unfortunately, often only 2 or 3 officers are used for the entire procession. That means one is at the front, and the other(s) are responsible for covering every stoplight from the front to back of the procession. That is simply not possible in a procession of any length.

My college roommate was escorting such a procession. He and the other officers were sued when a driver approaching a green light failed notice the line of cars crossing his path (running the light). There was no officer at that intersection because they had sped ahead to cover the next intersection. I do not know how the suit ended.

CT

 

[Mojo]

But still, it's just got to be a nightmare to be a cop of any kind. People constantly looking over your shoulder, judging every single thing you do.. taking videos and putting them online.

Well, as our government are always telling us in connection with surveillance cameras, ID cards etc., if they've got nothing to hide...

 

[daredelvis]

I actually have met 1 person who disagrees with the policy.

Motorcycle officers here sometimes supplement income by escorting funerals. Unfortunately, often only 2 or 3 officers are used for the entire procession. That means one is at the front, and the other(s) are responsible for covering every stoplight from the front to back of the procession. That is simply not possible in a procession of any length.

My college roommate was escorting such a procession. He and the other officers were sued when a driver approaching a green light failed notice the line of cars crossing his path (running the light). There was no officer at that intersection because they had sped ahead to cover the next intersection. I do not know how the suit ended.

CT

Add me to that list. I live in Houston and come across funeral processions almost every weekend in the course of running errands. It seems a crazy practice to me. They stop traffic in the middle of a freeway here. I don't mind the inconvenience, it is that fact that someone else is going to get killed. Kind of a crappy legacy for the person getting planted that day.

I have already told my wife that if I kick it before here (very likely with my eating habits) that even thought I don't believe in an afterlife, I will haunt her for the rest of her days if she allows a procession to occur (of course it would only be her and two other people I owe money to).

My problem with critical mass is the same problem with earth first. Just because a proportion of critical mass riders are a-holes and all earth firsters are a-holes, doesn't mean they don't have a valid point, I just believe that their methods are counterproductive (and the a-hole factor).

Daredelvis

 

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

My problem with critical mass is the same problem with earth first. Just because a proportion of critical mass riders are a-holes and all earth firsters are a-holes, doesn't mean they don't have a valid point, I just believe that their methods are counterproductive (and the a-hole factor).

Daredelvis

Well put!

That's exactly what's wrong with PETA: humane treatment of animals is one thing and the insanity of PETA and the wackiness and stupidity of their methods is quite another.

Their founder singlehandedly proves that you can be an atheist and still be crazy.

 

[Lonewulf]

It has to be a nightmare to be a police officer these days. I'm not going to defend the guy anymore, he was clearly wrong, and I was wrong in my early judgement. But still, it's just got to be a nightmare to be a cop of any kind. People constantly looking over your shoulder, judging every single thing you do.. taking videos and putting them online.

I still want to salute anyone who get's into this line of work, despite the animosity and hatred they will suffer from some. They are true heros.

If he didn't go out of his way to push some cyclist down, I don't think anyone would have even known about the video.

 

[ponderingturtle]

If he didn't go out of his way to push some cyclist down, I don't think anyone would have even known about the video.

Well the fabricated police report matters too. But if he had not gone out of his way to tackle the guy it would not have been as clear that he lied in his report.

 

[Matthew Best]

The case has been moving forward and the trial is almost at an end. It sounds like it was quite entertaining.

The cyclist, Christopher Long, testified that he had a history of reckless driving, having struck and killed a pedestrian with his car in 2001. That year he was also discharged from the army after testing positive for marijuana. Within two weeks of that accident he was found driving 96 mph in a 65mph zone. When all this was put to him he replied: "It's no wonder I stopped driving cars". He also admitted he had a "nick-bag a day" marijuana habit. "That would be a five dollar bag -- that's why they call it a nick bag," he explained, helpfully.

When discussing his collision with Officer Pogan, he described it thus: "He managed to halt my inertia and change my vector."

The former police officer, on the other hand, testified that he acted in self-defence.

“After telling him to stop — he was in the middle lane, I was in the middle — we locked eyes,” Mr. Pogan said. “I see him going toward the sidewalk. He’s going there to go around me or he’s going there to stop.”

As he walked toward the sidewalk, Mr. Pogan continued, he saw Mr. Long, “rise up on his bike and I see the feet start moving a little faster.”

Mr. Long then dropped back onto his bicycle and lowered his right shoulder, Mr. Pogan said.

“At that point, I know he’s going to try and use that shoulder against me,” Mr. Pogan said. “He’s going to try and come through me using the force of the bicycle” or is going to try to scare him.

Mr. Pogan said he realized that a collision was inevitable. “He lowered his shoulder,” Mr. Pogan said. “I brace for impact. I lower my shoulder.” Upon impact, he said, “I used my arms to push him away from me.”

Mr. Pogan said he also thrust his arms forward to prevent the bicycle from hitting him.

“I understand it looks very extreme,” he said.

But, he added, the actions he took were “to protect myself from possible injury.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/24/nyregion/24pogan.html

And in contrast to Long's rather checkered past, Pogan is a former altar boy who saved the life of a man in cardiac arrest when he was an emergency medical technician.

The jury had started deliberating, but had to begin afresh after one juror called in sick and had to be replaced. It will be interesting to see how it turns out.

 

[davefoc]

Thanks for the update Matthew Best.

For me the charge that Pogan should go to jail on was the filing a false police report and now it appears that Pogan not only lied when he filed that police report he's lying on the stand about the incident.

Pogan absolutely lunged at the bicyclist while the bicyclist was trying to get around him. Now Pogan might feel justified in assaulting the bicyclist with an action that very well might have killed him because the bicyclist was a jerk and flipped Pogan off or for some other reason. And I would have seen some reason to cut him some slack on the assault charge particularly if that was the case. But now Pogan is adding more lying on top of the lying on the police report.

I really hope Pogan does some significant time. Law and order is the glue that holds a society together and the integrity of the police is an essential ingredient of that glue. This guy's a friggin liar and society needs to send the message to police departments that this kind of behavior will be punished severely when it is detected and it was certainly detected here.