Gawdzilla Sama
TImeToSweepTheLeg
Not all that handy on a PBR.
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Bad ideas in war
- Thread starter SpuriusMaximus
- Start date
Gawdzilla Sama
TImeToSweepTheLeg
PLUS the idea of teaching FOUR Ricky Recruits to load without killing each other just doesn't seem feasible to me.
Gawdzilla Sama
TImeToSweepTheLeg
You served, catsmate? Loved trying to tell the fresh caught "it's a bow, not a 'pointy end'."
SpuriusMaximus
Penultimate Amazing
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Bad ideas in war: Being a hero.
Early in my military stint, barely out of basic training, the whole company got packed into a lecture room to have a commissioned officer tell us just that: don't be a hero. Heroes die. You hear or read a wartime story about some guy who suddenly stood up and started chucking grenades and shooting wildly from the hip and stuff until he was machinegunned down by the enemy. WOW, WHAT A HERO! They pinned shiny medals on his coffin. No, that's a poor guy who just had a mental breakdown under extreme stress, not a hero.
Don't be like him. Just keep your cool, remember your training, and work together with your squad.
Partially my own take: War is not heroic. It's not glorious. It's brutal, and designed to put you under enough stress to break you. And somewhere out there might be a bullet with your name on it. Or even worse, one addressed "to whomever it may concern." The latter is usually the one that gets you. There are no heroes on either side. There are only some who live to fight another day.
Early in my military stint, barely out of basic training, the whole company got packed into a lecture room to have a commissioned officer tell us just that: don't be a hero. Heroes die. You hear or read a wartime story about some guy who suddenly stood up and started chucking grenades and shooting wildly from the hip and stuff until he was machinegunned down by the enemy. WOW, WHAT A HERO! They pinned shiny medals on his coffin. No, that's a poor guy who just had a mental breakdown under extreme stress, not a hero.
Don't be like him. Just keep your cool, remember your training, and work together with your squad.
Partially my own take: War is not heroic. It's not glorious. It's brutal, and designed to put you under enough stress to break you. And somewhere out there might be a bullet with your name on it. Or even worse, one addressed "to whomever it may concern." The latter is usually the one that gets you. There are no heroes on either side. There are only some who live to fight another day.
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Andy_Ross
Penultimate Amazing
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Sometimes it just happens.
Stanley Elton Hollis VC. Green Howards.
Landlord of the Holywell View pub my Grandad used.
Evacuated from Dunkirk. Fought from El Alamein to Tunis as part of the British Eighth Army in North African.
He was made company sergeant major shortly before the invasion of Sicily in 1943, where he was wounded at the battle of Primosole Bridge.
Landed on Gold Beach on D-Day where he won gis VC
From his Award citation.
In Normandy on 6th June, 1944, during the assault on the beaches and the Mont Fleury Battery, C.S.M. Hollis's Company Commander noticed that two of the pill-boxes had been by-passed, and went with C.S.M. Hollis to see that they were clear. When they were 20 yards from the pillbox, a machine-gun opened fire from the slit and C.S.M. Hollis instantly rushed straight at the pillbox, firing his Sten gun. He jumped on top of the pillbox, re-charged his magazine, threw a grenade in through the door and fired his Sten gun into it, killing two Germans and taking the remainder prisoner. He then cleared several Germans from a neighbouring trench. By his action, he undoubtedly saved his Company from being fired on heavily from the rear and enabled them to open the main beach exit.
Later the same day, in the village of Crepon, the Company encountered a field gun and crew armed with machine guns, at 100 yards range. C.S.M. Hollis was put in command of a party to cover an attack on the gun, but the movement was held up. Seeing this, C.S.M. Hollis pushed right forward to engage the gun with a P.I.A.T. from a house at 50 yards range. He was observed by a sniper who fired and grazed his right cheek, and at the same moment the gun swung round and fired into the house. To avoid the fallen masonry C.S.M. Hollis moved his party to an alternative position. Two of the enemy gun crew had by this time been killed and the gun was destroyed shortly afterwards. He later found that two of his men had stayed behind in the house and immediately volunteered to get them out. In full view of the enemy who were continually firing at him, he went forward alone using a Bren gun fired from the hip to distract their attention from the other men. Under cover of his diversion, the two men were able to get back.
Wherever fighting was heaviest, C.S.M. Hollis appeared and in the course of a magnificent day's work, he displayed the utmost gallantry and on two separate occasions his courage and initiative prevented the enemy from holding up the advance at critical stages. It was largely through his heroism and resource that the Company's objectives were gained and casualties were not heavier, and by his own bravery he saved the lives of many of his men.
His memorial in Middlesbrough
Stanley Elton Hollis VC. Green Howards.
Landlord of the Holywell View pub my Grandad used.
Evacuated from Dunkirk. Fought from El Alamein to Tunis as part of the British Eighth Army in North African.
He was made company sergeant major shortly before the invasion of Sicily in 1943, where he was wounded at the battle of Primosole Bridge.
Landed on Gold Beach on D-Day where he won gis VC
From his Award citation.
In Normandy on 6th June, 1944, during the assault on the beaches and the Mont Fleury Battery, C.S.M. Hollis's Company Commander noticed that two of the pill-boxes had been by-passed, and went with C.S.M. Hollis to see that they were clear. When they were 20 yards from the pillbox, a machine-gun opened fire from the slit and C.S.M. Hollis instantly rushed straight at the pillbox, firing his Sten gun. He jumped on top of the pillbox, re-charged his magazine, threw a grenade in through the door and fired his Sten gun into it, killing two Germans and taking the remainder prisoner. He then cleared several Germans from a neighbouring trench. By his action, he undoubtedly saved his Company from being fired on heavily from the rear and enabled them to open the main beach exit.
Later the same day, in the village of Crepon, the Company encountered a field gun and crew armed with machine guns, at 100 yards range. C.S.M. Hollis was put in command of a party to cover an attack on the gun, but the movement was held up. Seeing this, C.S.M. Hollis pushed right forward to engage the gun with a P.I.A.T. from a house at 50 yards range. He was observed by a sniper who fired and grazed his right cheek, and at the same moment the gun swung round and fired into the house. To avoid the fallen masonry C.S.M. Hollis moved his party to an alternative position. Two of the enemy gun crew had by this time been killed and the gun was destroyed shortly afterwards. He later found that two of his men had stayed behind in the house and immediately volunteered to get them out. In full view of the enemy who were continually firing at him, he went forward alone using a Bren gun fired from the hip to distract their attention from the other men. Under cover of his diversion, the two men were able to get back.
Wherever fighting was heaviest, C.S.M. Hollis appeared and in the course of a magnificent day's work, he displayed the utmost gallantry and on two separate occasions his courage and initiative prevented the enemy from holding up the advance at critical stages. It was largely through his heroism and resource that the Company's objectives were gained and casualties were not heavier, and by his own bravery he saved the lives of many of his men.
His memorial in Middlesbrough
SpuriusMaximus
Penultimate Amazing
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If it just happens, because you're just that good or brave, it just happens. Obviously some people occasionally do extraordinary things in war. The message was more like: don't TRY to be a hero. Don't try to emulate those guys. That'll get you killed and get your squad one man short. But obviously sometimes you have to do what you have to do, because, as Sherlock Holmes would say, that's the only thing left. Sorry for not being clearer.
But still, at the end of the day, that's one poor fellow who made it far enough. Don't TRY to be like him. Just trust your training and do whatever it takes.
But still, at the end of the day, that's one poor fellow who made it far enough. Don't TRY to be like him. Just trust your training and do whatever it takes.
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Shouldn't it be "don't try to be a hero unless ordered too?". History is full of situations where some soldiers are sacrificed to save the other soldiers. That they didn't desert or surrender, but stay and fight until killed is true heroism, but rarely awarded with a medal.
Gulliver Foyle
Philosopher
Meh, they're a renewable resource.
SpuriusMaximus
Penultimate Amazing
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Well, then you gotta do what you gotta do.
I didn't think it was that controversial a thing to say, tbh. In the end it's just a more verbose version of Patton's, "No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his."
Andy_Ross
Penultimate Amazing
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155 Battery at Sidi Nsir 1943
catsmate
No longer the 1
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???
No. I did sell guns at one time.
Gawdzilla Sama
TImeToSweepTheLeg
I ask rather than assume. Cheers.