So I listen to the Podxast of Penn's late radio show. Jamy Ian Swiss was on talking about his mentalist show. He tells everyone its fake. He performs an effect and tells everyone that its fake and finishes the show by telling everyone that its fake. Yet people will still insist everything they saw is real.
That is what is happening here. If you want to believe its a conspiracy, you will forgive the mistakes and accept the hits. Whatever questions seem legit will be.
So I listen to the Podxast of Penn's late radio show. Jamy Ian Swiss was on talking about his mentalist show. He tells everyone its fake. He performs an effect and tells everyone that its fake and finishes the show by telling everyone that its fake. Yet people will still insist everything they saw is real.
That is what is happening here. If you want to believe its a conspiracy, you will forgive the mistakes and accept the hits. Whatever questions seem legit will be.
Hard to imagine even Avery could develop the belief, categorically, and unequivocally, in a conspiracy after allegedly doing some 'investigative' work on the internets.
Hundreds of people do believe in this conspiracy even after doing their own "investigation" on the Internet. Why assume that Avery is any smarter than they are?
Hundreds of people do believe in this conspiracy even after doing their own "investigation" on the Internet. Why assume that Avery is any smarter than they are?
Ya, that's what I don't get with this thread. go over to the LC forums and see a few hundred people that believe this stuff. Go out to the wider internet and find more. Find websites by people who make towers out of chicken wire and drop buckets on them. Some people just can't reason very well. All evidence points to Avery being one of them.
I know I'm being irrational when I say this, but I still harbour a little hope that Dylan and his buddies have been spending the last six months or so making a very different doco to the one the Truthers expect.
I like to think they have been making the definitive exposé of CTs. It would be disappointing to the Truthers, but would likely have a much broader appeal if the Final Cut was actually about a group of guys who took the conspiracy loons for a ride.
Not realistic I know, but it is a doco I would watch as opposed to the rehashing of tired conspiracy clichés LC:FC is most likely to be.
Dylan Avery is clearly a highly intelligent and manipulative young man. He understood quite well that he could convince most of the existing conspiracy theorists and many cynical americans that the official story was not true. He is profiting and living off the fears and paranoia of the American people and if I had my way, what he has done would be criminal.
My ultimate question is, does he really believe that 9-11 was an inside job or is his "fictional becomes reality" work...actually still fiction? Is Dylan Avery really just the ultimate con artist?
Dylan Avery is clearly a highly intelligent and manipulative young man. He understood quite well that he could convince most of the existing conspiracy theorists and many cynical americans that the official story was not true. He is profiting and living off the fears and paranoia of the American people and if I had my way, what he has done would be criminal.
My ultimate question is, does he really believe that 9-11 was an inside job or is his "fictional becomes reality" work...actually still fiction? Is Dylan Avery really just the ultimate con artist?
Dylan Avery has wedded himself to Loose Change. That much is a done deal.
How he handles it and what he does in the future is totally in his hands. He can stick to his "asking questions" mode, or he can admit to the problems with the "truth movement" and report on that instead. I think that decision is critical to his future.
If he chooses the former, he'll likely ruin any thought of a sucessful career. If he chooses the later, he might actually be able to produce a product folks will be interested in reading/watching.
Only time will tell. I hope he starts getting some good advice from someone sensible that he can trust to tell him the "truth".
I think he should come clean now, before this goes any further. He is young, he has time to recover from this, he will proably be forgiven because of his youth, maybe even turn his 'fame' into some kind of career. If he pushes this to the bitter end this opportunity to back out will be gone. You hear me Dylan, do it now boy, come back into the light.
Who gives a rat's syphlitic behind what Dylan Avery thinks? Certainly not anyone with an IQ over 90.
Stop giving him attention. Attracting attention has been his aim since the inception of LC.
Knock it off. All of you. Stop feeding these idiots that which they crave: attention from their betters. You are an embarassment to people with functioning minds. In the name of Captain Burlingame, I ask you all to think before you post. Gravy did a service to expose these ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ for what they are. Stop giving them what they want, it is an offense to the dead people who Gravy had in mind when he began his crusade against the Troofer arseholes.
The collective arse has been kicked, it is time to give them what they deserve: scorn, not attention.
Who gives a rat's syphlitic behind what Dylan Avery thinks? Certainly not anyone with an IQ over 90.
Stop giving him attention. Attracting attention has been his aim since the inception of LC.
Knock it off. All of you. Stop feeding these idiots that which they crave: attention from their betters. You are an embarassment to people with functioning minds. In the name of Captain Burlingame, I ask you all to think before you post. Gravy did a service to expose these ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ for what they are. Stop giving them what they want, it is an offense to the dead people who Gravy had in mind when he began his crusade against the Troofer arseholes.
The collective arse has been kicked, it is time to give them what they deserve: scorn, not attention.
Who gives a rat's syphlitic behind what Dylan Avery thinks? Certainly not anyone with an IQ over 90.
Stop giving him attention. Attracting attention has been his aim since the inception of LC.
Knock it off. All of you Stop feeding these idiots that which they crave: attention from their betters. You are an embarassment to people with functioning minds.
Sorry if you find me embarassing, but I get a laugh out of these guys. Given the grim reality of the world today, I don't feel any shame in deriving a few laughs from the likes of Dylan Avery. I'll admit it isn't particularly noble of me, but I never claimed to be a saint.
As far as the story about starting as a fictional film before deciding on a "documentary" goes, here's some speculation:
Making a drama costs money and takes talent. You have to write a decent script for a start. Then you need to find actors and have half a clue how to direct them. You need to scout locations and get you production design sorted out. You'll need costume and makeup. You need to negotiate with the locations for permission to film. You need to do a live action shoot and hire the equipment needed (camera, lights, sound) and people who know how to use it (a camera man who understands how to frame a shot, at least). If you're the director, you need to understand the grammar of film and the type of shots you are trying to get on each shoot - really you should be storyboarding this. If you need action (quite likely in a conspiracy thriller) you'll need fight arrangers, stunt men, possibly pyrotechnics and special effects. Once you've wrapped, you need to edit the footage and it'll probably sound like crap so you'll need to re-record a lot of the dialogue in post-production - as well possibly creating the whole soundscape (ambient sounds and sound effects) from scratch. You'll also need a soundtrack at this point. If you haven't been to film school, the chances are that you won't know anybody with expertise in any of these areas, and you'll be learning as you go along.
Now it's possible to skimp on a lot of the things I've just mentioned (if you're really clever, you might be able to pull it off in Dogme style) but you run the risk of you movie looking like amateurish crap.
Alternatively, you can make a collage of other people's footage, add some graphics and some hip-hop music and put your narration over the top. At this point, you have to call it a documentary, but it's much easier to make.
It's possible, then, that Dylan just took the easy way out.
Given all that, though, I'm not sure that Loose Change, even if it were successful, would inspire anybody to let Dylan loose on a dramatic film.
Also, this has no relevance to the validity of the arguments in Loose Change, but Dylan has posted a couple of his other works. They're both music videos and I think they show Dylan to be a pretty poor director (and worse actor) with questionable tastes in music and friends. The first one, in particular, shows very little concern with causing offence and quite a lot of immaturity. I think they support the idea that Dylan isn't especially bothered about causing offence and has a different idea of taste to the rest of us. It is hardly suprising, therefore, that he would have considered 9/11 a suitable subject for a conspiracy thriller.
First up, a recent music video for a song about being a peeping tom - in extremely poor taste (and not funny, even though its meant to be), so be warned.
Google Video This video is not hosted by the ISF, the ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
Secondly, a music video from 2004. Not so obviously in bad taste, but it's still a song about being poor from somebody who has clearly no idea what poverty is (and I don't think there are many ghettos in upstate New York).
Google Video This video is not hosted by the ISF, the ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
I know I'm being irrational when I say this, but I still harbour a little hope that Dylan and his buddies have been spending the last six months or so making a very different doco to the one the Truthers expect.
I like to think they have been making the definitive exposé of CTs. It would be disappointing to the Truthers, but would likely have a much broader appeal if the Final Cut was actually about a group of guys who took the conspiracy loons for a ride.
Not realistic I know, but it is a doco I would watch as opposed to the rehashing of tired conspiracy clichés LC:FC is most likely to be.
Heh I was thinking the same thing. It would explain why LC:FC is taking so long. He keeps getting all of these great new bits from the LCF crew. Get few actors to to put faces with the net nicks and put on "Vagina Monolouges" type setting and BOOM!... You know if he's not doing it I might.
It looks to me that Dodo Avery started LC as a means to take the truthers for a ride and I suspect that this is a fairly large part of the split with Phil Jayhan. It seems Dodo got mixed up with BermASS and has been semi sucked into the woowoo trap. Personally, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if BermASS returns from the CA trip without Dodo. Either that or BermASS is going to be uncerimoniously thrown out of LTW and LC:FC will be extremely watered down. I really think if Dodo were to walk away, his 15 minutes of fame would last all of about 3 minutes. He nailed his own coffin (figuratively, now watch LCF claim I threatened to kill Dodo).
Secondly, a music video from 2004. Not so obviously in bad taste, but it's still a song about being poor from somebody who has clearly no idea what poverty is (and I don't think there are many ghettos in upstate New York).
Google Video This video is not hosted by the ISF, the ISF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.
It looks to me that Dodo Avery started LC as a means to take the truthers for a ride and I suspect that this is a fairly large part of the split with Phil Jayhan. It seems Dodo got mixed up with BermASS and has been semi sucked into the woowoo trap. Personally, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if BermASS returns from the CA trip without Dodo. Either that or BermASS is going to be uncerimoniously thrown out of LTW and LC:FC will be extremely watered down. I really think if Dodo were to walk away, his 15 minutes of fame would last all of about 3 minutes. He nailed his own coffin (figuratively, now watch LCF claim I threatened to kill Dodo).
I think Dylan's passed the two-minute warning on his 15 minutes of fame and has no time-outs left. LC:TUC (The Unkindest Cut) is his last shot at what passes for glory and fame in Oneonta (and BTW, I doubt he's made that much money, but better than he'd do at the local burger shack).
He's just milking it now, hanging on to his position in the movement by his fingernails. Once the Final Cut is released, he's done, and he knows it.
As far as the story about starting as a fictional film before deciding on a "documentary" goes, here's some speculation:
[maccy's speculation] [/maccy's speculation]
It's possible, then, that Dylan just took the easy way out.
Given all that, though, I'm not sure that Loose Change, even if it were successful, would inspire anybody to let Dylan loose on a dramatic film.
Also, this has no relevance to the validity of the arguments in Loose Change, but Dylan has posted a couple of his other works. They're both music videos and I think they show Dylan to be a pretty poor director (and worse actor) with questionable tastes in music and friends.
Personally I think the first set of musicians were trying to do something a bit like Tenacious D's F*** her gently. Of course, they didn't quite hit it, and more importantly Dylan appears to have totally missed the ironic nature of the song. (Unless I'm mistaken about the musicians, in which case I agree with your remarks regarding his selection of friends and musical tastes).
Yes, he's a really bad director. And he can't blame his tools. I made this music video for NZ$500 (US$250-ish) and shot it in one night (unfortunately You Tube put the music out of synch!):
As far as Dylan's work; editing, composition, it's all bad. Ugh. Really bad.
I hate to steal other people's ideas, but I think David Wong got it 100% spot on in his article about Loose Change. Dylan Avery doesn't want to direct films. He wants to be a movie director. There's a difference. He's only interested in the perceived fame and importance of that "title" or "role". He's not interested in the work itself. People like that:
A) Never ever make it.
B) Usually will do just about anything in their increasingly desperate efforts to try make it.
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