Atheism Plus/Free Thought Blogs (FTB)

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qwints said:
Could you define the term "intellectual tool?"
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Maybe you missed some posts.

ApostateltsopA coined the term in this thread, and despite my requests, never defined nor defended it. You're asking the wrong guy.

I can't think of a reasonable definition which would include the emotion tool. He said, "emotion is an intellectual tool," which is oxymoronic to me.

I'm digging deep in my intellectual toolbox. Here's evaluating evidence, decoding logic, recognizing logical fallacies, references to precedence, following chains of evidence ... nope, no emotion tool.

All I can imagine is the old "trust your feelings," but that tool sucks. I don't doubt that Elevator Man felt he had a chance with RW.
 
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Foolmewunz said:
http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4149

From the safe harbor. . They're onto us! :D


Oh, and wanna bet the secret forum is a-buzz with "keep an eye on that newb - not sure if she caught the cooties at the jref".
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Holy corn-battered frankenfurter on a stick! The amount of self-congratulatory butt-hurt mental-mutual-masturbation demonstrated by that thread rivals anything I've ever seen posted on any Gothic-oriented forum for the nearly twenty years I've been moping around oh them. And I think I just used up my daily quotas of dashes.
 
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rustypouch said:
We'll never know...

So how about bets on how long before he/she/xe/je/yge/bwe/whatever is banned? Over/under from my gut is five weeks.
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I'm curious about the drama of the OP. I mean we all know Jontg very well from her many posts here on social justice, women's rights and the misogyny on these boards. Oh, wait... no we don't. She was vocally anti-Israel, but with her paucity of posts I can't recall her smacking down any MRA posters or that other self-exiled member to remain nameless who bordered on promoting sex with minors (all in the interest of Just Asking Questions, of course) who started a number of misogynist-oriented threads.

So one of you guys offended her. Personally, I'm sure it was Scrut. :D But with the rampant misogyny that we're so famous for (evidently), it could've been any of the privileged stooges here, so I think we all need to ban ourselves.

I love the "self-exiled". They're members in good standing here but can't stand it here.

ETA: What's with "trust fund baby"? I see that a lot. Are these people actually saying that they're like from the Vanderbilts and summer in Saratoga... that kind of trust-fund scion of wealthy parents? Or is this now a euphemism for anyone who's parents may have put away forty bucks a week to fund their education? I've got a neighbor whose daddy was a rice farmer and had that kind of "advantage". It's very common in SE Asia. You put 300 baht a month into a fund, and it slowly builds over fifteen years. It's also a quite common financial instrument in the US. I remember typists and keypunch operators and warehouse laborers putting money away like that. It's sort of what you do if you're a "mommie" or "daddy" (are those terms allowed in The New Lexicon of Care?).

luchog said:
Holy corn-battered frankenfurter on a stick! The amount of self-congratulatory butt-hurt mental-mutual-masturbation demonstrated by that thread rivals anything I've ever seen posted on any Gothic-oriented forum for the nearly twenty years I've been moping around oh them. And I think I just used up my daily quotas of dashes.
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Well, I've got so many spoons (you try running a barista coffee shop without at least six dozen of them), so I can loan you some of my dashes, because you left off "self-congratulatory-safeharbor-hiding-chicken-****".

Sure, they send out one of their more civil stalking horses in AA, who's probably not even a member of the Illumi-Notty and is trying to make his bones,... and I give qwints credit for trying to be a voice of reason over there sometimes, but is that any different than The Spook Who Sat by the Door? I'd love to see the fearless and fearsome Cipher (who brags about being a badass) and Sub-mor and Ceepolk and Setar outside of their little cocoon.
 
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@foolz: They would never venture outside their gated little enclave. But it is really on the decline, and now they rarely even get to 10 users logged on.

Just realized reading the rest of this post it is OT and directed only at luchog. Apologies.

luchog said:
Yes, I do have some Ashkenazi heritage, though it's on my father's side, so I'm not Halachically Jewish. :) [snip]
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One of my closest friends is the same. It's the genes I envy, not the dogma, and they seem to shine through even when diluted. His son is only 1/4 Ashkenazim but got a full academic scholarship to Harvard. Yeah, I know how this sounds, so I'll drop it conceding none of my Jewish friends buy my theory even while acknowledging my uncanny ability to identify members of this mind bending tribe by their writing alone. Sorry for the derail.

However, I was raised a Christian, originally Pentecostal, but eventually non-denominational, and still consider myself one (the admission of which probably cost me any more TLA nominations ;) ).
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Say it ain't so...Jo. Could you please post a link if possible to any thread where you expatiate on your faith? As I think I have mentioned earlier I have never really fathomed how a skeptic could embrace any form of theism. :jaw-dropp
 
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ceepolk said:
yeah, seriously what psychological process is in action there? some variant on Jante/Tall Poppy?
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It's called critical thinking ceepolk. You do it in first year, first semester philosophy.
 
Stout said:
Interesting, and still to this day in a Muslim country.

I used to travel to Thailand frequently ( until, in 2010 they upped their SCUBA prices, couple that with increased accommodation prices and I can get a way better deal in the Caribbean ) where there's a significant "ladyboy" culture. Out of the hundreds of fellow tourists I talked to about this, as the topic always came up, not one appeared to have a problem with the idea.

Dunno if they kept that attitude when they went back home but outside of the few casual jokes made at the expense of single guys, nobody appeared adverse to the scene. Maybe it was novelty, maybe it's because most other travelers I talked to were European where, I hear, they're a little more open to this sort of thing than we are in the colonies.
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Interestingly Iran has quite enlightened policies towards gender reassignment. Due (IIRC) to a personal request to one of the Ayatollahs, which then became writ.
 
Rrose Selavy said:
Yes. HEARD - ie in real life or even on the TV/radio . That remains my experience.
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And if this thread has taught us anything, it's that personal experience is king.

As for finding Uk based examples on the Internet, it's not my fault your examples were so unconvincing. They don't confirm that is "not uncommon" in every day speech either.
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I didn't say they did.

Anyway, I've had enough of this. It's gone beyond tedious. This is my last post on the subject.
 
ApostateltsopA said:
We are speaking about personal responses to posts. Fact is so heavily colored by emotion in this place that I am amazed you can't see it. Frog in slowly boiled water I suppose. More importantly why are you rejecting emotional bandwidth in this, or any, conversation? That looks to me like a rejection of emotion as a valuable intellectual tool. I will freely admit too much emotion is likely to shut down cognitive processes but I'm not a vulcan and won't pretend to be one.
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I took the trouble to locate the origin of the "emotion=intellectual tool" in this thread.

I'm inferring the following chain of logic from supporters of this idea:

1) Women are more emotional than men.
2) Women are better than men.
3) Intellect is good.

...therefore, emotion must be a valuable intellectual tool, and to suggest otherwise is sexist.

*Note that this train of logic upholds a common gender stereotype by casting emotionalism as a positive attribute.

My personal beliefs:

#1 is an objectionable stereotype, and I don't know if nature or nurture may responsible for there being any kernel of truth to it.

#2 is a common view (which I abhor) often expressed by radical feminists.

#3 is holy, since I believe anti-intellectualism (e.g elevating emotion to valuable intellectual tool status) causes tremendous suffering and has the potential to exterminate the human race.
 
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luchog said:
I'm not sure where you got that I said otherwise. I don't even know that many trans-folk who get all that haired out about pronoun trouble. A few of the more radical SJWs perhaps. For most, it's only a problem if people insist on using the wrong pronoun after being politely corrected.
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And this is fair and charitable. Failing to give somebody that chance, why that's almost as though you're using your minority status as a club to bash people over the head with.... ooooh right. :D

Foolmewunz said:
http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=4149

From the safe harbor. . They're onto us! :D


Oh, and wanna bet the secret forum is a-buzz with "keep an eye on that newb - not sure if she caught the cooties at the jref".
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In Scientology terms the JREF would be SP or Suppressive Persons while this new poster would be a PTS or Potential Trouble Source, unless they can persuade themselves that sqvreeee is no longer in any contact with us.

If you can easily address your organisation in Scientology terms it's time to take a long hard look at yourselves.
 
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Oh, I just thought of another possible interpretation of "emotion as a valuable intellectual tool."

1) I'm not very intelligent (or uneducated) and/or very emotional.
2) I'm a good person.

...therefore, emotions are a virtue, comparable or superior to intellect.

It's variation on the Dunning-Kruger effectWP.
 
Mr. Scott said:
Oh, I just thought of another possible interpretation of "emotion as a valuable intellectual tool."

1) I'm not very intelligent (or uneducated) and/or very emotional.
2) I'm a good person.

...therefore, emotions are a virtue, comparable or superior to intellect.

It's variation on the Dunning-Kruger effectWP.
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You are trying to make logical sense of each individual claim when there is none. The observed phenomenon only makes sense from a behaviour perspective.

Person 1: I am upset because I am an attention whore but I have done nothing in my life that makes me stand out. No matter what I do someone does it better/faster/cooler/etc. and they always over shadow me. I need something that sets me apart . . . hmmmmmmmm.

I know! I will claim to be special because of some unheard of condition regarding my physical/emotional/mental makeup that is completely non falsifiable and I'll prey on people's sympathy for attention.

Person 2: I see what you did there! I'll support you and try it too. I have you condition plus another one.

Person 3: Hey, worked for those losers, it'll probably work for me too! I have those two conditions plus several more!

Person 3 was the tipping point. After them, A+ came into existence allowing all the losers to jump on the band wagon.
 
mistermac: target d'jure for the A+ dogpilers?

I'm surprised it's taken this long, but knew they would start going after their own eventually. http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=73006#p73006

Meanwhile the post count and general activity is way down, and getting lower. Time to start working on the requiem for the A+ forum. I doubt if it'll still be there in another 6 months. Hope I'm wrong though. We may not find another lolcow this amusing for years to come. :(
 
Mr. Scott said:
Maybe you missed some posts.

ApostateltsopA coined the term in this thread, and despite my requests, never defined nor defended it. You're asking the wrong guy.

I can't think of a reasonable definition which would include the emotion tool. He said, "emotion is an intellectual tool," which is oxymoronic to me.
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Fair enough. I can't speak for apostolate, and I would disagree with anyone advancing the possible justifications you've suggested as strongly as you would. Here's what I believe:

1) Emotion exists - we clearly agree here
2) Emotion matters
3) Emotions are valid
4) Emotion influences our thinking
5) Emotion ought to play a role in determining our values

I would, however, agree that emotions are irrelevant to the truth or falsity of some sorts of propositions. Despite this, and because of the other beliefs I've listed, I would say that emotion can be useful for some types of reasoning.
 
qwints said:
Fair enough. I can't speak for apostolate, and I would disagree with anyone advancing the possible justifications you've suggested as strongly as you would. Here's what I believe:

1) Emotion exists - we clearly agree here
2) Emotion matters
3) Emotions are valid
4) Emotion influences our thinking
5) Emotion ought to play a role in determining our values

I would, however, agree that emotions are irrelevant to the truth or falsity of some sorts of propositions. Despite this, and because of the other beliefs I've listed, I would say that emotion can be useful for some types of reasoning.
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When people claim to oppose rights for homosexuals because the idea of male homosexual acts disgusts them, what role should that play in determining our values?

Respectfully,
Myriad
 
recursive prophet said:
I'm surprised it's taken this long, but knew they would start going after their own eventually. http://atheismplus.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=73006#p73006

Meanwhile the post count and general activity is way down, and getting lower. Time to start working on the requiem for the A+ forum. I doubt if it'll still be there in another 6 months. Hope I'm wrong though. We may not find another lolcow this amusing for years to come. :(
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Yeah, there's a lot to be said about nuances of behavior. Over here, someone who used a loaded phrase might be pegged as an "anti". Over there, it becomes "official" and gets a warning.

As to their numbers,... they're at an all-time low on their rolling seven day average. Up to midnight UT the most recent seven days are averaging less than four posts per hour. At their busiest, they were getting about twenty-five per hour, so it was never that high a volume, anyway. But cutting that down to a post every fifteen minutes across an entire forum? That's pretty low.

But I've noted that their highest activity is when they have a good beat-down going on, so I expect that now that the Junior Birdmen have arrived, the Mistermack tempest in a teapot will ratchet their count up for the next day or so.
 
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