Arrested at Mitt Romney Campaign's Request

[Beth]

This is a really interesting story about a the arrest of a Harvard student at a Mitt Romney Campaign event in New Hampshire earlier this week. I'm curious about the opinions of the JREF on this incident.

http://www.thewheatandchaff.com/letter-to-romney/

 

[WildCat]

It's about time someone arrested that menace Justin Bieber.

 

[Madalch]

Well, they asked him to leave private property and he refused, so he's technically guilty of trespassing.

 

[crimresearch]

All I see is a letter from the person claiming they were arrested. And what they are saying seems at odds with the Mass criminal code, so where is the story?

 

[crimresearch]

Well, they asked him to leave private property and he refused, so he's technically guilty of trespassing.

The letter doesn't say anything vaguely resembling that.

It says he was removed and then arrested on 3rd hand claims about a misdemeanor that allegedly occured some other place and time, and not witnessed by the police.

 

[Tricky]

Well, they asked him to leave private property and he refused, so he's technically guilty of trespassing.

If other people were there and they were behaving no differently than him, then that's pretty questionable. Unless the rally was by invitation only, it doesn't seem legal (to me) to arrest specific people without explaining to them what they've done. You could use this to make racial discrimination or any other kind of prejudicial discrimination.

So if what the blogger says is true (and I have no confirmation by outside sources) then it is, at the very least, a very black eye for Romney if it gets widespread attention.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

All I see is a letter from the person claiming they were arrested. And what they are saying seems at odds with the Mass criminal code, so where is the story?

There was a link in the intro to the letter:

http://www.thewheatandchaff.com/mitt-romney-arrest/

To me the biggest problem (assuming the facts are as related) is having on-duty municipal police officers working as private security for a political candidate.

ETA: That is, if they have the authority of police, they can't then act on the bidding of a private employer. (And arresting the guy is a police power. But if they're arresting him because the Romney campaign wanted him removed, that's a problem.)

 

[crimresearch]

There was a link in the intro to the letter:

http://www.thewheatandchaff.com/mitt-romney-arrest/

To me the biggest problem (assuming the facts are as related) is having on-duty municipal police officers working as private security for a political candidate.

ETA: That is, if they have the authority of police, they can't then act on the bidding of a private employer. (And arresting the guy is a police power. But if they're arresting him because the Romney campaign wanted him removed, that's a problem.)

That link seems to be to another recitation by Matt Beiber. Is there a link to the news cameras, or arrest reports, or even a YouTube video etc?

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

That link seems to be to another recitation by Matt Beiber. Is there a link to the news cameras, or arrest reports, or even a YouTube video etc?

Here's one news story which seems to only give his side of the story as well--though the Romney campaign is certainly free to give their side.

ETA:

Romney spokesman Ryan Williams declined to comment Friday. Hudson Police and Gilchrist Metal Fabricating – the company that hosted Monday’s event – did not return messages seeking comment.

http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/news/946520-196/man-was-arrested-removed-from-romney-event.html

BTW, it was in NH not MA.

ETA: Curiously, the police officers don't seem to be defending themselves against the claim that they acted at the behest of the Romney campaign ("the staff"):

Hudson Police Officer Roger Lamarche was on duty at the Romney event with one other Hudson officer, Kevin Ducie, Bieber said. They were hired by the Romney campaign for security detail and wore their town police uniforms.

Lamarche told BuzzFeed.com that Bieber “hadn’t done anything,” according to a story published by that Web site Thursday. Lamarche added that it was “The staff’s word against his,” when asked why Bieber was arrested.

So with no evidence of any wrongdoing, they relied on the [Romney campaign] staff's word to arrest him.

 

[crimresearch]

Here's one news story which seems to only give his side of the story as well--though the Romney campaign is certainly free to give their side.

ETA:

http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/news/946520-196/man-was-arrested-removed-from-romney-event.html

BTW, it was in NH not MA.

ETA: Curiously, the police officers don't seem to be defending themselves against the claim that they acted at the behest of the Romney campaign ("the staff"):
So with no evidence of any wrongdoing, they relied on the [Romney campaign] staff's word to arrest him.

Thanks, I did try to find a news story.

That's the weird part, in many jurisdictions, a police officer (even moonlighting) is supposed to witness a misdemeanor to make an arrest.
Video evidence, or a report from another police officer may substitute, but just on 'someone's' days old unsworn say-so seems like begging for a false arrest lawsuit.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

That's the weird part, in many jurisdictions, a police officer (even moonlighting) is supposed to witness a misdemeanor to make an arrest.
Video evidence, or a report from another police officer may substitute, but just on 'someone's' days old unsworn say-so seems like begging for a false arrest lawsuit.

I find it problematic, and at least in the need of some answer.

The best argument I can see for their behavior is this: As on-duty police officers working on a private security contract, they have two separate areas of authority. As private security, they can ask someone to leave at the request of their client. As police officers, they can arrest someone for causing a ruckus (or any number of other things). They could claim that while they were acting as private security officers, they asked the guy to leave. When he refused, they were then police officers who were arresting the guy for trespass (just being there against the will of the people in charge of the property).

I think it's pretty weak. And again, it highlights the broader problem of on-duty cops working as private security.

 

[Beth]

I think it's pretty weak. And again, it highlights the broader problem of on-duty cops working as private security.

I agree. My understanding is that these days, in many places, if you're going to have a large public event, you have to pay for the additional police required to keep problems from happening and make sure that it doesn't turn into a riot. It's a small step from there to well-funded organizations, like the Romney campaign, contracting and paying for a bit more than the minimal police service required.

 

[AlBell]

Has anyone yet seen updates to this story?

 

[eeyore1954]

I don't know it seems he was asked to leave a few times and did not . Then he was arrested. Read his account ( and his Who I am) and tell me that you don't at least think possibly he was looking for some kind of a story.

 

[JoeTheJuggler]

I don't know it seems he was asked to leave a few times and did not . Then he was arrested. Read his account ( and his Who I am) and tell me that you don't at least think possibly he was looking for some kind of a story.

IF his account is accurate, he was the victim of mistaken identity.

He had the audacity to request that police (and "staffers") check up on it before throwing him out.

The one statement from the police officer involved that I cited earlier seems to indicate that they agree with his account. They only arrested him based on the word of the campaign staffers who claimed he was a troublemaker from a past event. The police saw no evidence whatsoever that he was planning to cause problems.

 

[Spindrift]

Just to clarify something about the "off-duty" police.

Firms hire police all the time for private duty. Road construction companies for example. Another is a local historical society for security at a re-enactment event (which I personally did). That basically means that they are being paid by the organization. The pay may be through the department or directly depending on the department. It does not make the police officers "security guards". They are still police officers with their full powers of arrest. And normally it does not take away manpower from the "on-duty" force. Since they are working for a private entity they will follow the direction of that entity, within the law.

In this case, the police were told that Bieber was a troublemaker. The police refusal to let him talk to anyone from the campaign is understandable, they don't want a confrontation that could escalate.

That being said, I think that if this event is true, the Romney campaign just wrote another ad for Obama.

 

[crimresearch]

I don't know it seems he was asked to leave a few times and did not . Then he was arrested. Read his account ( and his Who I am) and tell me that you don't at least think possibly he was looking for some kind of a story.

For the second time, where does it say that he refused to leave?

 

[eeyore1954]

For the second time, where does it say that he refused to leave?

Where did I say he refused. But had he left or was he leaving when he was arrested.
Do I feel should have been arrested?
No

 

[crimresearch]

Where did I say he refused. But had he left or was he leaving when he was arrested.
Do I feel should have been arrested?
No

"he was asked to leave a few times and did not"

Oh, so by 'did not' you meant he did? Again, where did these details appear?

 

[bookitty]

I don't know it seems he was asked to leave a few times and did not . Then he was arrested. Read his account ( and his Who I am) and tell me that you don't at least think possibly he was looking for some kind of a story.

Yes, I agree that he was looking for a story. As are many people in the year leading up to an election. Blogger/journalists are very common. I've read through his brief bio and through several articles. He is obviously not a supporter of the GOP but while discussing or interviewing Republican candidates, he has been respectful while disagreeing.

Here is an excerpt from an article on Santorum:

As the event wound down, I started to ask Santorum the same question. He broke in – “Read the quote.” He hadn’t compared the two, he claimed.

I was bewildered. Of course he has – it’s well-documented. How is this even up for debate? I pressed back, but he wasn’t having any of it. “Read the quote.” One of his staffers turned to me, and with the sanctimonious expression of a parent reprimanding a child, exhorted me to do the same.

I felt embarrassed. Had I misremembered the quote? Worse, had I swallowed some leftist propaganda about the guy and then thrown it at his feet?

Hardly a rabble-rouser. If this is the level of discourse that Romney is looking to avoid, he'll be keeping the cops very, very busy.