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Merged Anthrax Case Solved?

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I tried to get into Anthrax back in the day, but in the end I thought they just sucked.
 
I don't want to convict the man since I have no idea if he actually did it or not but if he did, it's not uncommon for people who've committed a serious crime and are about to be arrested to commit suicide. If arrested, he very well may have been charged with terrorism in addition to murder.
 
Jontg said:
Look, people, we're gonna need to pull together on this. For the first time in a good while, we have a chance to nip a CT in the bud, and it's our duty as reasonable men to gather all the data necessary to establish a reasonable alternative hypothesis to "OMG DR ivns wuz a patsy!!12!@ anthax wuz insid jobb WAKE UP SHEEPLE!!!!1111!!!1!!" I would suggest we find out everything we can about Dr. Ivins and the other players here, and quickly--the woo marshals its forces even as we speak.
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Considering that Ivins worked for the US Army biological warfare research lab at Fort Detrick, Maryland, doesn't that constitute evidence that the anthrax attack was an inside job? Or does your definition of "inside job" depend on the alleged motive of the insider?

If there was a conspiracy involving others and Ivins was just a scapegoat, we certainly won't have a way of knowing given his suicide. So any reasonable person will conclude the anthrax attack was an inside job. It's just a question of whether the (now suicided) insider was a deranged loner, or part of a larger conspiracy.
 
The problem with Ivins' suicide as I see it is that he just watched his colleague Stephen Hatfield win a rather large settlement and receive his good name back for exactly the same charge. In other words, if it wasn't true, there would have been a lot of grief but the odds were good that it would turn out well for him.

But he shortcircuited that entire process. He could still be a depressed person who lost reason and thought that this time the FBI would have him, evidence or no, but I tend toward the "probably had the right guy this time" opinion.

ETA: A Christian Zionist, if that's what Ivins turns out to be, would have a very available motive to access for these attacks. That is, provoking a war that the suspect had every reason to believe America and Israel would win.
 
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Tippit said:
Considering that Ivins worked for the US Army biological warfare research lab at Fort Detrick, Maryland, doesn't that constitute evidence that the anthrax attack was an inside job? Or does your definition of "inside job" depend on the alleged motive of the insider?

If there was a conspiracy involving others and Ivins was just a scapegoat, we certainly won't have a way of knowing given his suicide. So any reasonable person will conclude the anthrax attack was an inside job. It's just a question of whether the (now suicided) insider was a deranged loner, or part of a larger conspiracy.
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There has long been the suspicion that this was an inside job: not that many people have access to antrax, and IIRC the strain matched one from a government lab. So this is not news. The questions for a long time have been who the insider was, was the insider acting alone, and what was the motivation.
 
Tippit said:
Considering that Ivins worked for the US Army biological warfare research lab at Fort Detrick, Maryland, doesn't that constitute evidence that the anthrax attack was an inside job? Or does your definition of "inside job" depend on the alleged motive of the insider?

If there was a conspiracy involving others and Ivins was just a scapegoat, we certainly won't have a way of knowing given his suicide. So any reasonable person will conclude the anthrax attack was an inside job. It's just a question of whether the (now suicided) insider was a deranged loner, or part of a larger conspiracy.
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If a loner inside Fort Detrick can still be considered an inside job, then 9/11 can be considered an inside job. The incredible success of the hijackers was in part due to their being "inside" the coverage of NORAD. NORAD was looking at threats coming from outside the country, not internally. The hijackers had infiltrated an area of trust.

But the folks chanting 9/11 was a inside job must mean something more than that, correct?
 
boloboffin said:
If a loner inside Fort Detrick can still be considered an inside job, then 9/11 can be considered an inside job. The incredible success of the hijackers was in part due to their being "inside" the coverage of NORAD. NORAD was looking at threats coming from outside the country, not internally. The hijackers had infiltrated an area of trust.

But the folks chanting 9/11 was a inside job must mean something more than that, correct?
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No, for 9/11 to be an inside job it would have had to have had a conspirator in the US government, FAA, or working for the airlines.

Ivins worked for the government. None of the hijackers did.

Of course, this still does not make it a government conspiracy.
 
Last night Keith Olbermann discussed possible links with the Bush administration, at least insofar as they (and John McCain) tried to quickly link the anthrax attacks to Iraq. Not really "inside job," but troothers will certainly take that line of interpretation.
 
Tippit said:
It's just a question of whether the (now suicided) insider was a deranged loner, or part of a larger conspiracy.
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So he was suicided?!?! Do you have any idea what the ld50 is for Tyleno and codeinel? I suppose you actually think that someone force fed the guy about 800 milligrams instead of a more possible accidental overdose (or intentional)...
 
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Tippit said:
Considering that Ivins worked for the US Army biological warfare research lab at Fort Detrick, Maryland, doesn't that constitute evidence that the anthrax attack was an inside job?
Click to expand...

No.

So any reasonable person will conclude the anthrax attack was an inside job.
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No.

I agree with boloboffin, for it to be an "inside job" you would need evidence of government complicity.

McVeigh worked for the US army, does that mean the Oklahoma City bombing was an inside job? Of course not.
 
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Pardalis said:
I agree with boloboffin, for it to be an "inside job" you would need evidence of government complicity.
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If this is agreed then "inside job" is used differently in these threads than elsewhere.

If a store is robbed and it is determined that an employee gave the crooks the combination to the safe for a share of the profits, it is considered an "inside job" even if there was no conspiracy of the store owners.

Oklahoma City would only be considered an "inside job" if McVeigh used some special access or knowledge as a government employee as part of the plot. AFAIK he did not.
 
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Why wasn't it ever presupposed that Hatfill may have been just "trying to test a vaccine".

One thing I'd really like to know, who fingered Hatfill?
It was stated early on that a fellow scientist pointed at Hatfill.

Ivins was diagnosed as homicidal and sociopathic. He made homicidal threats dating back to college. Yet, only now he's a suspect.
 
manofthesea said:
One thing I'd really like to know, who fingered Hatfill?
It was stated early on that a fellow scientist pointed at Hatfill.

A Barbara Rosenberg.

Ivins was diagnosed as homicidal and sociopathic. He made homicidal threats dating back to college. Yet, only now he's a suspect.
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Amazing that he was allowed to work in an anthrax laboratory, in view of these claims!!
 
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