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Ann Counter: comedienne

So is it okay for a beaner* to make Mexican jokes, but not a white chick?

My answer would be a qualified yes. Conventional wisdom says that you can't be a racist against your own race, which would mean the word as used could not be an epithet. Seems to me this is along the lines of black people and the n* word. It may not be fair or logical, but it is what it is. I do think there are other, perhaps more complicated reasons why it's not okay for anyone to use the word, regardless of race, but they aren't specifically related to racism.
 

You are unbelievably lame -- like Coulter accusing Franken of "intellectual dishonesty" because she couldn't find his satirical endnotes for _Lying Liars_.

Nya writes:

Franken is often rude and tasteless towards people who don't agree with his politics, Coulter wants people killed who do not agree with her politics, I don't really think those two things are quite morally equivalent.

Like who? Who has Franken savagely attacked -- provoked -- merely because they disagree with his politics? The figures that Franken has gone after -- O'Reilly, Hannity, Limbaugh, and Coulter (among others) have done or said things that are extremely stupid.

Have you ever listened to his radio program? I've only heard it a few times; it's a bit dull -- not the emotional, attack-those-who-disagree show on every other (conservative) talk radio station.
 
Like who? Who has Franken savagely attacked -- provoked -- merely because they disagree with his politics? The figures that Franken has gone after -- O'Reilly, Hannity, Limbaugh, and Coulter (among others) have done or said things that are extremely stupid.

Have you ever listened to his radio program? I've only heard it a few times; it's a bit dull -- not the emotional, attack-those-who-disagree show on every other (conservative) talk radio station.

Three things.

1) As I pointed out in an earlier post, I found his the name calling in "Big Fat Idiot" offputting and "Rude & tasteless" are in the eye of the beholder. So if you don't think he was rude, that's your call.

2) Whether the people he has been rude toward deserved it or not is entirely a seperate issue from whether or not he was rude.

3) In any case, whether one agrees that Franken was rude or not does not detract from the main point of my post, which is that the things Franken has said are not really comparable to the things COulter hs said and that Coulter's excesses are far worse. In fact, if he WASN'T rude, tht would actually strengthen my point, no?
 
My answer would be a qualified yes. Conventional wisdom says that you can't be a racist against your own race, which would mean the word as used could not be an epithet. Seems to me this is along the lines of black people and the n* word. It may not be fair or logical, but it is what it is. I do think there are other, perhaps more complicated reasons why it's not okay for anyone to use the word, regardless of race, but they aren't specifically related to racism.
Yup, that's what the conventional wisdom says. But Mencia made an excellent, even intelligent case for why the CW is wrong. I have to watch him more often - he's really, really good.
 
Three things.

1) As I pointed out in an earlier post, I found his the name calling in "Big Fat Idiot" offputting and "Rude & tasteless" are in the eye of the beholder. So if you don't think he was rude, that's your call.

What about tasteless?
:)

He certainly is rude, on occasion, although the origin of that rudeness is usually beyond simple political disagreement (the original assertion), and I haven't seen anything that is particularly tasteless, even in a liberal (heh) consideration.
 
Yup, that's what the conventional wisdom says. But Mencia made an excellent, even intelligent case for why the CW is wrong. I have to watch him more often - he's really, really good.

If he made a joke about mexicans demonstrating and that's why he didn't get fresh towels at his hotel, then it is equally as lame as it would be as when Coulter says it.

Racist or not, it's just not funny.
 
I foundhis comment about John McCain, even in context, to be tasteless. YMMV.

Very much, I'd say.

His comment about McCain was so NOT tasteless IMO that he could have made it in McCain's presence, and McCain himself would have laughed at it.
 
Have you ever listened to his radio program? I've only heard it a few times; it's a bit dull -- not the emotional, attack-those-who-disagree show on every other (conservative) talk radio station.

Tell you what. You figure out the ultimate fitting name to replace "Brights" and I'll tune in Franken for a week. This will cut into the time I normally spend listening to Penn's radio show so its a big sacrfice. I'll come back and tell if Franken does emotional attack type stuff before I fell asleep.
 
Have you ever listened to his radio program? I've only heard it a few times; it's a bit dull -- not the emotional, attack-those-who-disagree show on every other (conservative) talk radio station.

Yes, I have listened to his show and found it as full of ignorance as anything I've heard about Coulter. The fact I have listened to his show means I have heard more Franken than Coulter. The only time I hear anything about Coulter is on this forum. I had to Google her the first time I heard about her here.

And, yes, dull. Dull, dull, dull. Dullness and ignorance. All I could do was wonder what he was doing on the air. Is Air America that bankrupt talent-wise? No wonder the Right is winning.
 
Yes, I have listened to his show and found it as full of ignorance as anything I've heard about Coulter.

Considering your track record in chacterizing Franken (see this thread), that doesn't mean much.
 
Three things.

1) As I pointed out in an earlier post, I found his the name calling in "Big Fat Idiot" offputting and "Rude & tasteless" are in the eye of the beholder. So if you don't think he was rude, that's your call.

2) Whether the people he has been rude toward deserved it or not is entirely a seperate issue from whether or not he was rude.

I can't say that being rude is "offputting" if it's done in an appropriate context. Of course, I agree, what one considers "rude" and "appropriate" is subjective (though not hopelessly so). Franken attacked Limbaugh personally because Limbaugh makes liberal use of ad hominems. Now, some sophisticates may answer back, "aha! but that doesn't make it right." More pretentious critics might resort to the latin: "tu quoque" logical fallacy! Please. However, Franken attacks his subjects on substantive matters (the satirical comments and insults are just gravy).

3) In any case, whether one agrees that Franken was rude or not does not detract from the main point of my post, which is that the things Franken has said are not really comparable to the things COulter hs said and that Coulter's excesses are far worse. In fact, if he WASN'T rude, tht would actually strengthen my point, no?

I thought I had made a similar point on equivalency earlier (or maybe in that same post). But the two should not be treated as being in the same category at all. That's like saying Larry the Cable Guy is similar to Woody Allen because they're both famous for their humor.

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Corplinx writes:

Tell you what. You figure out the ultimate fitting name to replace "Brights" and I'll tune in Franken for a week. This will cut into the time I normally spend listening to Penn's radio show so its a big sacrfice. I'll come back and tell if Franken does emotional attack type stuff before I fell asleep.

Oh, bah! Penn has a radio show? And you listen to it? And you would consider forgoing listening to it as as "big sacrifice"? Corp: You need more help than I thought!

Besides, that wouldn't be a major motivator because if I could come up with the "ultimate" alternative to "Bright" then I'd be a minor-celebrity with his own skepchicks groupies. Plus, I wouldn't make you listen to Franken for a week (I don't even care much for the show!) You'd have to read a book, possibly Franken's _Liars_, though preferably political philosopher Brian Barry's _Why Social Justice Matters_.

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Luke T. writes:

Yes, I have listened to his show and found it as full of ignorance as anything I've heard about Coulter. The fact I have listened to his show means I have heard more Franken than Coulter. The only time I hear anything about Coulter is on this forum. I had to Google her the first time I heard about her here.

And, yes, dull. Dull, dull, dull. Dullness and ignorance. All I could do was wonder what he was doing on the air. Is Air America that bankrupt talent-wise? No wonder the Right is winning.

pgwenthold has already seized upon the strongest possible reply. I will merely counter that you can call Franken dull, but he definitely isn't ignorant.
 
I've read it. Parts were funny, parts were rude, and parts were interesting. The problem I had with it was that sometimes he was making a serious point using real data, other times he was just making stuff up for a joke, and it wasn't always clear which was which.

I thought it was pretty clear which was which.
Anyway, the biggest difference I see between Franken and the other guys is that Franken tries to get his facts straight. He does research and stuff before spouting off.
 
All of these people have sites solely dedicated to debunking their arguments.

I've got to ask, especially regarding the OP, what is the pay off for you if you do take Ann Coulter (or any other partisan hack) seriously?

I think that in these days, you have to question what you see on the news, read in the newspaper or any source. I don't read Coulter to get the facts, I read her to get a laugh. Franken has never made me laugh, ever. Is Err America still sinking in the ratings?
 
I think that in these days, you have to question what you see on the news, read in the newspaper or any source. I don't read Coulter to get the facts, I read her to get a laugh. Franken has never made me laugh, ever. Is Err America still sinking in the ratings?
I googled up ["air america" ratings]. The first 20 or so hits were conservative blogs from 2004 and early 2005. All said what Pepto just said. One of them even mentioned 'Err America'. When I got to Wikipedia, I found this:

Air America affiliates have performed well in some markets and poorly in others. In Arbitron's Fall 2005 ratings book, the most recent available as of February 2006, ratings at Air America stations nationwide have trended generally upward, . . .

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_America_Radio#Ratings

So my question is; if you have to question what you see on the news, read in the newspaper or any source, why would you parrot what the right wing blogs are peddling?
 
I never thought of Franken as a comedian. Even when he was on SNL he wasn't funny.

Geeze, I always thought it was just my imagination that they were the same person. How does one make that kind of transition, b-movie comedy star to political pundit? "I was going to write fart jokes, but then I decided to tackle some of the most difficult questions we as humanity face....and write fart jokes about conservatives"
 
Geeze, I always thought it was just my imagination that they were the same person. How does one make that kind of transition, b-movie comedy star to political pundit?

We live in a world where action movie stars and boa-wearing wrestlers become governors, actors become President and Klansmen become elected state representatives. Al Franken's transition was a cake-walk!
 
Luke, no comment on my posting the context of Franken's quote? You know, the one where it showed he was clearly joking about McCain? You know, the one where you carefully excised all material that made it plain that it was a joke?

My guess is you used some anti-Franken website as your source which kindly sourced it to the book. But you never went to the original source to check the website's quote. Thus, you fell for the anti-Franken site's misquote, not knowing the true context. I hope you now realize that the site you got Franken quote from is rather dishonest. Care to share which one it is?

Lurker
 
I would also submit that the Hardvard pudding quote is probably misquoted as well but unfortunately I have no evidence of such. Of course teh fact that he was laughing as he said it certainly gives some credence to the thought that he was joking. But of course, if you are rabidly anti-Franken, you will conveniently forget that he was laughing as he said it.

I find it hard to believe that Al Franken is a homophobe. I mean, the guy wrote for SNL, which hardly seems homophobic. Perhaps someoone should just call in and ask him about the quote. At least tell him that conservatives are using it to portray him as anti-homosexual.

Lurker
 

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