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American hostage beheaded.

chrisberez said:
The lastest American hostage was just beheaded. Sickening, just sickening.
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[EDITED TO ADD]

I just wanted to add this excerpt and link to an more detailed article on Foxnews (the first is cnn):

"How can we inform on our brothers when we see all these pictures coming from Abu Ghraib and Rafah," Muklas Nawaf, a resident of Dhahar al-Budaih, said as he ate meat grilled on a spit at a restaurant called Jihad, Arabic for holy war. He was referring to the pictures of Iraqis abused by U.S. soldiers at the Abu Ghraib prison (search) in Baghdad and Israeli military incursions and killings in the Gaza refugee camp of Rafah.
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Article here.
 
Oh yes folks! Dubya is winning the war on terror! Thats why another Yank had his head cut of with a rusty knife! Roll up! Roll up! Vote for the Bush!

You bunch of ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ idiots.
 
But we're supposed to be welcomed as HEROS!!!!!!!! Yeah sure.

Poor dude. His family has been freakin out all week.


Things will only get worse. Did you hear the latest story about the CIA "contactor" that beat to death a prisoner with a flashlight. Ohhhh that'll win hearts n minds.
 
Jon_in_london said:
Oh yes folks! Dubya is winning the war on terror! Thats why another Yank had his head cut of with a rusty knife! Roll up! Roll up! Vote for the Bush!

You bunch of ◊◊◊◊◊◊◊ idiots.
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For the record, I'm on you side on this issue, so when you say 'you' I hope you're speaking in the general sense.

Amazing how bush is blatantly lying (still) and people continue to believe him. People still think there was an Iraq/Al Qaeda connection, that Iraq participated in 9/11, and that there are actually WMDs despite all the evidence to the contrary and the findings of the 9-11 commission.

That said, I still find the beheading of hostages highly disturbing, especially since it is all for nothing.
 
Condolences to the family.

I hope the Saudis start an honest investigation and bring those who are guilty of this crime to justice. I'm less than optimistic that it will happen though.
 
evil sutko said:
I hope the Saudis start an honest investigation and bring those who are guilty of this crime to justice. I'm less than optimistic that it will happen though.
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Chrisberez: I was speaking generally, I also find the sawing off of people's heads with rusty bayonets rather unsettling.

The problem is sutko, once you have alienated the entire Arab world- who are you going to rely on to do the investigating? While the House of Saud may desire it, who is to say that the people they command arent entirely sympathetic to the Antimerican cause?
 
Yet again, it's no fun correctly predicting all this.

America, especially the idiot half of it behind the war, has no understanding and less than no acceptance of the culture over there. We proudly display our disdain for it.

We start a war of "liberation". Then we screw up so badly restoring normality to the country that they are pissed at us instead of grateful.

Then we put a shoe in the face of their entire culture with this prisoner abuse stuff. Because of the first point, warmongering Americans don't see the harm; what's the big deal? Worse happens at frat parties, right? Sheer ignorance and arrogance.

Thereby making some of them hate us vehemently. Imagine your favorite righty if someone came to his house and took a **** on his flag. This is how we have made the more fanatical Iraquis feel now.

Therefore reaping their fury, expressed barbarically. And because of point 1, stupid righty Americans didn't exoect this!!!

Listen to their shocked rhetoric. Why, those people are animals! Nuke them!

People: That's why it was madness to poke a stick in that hornet's nest in the first place!

I knew this was going to happen. I knew we would bumble around and create a new unstable spot in the world for barbarism and terrorism to grow, all because of our outrageous hubris in thinking Only We Can Set The World Right. I knew that acts of barbarism would occur and, rather than realizing the folly of the exercise in the first place, we would wrap ourselves in the g*dd*mn flag again and strike back with righteous indignance.

Sorry to rant, but it makes me insane that this is all going precisely how I knew it would.
 
Look, I realize no one is clean here, but weren't these arabs who beheaded this man, not Iraqiis?

To be smug about predicting the deaths of Americans as they trot themselves to the front is like predicting your ice cream will run down your arm in a hot summer day if you don't eat it fast enough. Sorry, you do not win the million.

I give the US a C- for the way this "War on Terror" has proceeded since Osama Bin Laden first took the stage, but when and where else is the world to take a stand on violence as political and/or philisophical expression (as opposed to violence as an abhorent facet of humanity--a la prison torture)?
 
Well, I'm chime in also, but just for this one post.

The killing of innocents for the sake of killing innocents (or to make a political statement) predates the Bush administration by a couple of thousand years. The question remains -- are there more lives likely to be lost in the long run (ours as well as theirs) by not taking the actions he is?

That's up for debate. I'm personally of the mind there are more lives at stake but I could be wrong. I'll step back now and listen to the topical debate. I'm sure there will be no rhetoric.

Edit: one sprellling mustake.
 
Jon_in_london said:


Chrisberez: I was speaking generally, I also find the sawing off of people's heads with rusty bayonets rather unsettling.

The problem is sutko, once you have alienated the entire Arab world- who are you going to rely on to do the investigating? While the House of Saud may desire it, who is to say that the people they command arent entirely sympathetic to the Antimerican cause?
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Ok I thought you were, but sometimes it's hard to tell.

From what I read (although now I can't remember which article it was and I can't find the quote) The Saudi's trying to find Johnson had a lot of trouble because there is so much anger at America no one wanted to help, and the people questioned said the kidnappers were heroes.

Alienating the entire Arab world is bad enough. The fact that we insisted on engaging in war and alienating most of our european allies makes things even worse.
 
c0rbin said:
Look, I realize no one is clean here, but weren't these arabs who beheaded this man, not Iraqiis?

I give the US a C- for the way this "War on Terror" has proceeded since Osama Bin Laden first took the stage, but when and where else is the world to take a stand on violence as political and/or philisophical expression (as opposed to violence as an abhorent facet of humanity--a la prison torture)?
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They werent not iraqis? so they were iraqis?! huh?!

I would give the US around a W- not a C- for its handling of TWAT and who is to say that yanks torturing prisoners is any more or less "an abhorent facet of humanity" than "political and/or philisophical expression"?

You attempt to excuse the inexcusable behaviour of your fellow countrymen while simultaneously condemning the actions of foreigners.

Dispicable.
 
IS anyone surpised The Saudi people arent helping. Same attitude in the States. Remember the hometown of one of those guards that was accused of mistreating prisoners. THe people there said the guy would be welcomed as hero. A HERO!!! After being tossed out of the Army and embarassing the nation!!!
 
Jon_in_london said:


Chrisberez: I was speaking generally, I also find the sawing off of people's heads with rusty bayonets rather unsettling.
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I wonder why they don't just shoot the hostages. Is there something in the Koran about beheading unbelievers being a good thing or am I confused?
 
Kidnapping Americans & beheading them is turning into an excellent propaganda tool for terrorists.

Allowing their families make appeals in the media for their loved ones lives only emboldens terrorists.

Bush has made a colossal mess of the entire Middle East. It's only a matter of time until there is total chaos in Afghaninstan and Iraq.

Pakistan & Saudi Arabia are probably the next to erupt & then it will be like watching dominos fall.

Bush's inept policies are proving to be a WMD.
 
The problem is sutko, once you have alienated the entire Arab world- who are you going to rely on to do the investigating? While the House of Saud may desire it, who is to say that the people they command arent entirely sympathetic to the Antimerican cause?
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I agree, it's a bizarre situation.

Meanwhile, people are arguing about whisper-thin connections between Saddam and Bin Laden, when Saudi charity money helped fund the Sept. 11 attacks. If the same microscope was pointed at Saudi Arabia, then maybe...

But I have a feeling that the Saudi aspect of this story will be downplayed. Bunch of stuff about "key ally in the War on Terror."
 
Jon_in_london said:


They werent not iraqis? so they were iraqis?! huh?!

I would give the US around a W- not a C- for its handling of TWAT and who is to say that yanks torturing prisoners is any more or less "an abhorent facet of humanity" than "political and/or philisophical expression"?

You attempt to excuse the inexcusable behaviour of your fellow countrymen while simultaneously condemning the actions of foreigners.

Dispicable.
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I would say that there is a difference between Mobilized War with regular units, terrorism, and toture.

The first is an expedition with rules of engagement. The second uses innocent lives as currency, and the third is a personal trip in to a heart of darkness.

Now all three are violent, all three effect individuals, families, villages and nations, but I think there are grounds for separating them.

Now I made no attempt to excuse torture, nor have I made any attemp to excuse the targeting and murder of civilians. I am not proud of my country's prosecution of this "War on Terror" but her example has few peers.

I find that to be dispicable.
 
Sundog said:
Yet again, it's no fun correctly predicting all this.

America, especially the idiot half of it behind the war, has no understanding and less than no acceptance of the culture over there. We proudly display our disdain for it.
Click to expand...


I'm sorry, which part of that culture that we idiots don't understand deals with beheading innocent people based on their citizenship and exactly how should we understand it?

We start a war of "liberation". Then we screw up so badly restoring normality to the country that they are pissed at us instead of grateful.

Then we put a shoe in the face of their entire culture with this prisoner abuse stuff. Because of the first point, warmongering Americans don't see the harm; what's the big deal? Worse happens at frat parties, right? Sheer ignorance and arrogance.

Thereby making some of them hate us vehemently. Imagine your favorite righty if someone came to his house and took a **** on his flag. This is how we have made the more fanatical Iraquis feel now.
Click to expand...

Frankly I would not care if someone did that but you are ignoring the fact that it did not happen in Iraq, most likely did not involve Iraqis and most importantly was done by a group that is behind 9/11 which if you recall happened before Iraq. But I guess this is some other aspect of this majestic culture I simply lack the understanding of.
Therefore reaping their fury, expressed barbarically. And because of point 1, stupid righty Americans didn't exoect this!!!

Listen to their shocked rhetoric. Why, those people are animals! Nuke them!

People: That's why it was madness to poke a stick in that hornet's nest in the first place!

I knew this was going to happen. I knew we would bumble around and create a new unstable spot in the world for barbarism and terrorism to grow, all because of our outrageous hubris in thinking Only We Can Set The World Right. I knew that acts of barbarism would occur and, rather than realizing the folly of the exercise in the first place, we would wrap ourselves in the g*dd*mn flag again and strike back with righteous indignance.

Sorry to rant, but it makes me insane that this is all going precisely how I knew it would.
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You are simply excusing the behavior of the criminal who committed this heinous act. Frankly I do not understand why you do it. One can disagree with the war and question its motives, but to pin this crime on USA is just plain stupid.
 
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