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Advice on Flu Vaccination from NHS Direct site

A week off of work? I don't get paid unless I show up. My office won't offer it free either. Harumph. Maybe if more people were willing to pay for it, then more would be available cheaper. Law of Supply and Demand.

With all the antivaccine freaks though, vaccine makers don't want to waste too much on hoping people will just pay for it themselves. We can thank antivaccinator misinformation and hatred for 'big pharma" for shortages.
One pharmaceutical company announced on Tuesday that it was cancelling plans to build a new manufacturing plant in the US, and uncertainty about demand is likely to have influenced the decision.

http://www.cidrap.umn.edu/cidrap/content/influenza/biz-plan/news/oct0308solvay.html
 
What kind of a question is "do you get flu"? - is it like "do you get cancer"?
:)Well, this doctor had been my GP for some time and had, in fact, seen me through cancer. He knew that I was generally very fit and seldom succumb even to coughs and colds.
 
The internet makes life so much more complicated...

It really does.
I have paid for my flu jab for the last couple of years and am due for another next week. I've had flu a couple of times and been ill for 3-4 weeks so I'm willing to do my best to avoid another bout.
Why would getting flu leave you with better long term protection than an annual jab?
Anyone?
 
It really does.
I have paid for my flu jab for the last couple of years and am due for another next week. I've had flu a couple of times and been ill for 3-4 weeks so I'm willing to do my best to avoid another bout.
Why would getting flu leave you with better long term protection than an annual jab?
Anyone?

My (partially educated) guess is that being both live and more virulent than the vaccine, it activates more parts of the immune system, thus making the protection more general.

But I'd like to hear from someone with more knowledge too. Blutoski? Deetee?
 
Why would getting flu leave you with better long term protection than an annual jab?Anyone?
Well, for one thing, the experience might make you more cautious about possible exposure during flu season. Plus, the immunity aquired through actual exposure is "natural", and everybody knows: natural = better.

Seriously though, there really isn't any such thing as "long term protection" against influenza, whether immunity is aquired through infection or immunization -- not in the same sense as with, say, measles. That is, the resulting antibodies will provide excellent protection against a strain bearing antigens similar to the one that stimulated their production, and that protection will last quite a while; but it won't help much against a different strain, or a sufficiently mutated descendant of the original.
 
Why would getting flu leave you with better long term protection than an annual jab?
Anyone?
I should think that if one had had flu, then the next autumn would be a very good time to have a flu jab.

For myself I think that, as I don't get flu, my immune system must be good at preventing any flu virus from taking hold.
 
That is exactly the same reason that I don't have a flu shot either. I have never had flu and very rarely get colds, so I really don't see the point. I am young, fit and healthy so would rather leave the vaccine for people who actually need it.
 
I first heard a Scottish doctor tell a patient that they would feel 'a wee jag' and thought it was a great phrase. Years later I hear people use the phrase 'you'll feel a small prick' and be greatly amused by their wit.

When I was a student, there was a renowned, but diminutive equine surgeon and horses were frequently reassured on his approach to stay calm because it was "just a little prick with a needle".

Back on-topic, we pay for our staff to have the flu jab if they want it and we have a doctor come to our premises to do it. We'd like to avoid the disaster of having everyone of with flu, but there's no compulsion. (If people choose not to have it, we just get our Black Ops team to visit them at night to inject the alien DNA while they sleep. Problem sorted.)
 
A recent study suggests that flu vaccinations can help to cross prime responses against other strains.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7659113.stm

I had mine yesterday.

I is not unreasonable for there to be that 'priming' effect to subsequent vaccine exposure, which brings back to the table the question of whether prior flu vaccinations would have a useful priming effect against exposure to new-strain real disease.

Is there any evidence from the H5N1 outbreaks that there have already been that prior flu vaccination to other strains reduced morbidity and mortality? I suspect that vaccination rates in those communities that have had H5N1 outbreaks would be so low as to make this a difficult question to answer.
 
Is there any evidence from the H5N1 outbreaks that there have already been that prior flu vaccination to other strains reduced morbidity and mortality?
No seasonal flu vaccine has ever included H5 antigen. Read the source article. They were using adjuvanted H5N3.
 
I work in an Assisted living home. In previous years the company would offer the shot, but employees had to pay. THis year they are "Encouraging" all employees to get it and are picking up the cost. As a manager it's part of my job to '"encourage" my employees to get it and I am supposed to come down pretty hard. Pretty dramatic shift from last year.
 
Huh. To this American (albeit naturalized one), the thought that the flu is a minor inconvenience is a mildly odd one. For one, there have been studies on the cost to the workforce due to lost productivity:
http://money.cnn.com/2003/10/16/news/companies/flu_impact/

Secondly, while the At-Risk groups are the most likely to suffer adverse consequences from influenza, I don't recall anyone actually being exempt. Someone with better knowledge please correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understood, even someone not in the low risk group could potentially die from a severe case.

But given all that, the NHS info is not actually wrong. They did phrase things as saying "For the rest of us, flu is usually only a minor illness..." (emphasis mine). It may come off as a tiny bit glib of an explanation, but again, they have limited supply. They have to justify the restrictions somehow, and their justification seems entirely reasonable, since it is true for the majority of people.
 
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/f480a54a-8a5e-11dd-a76a-0000779fd18c.html

Competition has also led many of them to cut the cost of the vaccine. Two years ago, Asda charged £12.97 for the jab but this year it will only ask for £10. Superdrug charged £15 in 2006, but is charging £9.95 this year.

Flu jabs at Tesco this autumn will cost £12. Boots is charging £15, the same price as last year.

Retailers either use their own in-store pharmacists to administer jabs, or hire medical service providers and trained nurses to come into the branches. Asda will work with Doctorcall, the mobile medical service, while Sainsbury is using Advantage Healthcare.

I'm getting mine from Sainsbury's tomorrow morning. It may be more expensive than those from Tesco, Asda and Superdrug, but I want to make sure it's a natural virus grown in organic free-range eggs.
 
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/f480a54a-8a5e-11dd-a76a-0000779fd18c.html

I'm getting mine from Sainsbury's tomorrow morning. It may be more expensive than those from Tesco, Asda and Superdrug, but I want to make sure it's a natural virus grown in organic free-range eggs.


Hope you got your flu shot okay?

For myself, I still really don't see the point, so I am not planning on getting one any time soon. I am also disinclined to have to pay for it myself, as I don't come under the at risk categories.
 
Hope you got your flu shot okay?

For myself, I still really don't see the point, so I am not planning on getting one any time soon. I am also disinclined to have to pay for it myself, as I don't come under the at risk categories.

It all went fine. The only effects so far are a slight temperature and minor ache in my shoulder.

I think what is required is for a country to implement universal flu vaccination for a season or two to see if it makes a significant difference to the morbidity and/or mortality during flu season.
 
A recent study suggests that flu vaccinations can help to cross prime responses against other strains.

I think the important question is this: "Is the flu shot effective in preventing influenza?"

Here are some of the things I find puzzling:

From http://www.astrazeneca.com.ph/?itemId=3858768

Vaccinating children aged 5 years and younger did not reduce hospitalizations or outpatient visits linked to influenza over the past two flu seasons, a US study suggests...

...Children immunized with the influenza vaccine did not get the flu at lower rates than unvaccinated children. The vaccinated children were equally as likely as unvaccinated children to be hospitalized or to visit the doctor.

From http://www.bclocalnews.com/opinion/30268069.html

Distinguished virologist (one who studies viruses) and former chief vaccine control officer at the US Food and Drug Administration, Dr. J. Anthony Morris said: “There is no evidence that any influenza vaccination thus far developed is effective in preventing or mitigating any attack of influenza”.”

From http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNe...flushot_report_061026/20061026?hub=TopStories

In fact, Jefferson says there's evidence proving these vaccines have little or no effect on things such as hospital stay, time off work, or even death resulting from influenza and its complications -- especially in elderly people.

Jefferson makes his arguments in a controversial report titled "Influenza vaccination: policy versus evidence," published in volume 333 of the British Medical Journal (BMJ)...

...To highlight his claim that there's a lack of evidence backing the vaccine's effectiveness, Jefferson cites a study in the Cochrane review, "Vaccines for preventing influenza in healthy children," which found that in children under two years old, inactivated vaccines had the same effectiveness as placebo.

Further, a study in the same review for adults found that "in healthy people under 65 vaccination did not affect hospital stay, time off work, or death from influenza and its complication."

Jefferson says there is a "surprising" gap between what the policies of health agencies surrounding influenza tell us and the actual data.

"The reason for this situation are not clear and may be complex," says Jefferson.

He suggests there may be a confusion between influenza and influenza-like illness, where people are being diagnosed with the flu when they have something else.

"This confusion leads to a gross overestimation of the impact of influenza, unrealistic expectations of the performance of vaccines, and spurious certainty of our ability to predict viral circulation and impact."

From http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=23&storycode=4120814&c=2

And a new study looking at vaccination in the UK, where children are covered, has found no benefits for hospitalisations or doctor visits.

Among 414 children vaccinated against flu in the 2003/4 and 2004/5 flu seasons, there was no significant difference in hospitalisations or visits than in more than 5,000 unvaccinated controls in three countries.

The research conflicts with data released in August by the Health Protection Agency suggesting vaccinating children aged six months to six years could reduce incidence of influenza A by 38% and influenza B by 70%, and would ‘bring benefits to both those vaccinated and the community’.

Vaccine effectiveness in the study, in October’s Archives of Pediatric and Adolescent Medicine, ranged from just 7% to 52% for children aged between six and 59 moths.

Dr Peter Szilagyi, a paediatrician at the Strong Memorial Hospital in Rochester, New York, said ’Significant influenza vaccine effectiveness could not be demonstrated for any season, age or setting.’

From http://www.naturalnews.com/024147.html

Another oddity was discovered as well. Even though the percentage of older people who received the vaccine more than tripled between 1980 and 2001, there was no reduction in the death rate.

So, while I wouldn't consider myself anti-vaccine, I can't help but question the effectiveness of flu shots.

RayG
 
I spoke to my colleagues about flu vaccine efficacy. Vaccines were tested at the UK's common cold unit where volunteers were immunised and then challenged with live virus. The results of those studies (published?) established the efficacy of flu vaccination. Another piece of evidence is that in years where the vaccine strains match those of the circulating strains then there are no epidemics. Flu infections are monitored each year by sentinel clinics that take mouth swabs, the data are reported in MMWR
 

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