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Acupuncture at Stanford

Jyera said:
It isn't so much about the number of MD supporting acupuncture.
But the fact that there are MD supporting acupuncture.
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I would imagine that you can find MDs holding pretty much any belief held by the population in general. Doctors are people, after all.

Saying "there are MDs supporting acupuncture", as if this somehow validates it, is an appeal to authority. What is important is not who supports an idea, but what evidence supports it.
 
TheBoyPaj said:
Medical doctors sometimes prescribe placebo, too. Those pills don't do anything either.
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I don't quite understand...

Are you implying that since MD prescribe placebo that do nothing...,
it is okay that they use acupuncture that does nothing...
Then perhaps they can also prescribe homeopathy that does nothing ?

And ironically over here, we scream at people speaking out in support of dubious stuff like homeopathy. Saying they perpetual the dangerous idea that homoepathy is effective, and cause people to die.

Shouldn't they(MD association) forbid MD from Practicing (not just saying) "dangerous" stuff?
 
Jyera said:
I don't quite understand...

Are you implying that since MD prescribe placebo that do nothing...,
it is okay that they use acupuncture that does nothing...
Then perhaps they can also prescribe homeopathy that does nothing ?
Click to expand...
Placebos don't "do nothing". The placebo effect is well documented. If you give someone a treatment that they think is effective, they will feel better, whether the treatment is genuine or not.

And ironically over here, we scream at people speaking out in support of dubious stuff like homeopathy. Saying they perpetual the dangerous idea that homoepathy is effective, and cause people to die.
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Well, actually, you were the one who brought up the idea that acupuncture should be considered legitimate because it is supported by MDs:
Originally posted by Jyera
I wonder why acupuncture is still considered paranormal when it is apparently receives support by the medical doctors.
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Shouldn't they(MD association) forbid MD from Practicing (not just saying) "dangerous" stuff?
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Certainly.
 
Mojo said:
I would imagine that you can find MDs holding pretty much any belief held by the population in general. Doctors are people, after all.

Saying "there are MDs supporting acupuncture", as if this somehow validates it, is an appeal to authority. What is important is not who supports an idea, but what evidence supports it.
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Agree it doesn't validate.
I'm not arguing that it validate acupuncture.
But the facts are there and MD's authority isn't an illusion.

But ironically over here, we scream at people speaking out in support of dubious stuff like homeopathy/acupuncture. Saying they perpetual the dangerous idea that homoepathy/acupuncture is effective, and cause people to die.

Shouldn't they(MD association) forbid MD from Practicing (not just saying) "dangerous" stuff? Why don't they?

Especially when acupuncture has been listed as paranormal in JREF challenge
Which essentially means. "It doesn't exists".
 
Maybe medical authorities should forbid doctors from practising or promoting non-evidence-based methods. However, the fact is that they don't. Therefore the fact that one or more doctors can be found to support a practice doesn't actually say anything about whether or not it works.

Rolfe.
 
Jyera said:
I don't quite understand...

Are you implying that since MD prescribe placebo that do nothing...,
it is okay that they use acupuncture that does nothing...
Then perhaps they can also prescribe homeopathy that does nothing ?
Click to expand...

My point was that we already have an example of doctors using a treatment which they know does nothing (placebo pill) because they think that it will be beneficial for their patient. Playing Devil's advocate, what is the difference if they choose acupuncture as their method of placebo?

Personally, I don't like it. I think it is in danger of encouraging a treatment which many other, less scrupulous, practitioners are willing to sell without concerning themselves over whether the patient would be better served by real medicine.

At least if an MD prescribes a placebo that looks like a real drug, you perpetuate the idea that people are best served by real doctors.
 
Jyera said:
Under American Academy of Medical Acupuncture.
http://www.medicalacupuncture.org/findadoc/index.html

I found
>80 members registered as acupuncturist in NY (new york?)
>127 members registered as acupuncturist in CA (california?)
Most of them MD. Which I take to mean medical doctors.

I wonder why acupuncture is still considered paranormal when it is apparently receives support by the medical doctors.
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And some doctors even believe in suicide. Ever heard of Dr. Kevorkian, M.D.?
 
rjh01 said:
I think there is a difference between having a service that can be used if requested and encouraging people to use this service.
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But how many times have you heard the "it must work because doctors use it" argument? Some people feel that, when doctors prescribe a treatment, it becomes validated.
 
Not a very good argument. 'Appeal to authority' I believe you call that.

Like what was said above,
And some doctors even believe in suicide. Ever heard of Dr. Kevorkian, M.D.?
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Does this make suicide a valid medical treatment for depression or anything else?
 
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