about cell phone text messages

[1984]

Anyone able to give a simplified explanation of what happens to a cell phone text message from the moment it is sent to the moment it appears on the receiver's screen?

Also, if an employee of a cell phone carrier wanted to, could they read what messages were being sent, received, and waiting to be received? I'm not talking about the Feds, but regular employees, for want of a better word.

Do all the text messages get logged somewhere? If you delete a message, is it really permanently deleted?

 

[Complexity]

Just my opinions, but... :

I'm sure the messages are retained for a period of time.

Regular employees shouldn't have access to the messages, but I'm sure that at least a few employees do.

Messages won't be truly deleted until the company chooses to destroy them.

Whatever message that you're concerned about is probably still out there. Sorry.

The good news: given the huge number of messages, unless some government twit exercises power and demands copies of your messages, no one is likely to ever see them. Think of Niagara Falls...

A caution, though - if your message mentioned assassination, bomb, nuclear, etc., all bets are off - software could trigger your message for review.

 

[1984]

Whatever message that you're concerned about is probably still out there. Sorry.

Not for me. Honest . I was just wondering how credible it is when a journalist says they've "obtained" text messages. They could just make anything up, and much of the public would buy it.

 

[blutoski]

Anyone able to give a simplified explanation of what happens to a cell phone text message from the moment it is sent to the moment it appears on the receiver's screen?

Also, if an employee of a cell phone carrier wanted to, could they read what messages were being sent, received, and waiting to be received? I'm not talking about the Feds, but regular employees, for want of a better word.

Do all the text messages get logged somewhere? If you delete a message, is it really permanently deleted?

You'd have to ask your service provider, since different messaging platforms have different delivery protocols, and even two with the same protocol can have different settings.

Mostly, they work like email: one mobile sends a copy to a destination or list of destinations, and it goes through a message relay that may pass into another service provider's network. It will sit in a folder of pending messages on a gateway computer until the other network confirms receipt or until a configurable waiting period. After that, it's usually deleted for economic reasons, sometimes after a delay.

The message needs to be stored on the recipient's network at least until the handset confirms it has been received, or until a configurable length of time has passed. It would sit in a folder of pending messages at this point, and if the handset doesn't receive it in time, it will be deleted for economic reasons.

The only employees who would have access to this information would certainly would have been screened, and with millions of messages going through the system per day, they would have no reason to trip over it by accident.

Networks are under economic constraints to save money by not storing stuff unless you can charge for it as an actual product. Nevertheless, they probably log the event of a message and archive it.

 

[1984]

The only employees who would have access to this information would certainly would have been screened, and with millions of messages going through the system per day, they would have no reason to trip over it by accident.

(my underlining)

So by this do you mean that it would be quite difficult for an employee, or group of employees, to get specific messages on a certain topic? I'm really curious as to what a journalist would, or could do, to manufacture a story.

Nevertheless, they probably log the event of a message and archive it.

This I can confirm. It is known as the "bill".

(edited for clarity)

 

[blutoski]

(my underlining)

So by this do you mean that it would be quite difficult for an employee, or group of employees, to get specific messages on a certain topic? I'm really curious as to what a journalist would or could do to manufacture a story.

Not impossible. All carriers have a security department, and some probably have a tool to comply with court orders to store a particular customer's traffic. They may not be able to produce old messages, but they can probably store new ones.

I suppose an employee with a motive could access this tool for unofficial reasons, but would it be worth his job? Divulging customer information is usually a quick way to find yourself fired and sued.

This I can confirm. It is known as the "bill".

Logs, logs, logs.

 

[blutoski]

I suppose an employee with a motive could access this tool for unofficial reasons, but would it be worth his job? Divulging customer information is usually a quick way to find yourself fired and sued.

Now that I think about it, it's possible that a journalist may have insiders in the justice system, and the text messages were evidence in an investigation. The leak may have come from an investigation instead of the carrier.

 

[1984]

Now that I think about it, it's possible that a journalist may have insiders in the justice system, and the text messages were evidence in an investigation. The leak may have come from an investigation instead of the carrier.

Oh, okay. The stories (aka: newspaper reports) I'm refering to were published by a media organisation claiming to have received intercepted text messages. (They choose their words carefully and have an in-house team of lawyers whose sole speciality it is, is to advise and defend.) This organisation got a lot of mileage from these text messages. There was no mention of any official investigation by authorities.

You seem to be in-the-know, thanks so far.

 

[kevin]

If your carrier is AT&T the messages are probably cc'd to the NSA, apparently everything else that goes through AT&T is.

I believe most SMS messages are only retained on the sending end (sent items type folder) and the received end. During transit anyone with access to the network (usually limited, but can be a lot of people) can read the message.

Also if you are sending an SMS from one carrier to another then assume it'll probably travel over the internet at somepoint and probably be readable by a lot more people then.

I gather most journalists who say they have text messages are probably either from a hack on the phone itself (this is how Paris Hilton's stuff got posted to the internet) or direct access to the phone.

 

[kevin]

Oh, okay. The stories (aka: newspaper reports) I'm refering to were based by a media organisation claiming to have received intercepted text messages. (They choose their words carefully and have an in-house team of lawyers whose sole speciality it is, is to advise and defend.) Gotta go back and check now.

Intercepted from where? My guess would be from the phone itself (sender or receiver), not during actual transit.

 

[1984]

Intercepted from where? My guess would be from the phone itself (sender or receiver), not during actual transit.

Senders and receivers who want to make a difference (and some money) and go straight to the media. *sigh*

 

[blutoski]

Oh, okay. The stories (aka: newspaper reports) I'm refering to were published by a media organisation claiming to have received intercepted text messages. (They choose their words carefully and have an in-house team of lawyers whose sole speciality it is, is to advise and defend.) This organisation got a lot of mileage from these text messages. There was no mention of any official investigation by authorities.

Ah. The key word there is 'intercepted'. They may just be scanning local transmissions with a special scanner, and trolling the packets for keywords.



One other thing that had occurred to me is that if you get a hold of the handet, even deleted messages can be retrieved if they haven't been overwritten in the storage media. Same way you can get deleted files of a hard-drive.

 

[sionep]

Messages won't be truly deleted until the company chooses to destroy them.

I am not quite so sure about this, but I think that the Sarbines Act passed in Congress makes it illegal to destroy company records as emails, text messages, recorded phone conversations , etc... This came after the Enron scandal, where some of the incriminating evidence they were looking for, have been destroyed, therefore such action (destroying company communication records) is now a crime.

 

[dogbite666]

Hi,

I work for a company that provides sms messaging. The answer is yes, someone with the appropreate permissions will be able to read every text message ever sent. When you delete a message you just delete it from your phone. The server still holds the message. If someone has 'got hold' of those messages then that mobile company has breached the Data Protection Act.

Dog.

 

[EHocking]

I am not quite so sure about this, but I think that the Sarbines Act passed in Congress makes it illegal to destroy company records as emails, text messages, recorded phone conversations , etc... This came after the Enron scandal, where some of the incriminating evidence they were looking for, have been destroyed, therefore such action (destroying company communication records) is now a crime.

Not quite true.

You may destroy just about any records you like if they are of no further use to the company AND are no longer required by a legislative body for the company to retain those records.

Just so long as you have in place formal retention rules that outline how long a record must be kept and when it can be destroyed, a company may permanently dispose of just about any sort of record - soft or hard copy. Both of those conditions are usually proscribed by an auditing, tax or other legal legislation or regulation.

 

[kevin]

Not quite true.

You may destroy just about any records you like if they are of no further use to the company AND are no longer required by a legislative body for the company to retain those records.

Just so long as you have in place formal retention rules that outline how long a record must be kept and when it can be destroyed, a company may permanently dispose of just about any sort of record - soft or hard copy. Both of those conditions are usually proscribed by an auditing, tax or other legal legislation or regulation.

I'd also question this in regards to the fact that the messages being transmitted through the carrier aren't the direct business of the carrier -- i.e. the carriers business is transmission of messages, not the messages themselves.

The sender/reciever of the message may be bound to retain the messages, but that is not the responsiblity of the carrier.

ISP's don't keep a copy of every e-mail that passes through their system, they may track the fact that one did pass through but not the contents.

FedEx doesn't keep a copy of every package it delivers. Nor does the post office. Again records about the delivery may be kept, but not the contents.

 

[EHocking]

I'd also question this in regards to the fact that the messages being transmitted through the carrier aren't the direct business of the carrier -- i.e. the carriers business is transmission of messages, not the messages themselves.

The sender/reciever of the message may be bound to retain the messages, but that is not the responsiblity of the carrier.

ISP's don't keep a copy of every e-mail that passes through their system, they may track the fact that one did pass through but not the contents.

FedEx doesn't keep a copy of every package it delivers. Nor does the post office. Again records about the delivery may be kept, but not the contents.

I may have confused the issue there. The company in question in my post is not an ISP, but my employer and, because it is a publically listed company, and it "provides" it's own email exchange, it is a. liable to search notices by legislative bodies b. legally allowed to retain any traffic originating from (probably including this one), and sent to it's servers.

 

[Geckko]

Here's a piece of trivia. The other day I met the bloke who invented text messaging.

 

[1984]

Intercepted from where? My guess would be from the phone itself (sender or receiver), not during actual transit.

Occam's Razor!
(perhaps?)

This occured to me after reading the Fake News section of Robert Todd Carroll's Becoming a Critical Thinker. I'm now thinking people can be tricked into doing a journalist's job for free.

Ah. The key word there is 'intercepted'. They may just be scanning local transmissions with a special scanner, and trolling the packets for keywords.

Or perhaps "intercepted" is a suitably ambiguous word that the in-house lawyers can defend, should needs be. Back to reading.

 

[Art Vandelay]

Just so long as you have in place formal retention rules that outline how long a record must be kept and when it can be destroyed, a company may permanently dispose of just about any sort of record - soft or hard copy. Both of those conditions are usually proscribed by an auditing, tax or other legal legislation or regulation.

Did you mean "prescribed"?

I may have confused the issue there. The company in question in my post is not an ISP, but my employer and, because it is a publically listed company, and it "provides" it's own email exchange

Its.

Here's a piece of trivia. The other day I met the bloke who invented text messaging.

I find that rather difficult to believe, seeing as how text messaging was invented well over a hundred years ago.