SteveGrenard
Philosopher
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2002
- Messages
- 5,528
Thank you Darat and Clancie for pointing out that it was Camille Wash and MY personal interaction with her that convinced me of the validity of post mortem communication or ADC as some prefer to call it. Although I have Larsen on ignore, thanks (I think) to some others here, I reiterate that my visiting Walsh was personal, it was convincing to me, it was not a lab experiment, there were no statistical results (actually everything the communicator said through her was accurate), I did not replicate or reproduce her session, and the only controls I had I have gone over before and finally I am not publishing my encouner in any form other than limited form to explain my open minded interest in this.
The meager controls I employed included:
1. making the appointment from an extension on a switchboard handling 6, 000 phone extensions. At that time if you had caller ID or hit *69 you would get back a message saying the "Number was not Available by this method".
2. using my first name only.
3. not using a credit card which wasnt accepted anyway
I since learned Camile accepts many people without any payment including 9-11 families locally. The only publicity she ever received for this was in the article which quoted Corey. Randi, myself and Gary Schwartz were were also consulted. The reporter called Schwartz who then referred him to me because I told Gary about Walsh and Gary knew I had seen her. If you want to play dueling appeal to authorities, in addition they interviewed the psychiatrist who is VP of the Behavioral Sciences Unit at my institution. Like Dr. Corey he is a psychiatric professional but has had decades of clinical experience. I believe Professor Corey is a teacher and (correct me if I am wrong) has not been in clinical practice. This story was done six months after I had seen her. It came about because one of the 9-11 families was a friend of the publisher of the local paper and she came to the paper with it. The reporter who did it, whom I have since become friends with, was out to unmask her but he became convinced himself .... I think. He's still not sure. He balanced the story well with quotes from Randi and Corey. But yes, the 9-11 person and myself were the only two interviewed who had first hand experience with Walsh. This is evident of Corey who quotes the standard line of the party re cold, warm and hot reading. There was no cold reading because there were no questions and no feedback. There was no warm reading because I consciously did my best not to cnvey any emotion and dress neutrally. There was no hot reading because I was anonymous and because the information given was so personal it was not available doing prior research even if Walsh knew who I was which she didnt. Thus Corey cannot explain Walsh's methods by these methods.
Now on to Camille. I was asked by her granddaughter who books her appointments to bring photos with me.
I brought three which included one of the deceased and two same age, same gender look-alike persons who were alive.
I arrived at her home a few minutes early and was shown into an office in her house. She sat behind the desk, I sat in front of it. I wore a business suit, tie, no jewelry, watch or anything like that.
She took out a pad and handed it to me with a pencil so I could take notes. I brought one which I used. She took out another pad and sat there scribbling on it like George Anderson does but appearing to get drowsy or sleepy. She raised her head and pointed at one person in the pictures and said "Hey, that's me." It was a correct i.d. of the deceased. Okay, 1 out of 3. Next time I will bring ten, if there is a next time.
She then fell alseep right in front of me. Breathing became slightly noisy as one's breathing does when asleep but of course I had no scientific way of knowing if she was asleep or not although I have years of experience watching people sleep in subway cars.
She then proceeded to talk in the first person, in her own voice, for one hour and fifty minutes. I was not asked any questions. I did not give any feedback, assents or nays or anything. I just kept writing with the pad in my lap so she couldnt see it.
So:
I was anonymous to her.
I was not asked any questions.
I did not give any feedback.
The deceased did not mention his name and mentioned only one human name right away , that of a friend of the deceased whom I did not know well. The communicator said "Tell Frank not to go to California." I didn't know Frank was leaving Brooklyn or going anywhere. Several days later I went to see him and told him this. He said it was true, he was moving to California. He went anyway.
She did not mention any diseases or causes of death.
She did not talk in the second or third person. She did not relate what she saw or thought she heard. She talked only in the first person and everything she said came straight from the mouth of the deceased.
"Oh, ____(correct nick name), thanks also for the pin." The night before I visited Walsh, in the privacy of my own living room with no one to see, I stuck a US Flag Label pin into his picture frame.
He told me where to find a missing pair of sunglasses. They were later found where he said.
I am not going to run through the entire session here, not for Claus or for anyone. Claus can rightfully consider it anecdoal. It was my experience and mine alone, subjective and is my personal justification for thinking that memories, information, ability to acquire info and even personality and emotions survive physical death in some way. It is a very far fetched notion for me so I am looking for physical evidence and proof of this in quantum theory and in electroencephalographic evidence. If I never find it, so be it . I am interested in the many competing theories and theorists who think they have.
It was after having seen Walsh that I started experiencing doubts about JE. If he was real he was afraid of allowing a communicator to use him like Walsh
did or couldn't do this at all and was a fake. The more I see of him the more I think this of him. Or JE is a cold reader and not a very good one.
Walsh did not ask questions, did not get feedback, did not throw out a bunch of J names or fumble with homophones. She didnt bring up relationships either and didnt ask about anything at all as JE does. In fact if I believe anything it was not her talking at all.
Up to then, I was naive to mediums, only knowing JE from the tube so I didnt know that there are any number of low profile mediums that work like Walsh. The rest of them I don't trust.
The meager controls I employed included:
1. making the appointment from an extension on a switchboard handling 6, 000 phone extensions. At that time if you had caller ID or hit *69 you would get back a message saying the "Number was not Available by this method".
2. using my first name only.
3. not using a credit card which wasnt accepted anyway
I since learned Camile accepts many people without any payment including 9-11 families locally. The only publicity she ever received for this was in the article which quoted Corey. Randi, myself and Gary Schwartz were were also consulted. The reporter called Schwartz who then referred him to me because I told Gary about Walsh and Gary knew I had seen her. If you want to play dueling appeal to authorities, in addition they interviewed the psychiatrist who is VP of the Behavioral Sciences Unit at my institution. Like Dr. Corey he is a psychiatric professional but has had decades of clinical experience. I believe Professor Corey is a teacher and (correct me if I am wrong) has not been in clinical practice. This story was done six months after I had seen her. It came about because one of the 9-11 families was a friend of the publisher of the local paper and she came to the paper with it. The reporter who did it, whom I have since become friends with, was out to unmask her but he became convinced himself .... I think. He's still not sure. He balanced the story well with quotes from Randi and Corey. But yes, the 9-11 person and myself were the only two interviewed who had first hand experience with Walsh. This is evident of Corey who quotes the standard line of the party re cold, warm and hot reading. There was no cold reading because there were no questions and no feedback. There was no warm reading because I consciously did my best not to cnvey any emotion and dress neutrally. There was no hot reading because I was anonymous and because the information given was so personal it was not available doing prior research even if Walsh knew who I was which she didnt. Thus Corey cannot explain Walsh's methods by these methods.
Now on to Camille. I was asked by her granddaughter who books her appointments to bring photos with me.
I brought three which included one of the deceased and two same age, same gender look-alike persons who were alive.
I arrived at her home a few minutes early and was shown into an office in her house. She sat behind the desk, I sat in front of it. I wore a business suit, tie, no jewelry, watch or anything like that.
She took out a pad and handed it to me with a pencil so I could take notes. I brought one which I used. She took out another pad and sat there scribbling on it like George Anderson does but appearing to get drowsy or sleepy. She raised her head and pointed at one person in the pictures and said "Hey, that's me." It was a correct i.d. of the deceased. Okay, 1 out of 3. Next time I will bring ten, if there is a next time.
She then fell alseep right in front of me. Breathing became slightly noisy as one's breathing does when asleep but of course I had no scientific way of knowing if she was asleep or not although I have years of experience watching people sleep in subway cars.
She then proceeded to talk in the first person, in her own voice, for one hour and fifty minutes. I was not asked any questions. I did not give any feedback, assents or nays or anything. I just kept writing with the pad in my lap so she couldnt see it.
So:
I was anonymous to her.
I was not asked any questions.
I did not give any feedback.
The deceased did not mention his name and mentioned only one human name right away , that of a friend of the deceased whom I did not know well. The communicator said "Tell Frank not to go to California." I didn't know Frank was leaving Brooklyn or going anywhere. Several days later I went to see him and told him this. He said it was true, he was moving to California. He went anyway.
She did not mention any diseases or causes of death.
She did not talk in the second or third person. She did not relate what she saw or thought she heard. She talked only in the first person and everything she said came straight from the mouth of the deceased.
"Oh, ____(correct nick name), thanks also for the pin." The night before I visited Walsh, in the privacy of my own living room with no one to see, I stuck a US Flag Label pin into his picture frame.
He told me where to find a missing pair of sunglasses. They were later found where he said.
I am not going to run through the entire session here, not for Claus or for anyone. Claus can rightfully consider it anecdoal. It was my experience and mine alone, subjective and is my personal justification for thinking that memories, information, ability to acquire info and even personality and emotions survive physical death in some way. It is a very far fetched notion for me so I am looking for physical evidence and proof of this in quantum theory and in electroencephalographic evidence. If I never find it, so be it . I am interested in the many competing theories and theorists who think they have.
It was after having seen Walsh that I started experiencing doubts about JE. If he was real he was afraid of allowing a communicator to use him like Walsh
did or couldn't do this at all and was a fake. The more I see of him the more I think this of him. Or JE is a cold reader and not a very good one.
Walsh did not ask questions, did not get feedback, did not throw out a bunch of J names or fumble with homophones. She didnt bring up relationships either and didnt ask about anything at all as JE does. In fact if I believe anything it was not her talking at all.
Up to then, I was naive to mediums, only knowing JE from the tube so I didnt know that there are any number of low profile mediums that work like Walsh. The rest of them I don't trust.
But you can buy me a beer at TAM2. Two, one for me, one for El-Unit. 
