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AA77 FDR Data, Explained

Turbofan said:
Wrong on all counts.

You asked me what the t1-t5 timing is for the ARINC 717.
I posted the link to the PDF, and also a link to the timing chart.
That information fully supports and answers your timing question.

The timing diagrams also shows the refresh of the buffer on ever
poll cycle.

That information totally blows your "old 2-6 second info" ASSUMPTION
out the window.

The other links and ARINC 717 PDF documents, aside from L3's e-mails
and voice call to ED Santana also support the <=500 msec timing from
sensor to CPM.

Three of your claims have been proven wrong.

Would you like to discuss data transfer, ARINC 717 and FDR over the phone
in real time so I can hear you babble and fumble your way through a scentence?

Man enough?
Click to expand...

And if the FDR loses power. Or even if the sensors lose power. Even intermittently Then what?

http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2008/E8-3949.htm
A. Statement of the Problem

For many years, the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) has
experienced difficulties while investigating aircraft accidents and
incidents. The information recorded on cockpit voice recorders (CVRs)
and Digital Flight Data Recorders (DFDRs) has not always been
sufficient to support the NTSB's investigations. The problems
encountered by the NTSB include the limited duration of CVR recordings
preceding an incident, and the loss of power to both CVRs and DFDRs.
These issues arose in the investigation of the following accidents and
incidents: Alaska Airlines, Inc. flight 261 on January 31, 2000;
EgyptAir flight 990 on October 31, 1999; Delta Air Lines, Inc. flight
2461 on December 15, 1998; Swissair flight 111 on September 2, 1998;
SilkAir flight 185 on December 19, 1997; ValuJet Airlines flight 592 on
May 11, 1996; Trans World Airlines, Inc. flight 800 on July 17, 1996;
and ValuJet Airlines flight 597 on June 8, 1995. The notice of proposed
rulemaking that preceded this final rule was published on February 28,
2005 (``Revisions to Cockpit Voice Recorder and Digital Flight Data
Recorder Regulations,'' 70 FR 9752) and discusses these accidents and
incidents in more detail, starting on page 9753.
Click to expand...
 
Turbofan said:
After you respond to #1104 which comes well before #1198
Click to expand...
1104 was already dealt with by somebody else. So your turn.
(P.S. If you do some quick research you can answer 1198 for yourself
which a good researcher would initially do.)
Click to expand...
Nice cop out. Please respond to the post and please post your link to the ARINC 717 document. All I have is the ARINC 429 document.
 
A W Smith said:
And if the FDR loses power. Or even if the sensors lose power. Even intermittently Then what?

http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2008/E8-3949.htm
Click to expand...


AW Smith, your intellectual dishonest reputation precedes you. What is different in every accident above than AA77? Can you guess? Do you know? Beachnut tried the same strategy. Or will it be another libel false unsourced claim of "Rob Balsamo was grounded by the FAA due to mental instability".

AW Smith, your credibility is shot for anyone who knows how to do a tiny bit of research. Especially true for aviation professionals (who actually put their name on their claims). Try again.

ETA: You're better off sticking with Beachnuts claims of "The FDR loses power at less than 0.2 G's" LMAO!
 
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hxstamper said:
AW Smith, your intellectual dishonest reputation precedes you. What is different in every accident above than AA77? Can you guess? Do you know? Beachnut tried the same strategy. Or will it be another libel false unsourced claim of "Rob Balsamo was grounded by the FAA due to mental instability".

AW Smith, your credibility is shot for anyone who knows how to do a tiny bit of research. Especially true for aviation professionals (who actually put their name on their claims). Try again.

ETA: You're better off sticking with Beachnuts claims of "The FDR loses power at less than 0.2 G's" LMAO!
Click to expand...


You didn't answer the question

loss of power.Then what?

Instead you inserted a poisoning the well logical fallacy

you dodged.

[edt] And as far as my strategy. What strategy? Did i make an assertion? I asked a question you failed to answer. I can say the difference between the flights within the quote marks was that none of them were hijacked and flown into buildings. But the characteristics are irrelevant to my power question.
 
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Turbofan said:
He says, "virtually no wreckage"

5:38 of this interview:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2052484937239620900

That is not a lie, that's an observation and supported by these photos.
http://www.defenselink.mil/dodcmsshare/newsstoryPhoto/2001-09/hrs_200109114a_hr.jpg
no757.0catch.com/_webimages/07mxq-00-_2.JPG
guardian.150m.com/pentagon/pent04.jpg
http://www.odeion.org/cruisemissile/fireball.jpg
http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/killtown/penta_lawn_files/fireball_shot.jpg
http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/killtown/penta_lawn_files/grass_shot.jpg
http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/killtown/penta_lawn_files/lawn.jpg
http://911research.wtc7.net/mirrors/killtown/penta_lawn_files/spray.jpg
http://www.asile.org/citoyens/numero13/pentagone/images/pelouse.jpg

Can anyone here spot the boeing on the lawn? :rolleyes:

So much for calling Dennis a liar. Anything else you want to point out
that I can proove wrong?
Click to expand...

It is a lie, there is lots of wreckage on the lawn. You have been conned by a liar.

If you look at this page and continue to claim the same the you are also a liar

http://www.911myths.com/html/757_wreckage.html


OK?
 
jaydeehess said:
...not qualified to understand, or are capable of understanding, the technical aspects involved.

.
Click to expand...

Your timing couldnt be better jaydahees. See post 1317.

Here is one thing "Reheat", "Anti-Sophist" and "Beachnut" have over you. They understand the NTSB data as is. They just make excuses for it (missing seconds, altimeter lag, rotated map).

Since you do not understand the data, you want someone to write up a "technical paper" essentially educating you on the equivalent of 2+2=4 for anyone with a private pilot certificate or better.

Jaydaheess... as suggested on P4T when you were there...go here and learn... its all free...

http://www.faa.gov/education_research/

This time, try not to get so pissy. (although i dont think you will get banned here for attacking the person instead of the argument as you did at P4T when they refused to hold your hand).

Have a nice day.. :D
 
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FDRs are not perfect

http://bcad.gov.bb/page/Pdf/Airworthiness Advisory Circulars-Pdf/AAC-024 Flight Data Recorders.Pdf

B. A review of data extracted from FDRs has shown a significant loss of data during takeoffs, touchdowns, flights through turbulence, and unusual vibration situations. Due to these data losses, Inspectors will ensure that an Operator’s monitoring procedures and inspection schedules will maintain the required FDR performance levels.
Click to expand...

http://www.ntsb.gov/Pressrel/2001/011120.htm

Accident Sequence

Investigators have continued to extract data from the flight recorders - the flight data recorder (FDR) and the cockpit voice recorder (CVR) - since their recovery last week, as well as radar data. The Safety Board has calculated that the time between flight 587’s liftoff from Runway 31L until the end of the recorded FDR data is 93 seconds. The CVR continued to record information for about 10 more seconds (this is a correction of the time announced last week); it is believed the CVR ends at or about the time of the plane’s impact with the ground. Therefore, the Board estimates that the time from lift off to impact was 103 seconds.
Click to expand...
 
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While TF finds a way to handwave away the wreckage and the fact Dennis Cimino is a liar

What about this repeat post they ignored.

FdF said:
One of CIT quadruple independantly corroborated witness put Flight 77 no more than 3 feet above the Navy Annex. How does that jive with the "too high" claims?
Click to expand...

Well?
 
Drs_Res said:
http://bcad.gov.bb/page/Pdf/Airworthiness Advisory Circulars-Pdf/AAC-024 Flight Data Recorders.Pdf



http://www.ntsb.gov/Pressrel/2001/011120.htm
Click to expand...


Oh, good, so where did the NTSB explain this for the data they produced for AA77? In particular, where does the NTSB state AA77 experienced, "significant loss of data during takeoffs, touchdowns, flights through turbulence, and unusual vibration situations? Since obviously they are aware of issues (although the "experts" here at JREF would make you believe the NTSB are incompetent).

Please provide the text, cover letter, side letter, email, crayon written disclosure of the NTSB stating that they made a mistake in thier calcualted time stamps and "impact".

Or do you prefer the NTSB to distribute what you people claim is" error filled data" to the the American public through the FOIA while also notating the NTSB want "everything as accurate as possible" when they are aware such issues above exist yet didnt correct and/or make a notation for such in the most catalyzing event in American history. Are the NTSB incompetent or not?
 
WildCat said:
When will the PfffT show they understand the data by having their interpretations corroborated by actual FDR experts?
Click to expand...

<pfft mode>

Insert claim that pfffft has FDR experts, but they all wish to remain anonymous because X.

Where X=they will be harassed or ridiculed for exposing the person or persons behind the murder of thousands of innocent people.*

*Buy the DVD for details

</pfft mode>

Makes perfect sense!
 
hxstamper said:
Oh, good, so where did the NTSB explain this for the data they produced for AA77? In particular, where does the NTSB state AA77 experienced, "significant loss of data during takeoffs, touchdowns, flights through turbulence, and unusual vibration situations? Since obviously they are aware of issues (although the "experts" here at JREF would make you believe the NTSB are incompetent).

Please provide the text, cover letter, side letter, email, crayon written disclosure of the NTSB stating that they made a mistake in thier calcualted time stamps and "impact".

Or do you prefer the NTSB to distribute what you people claim is" error filled data" to the the American public through the FOIA while also notating the NTSB want "everything as accurate as possible" when they are aware such issues above exist yet didnt correct and/or make a notation for such in the most catalyzing event in American history. Are the NTSB incompetent or not?
Click to expand...

There is a possibility some of them are. Are they criminals though?
 
hxstamper said:
Or do you prefer the NTSB to distribute what you people claim is" error filled data" to the the American public through the FOIA while also notating the NTSB want "everything as accurate as possible" when they are aware such issues above exist yet didnt correct and/or make a notation for such in the most catalyzing event in American history. Are the NTSB incompetent or not?
Click to expand...

This doesn't make any less sense then your implication that the government planted a FDR recorder in a faked crash site that supposedly proves a plane didn't crash into the Pentagon.
 
funk de fino said:
It is a lie, there is lots of wreckage on the lawn. You have been conned by a liar.

If you look at this page and continue to claim the same the you are also a liar

http://www.911myths.com/html/757_wreckage.html


OK?
Click to expand...


So are you saying my photos are faked? Where is the debris in any of my photos?

That "C" looks a little small in comparison to the "C" on this image of an American
Airlines jet

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y167/Rob_canada/SNV30203.jpg

How big would you say the wheel of an airplane is compared to the wheel of
that van?
http://www.911myths.com/assets/images/db_images/db_Pentagon_Debris_110.jpg
http://www.911myths.com/assets/images/db_images/db_Pentagon_Debris_171.jpg
Van tire size about 30 inches? GMC Savanah perhaps?

757-200 size about 45 inches? At least up to the waist line of the man in
this photo?
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/4/3/8/0631834.jpg
http://www.airweb.faa.gov/Regulator...9E8625746A0047CBE5?OpenDocument&Highlight=757

I'd sure like to do a scale analysis of that "C"...

But anyway, where is all the debris in my photos? Mine were taken while
the fire was still burning up...and when the firetrucks arrived.

Yours were taken when?
 
twinstead said:
This doesn't make any less sense then your implication that the government planted a FDR recorder in a faked crash site that supposedly proves a plane didn't crash into the Pentagon.
Click to expand...

Hey, we're not the ones distributing data through the Freedom Of Information Act showing the aircraft at 173 Pressure altitude (273 RADALT) at 1 second prior to calculated "impact".


Again, many aviation professionals join our organization, not because they didnt believe the govt story, but because they were concerned with flight safety, that FDR's should be alot more accurate. After all, we train from FDR's every 6 months.

Now that they gone deeper... and the FBI/NTSB refuses to comment, they arent so sure about the govt story anymore. Our lists continue to grow. Your lists are at 3 anonymous "experts" and dwindling (Anti-Sophist is pretty much run out of town by Turbofan, "Reheat" tries to pose himself as a college female on P4T forums because he is so intimidated to debate, and Beachnut, well... you people read his posts... coherent? You decide... 0.2 G's.. LMAO!).

But whatever excuse you wish to make. Readers can decide for themselves.


By the way, i have some time today.. flight cancelled due to wx... so i'll stick around for awhile and check it.. this is fun. :D
 
Meanwhile, the people from Pffft! come here and hang out, because they want to be cool like we are!
Sorry, but the "shades" don't work on you. You've got them on upside-down again...
 
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