AA77 FDR Data, Explained

[Turbofan]

Lag is part of the world. No matter how fast the system cycles there will always be some data lost if you interrupt the cycle.

The problem is YOU don't understand what I just wrote!

Once again, show me how a system which writes to crash protected memory
at a rate of 64 words per second, can have a "lag" of 500 milliseconds per
cycle.

Show me your understanding of electronics, data transfer and networking.

The only 'lag' you can have in this sense of the discussion is propagation
delay which DOES NOT factor into the time referenced parameter data.

You kids should learn about certain technologies before engaging in a
technical discussion.

 

[tsig]

That is bs!

You have no idea what you're talking about!

How the hell can you have a HALF SECOND DELAY in a system that writes
to crash protected memory at a rate of 64 WORDS PER SECOND?!

EXPLAIN it smart guy.

It's impossible! T4-T5 are after the fact. They are not required in this
stupid theory of Anti's

I have 64 words to write. It will take a second for the last one to be written and we start again.

 

[Turbofan]

I have 64 words to write. It will take a second for the last one to be written and we start again.

Ok, so you've accounted for 64 words to be written per second.

Where is the lag in your one second time period?

 

[SDC]

I have a background in electronics and networking. I have access to a
technical document which outlines the flight data system we are discussing
here.

I have picked apart each theory from Anti, R. Mackey and Beachnut and explained why
it can't work like that.

I've asked you a simple question about buffer capacity, but you admit you
can't answer it...yet you believe the nonsensical writing of the aforementioned
members.

Let's put it this way SDC:

The flight data system moves data bits in a sequence like you would put
books on a cart.

You fill your cart with books each round through the library and then place
them nicely in storage.

The next round, Anti comes along and falls in front of your cart and spills
some books which add to your load.

You are now late getting back to the storage room, and you have extra
books to carry.

Somehow ( I don't know where), you place these books and go back to
the storage room.

YOu have some extra books to unload, but since you're limited to a clock,
you can't place the extra books in the storage room; you must leave
immediately and do your rounds.

With some residual books on your cart, you make another pass around the
library.

Now, Beachnut comes along and trips! His books add to Anti's residual
and now you're really out of space on your cart.

How do you move all of these bits of information with this built-in integral
lag that Anti is promoting?

Do you see how the system will crash in just seconds?

It doesn't work like these guys are thinking. There is no lag. The system
is designed to handle the data load, and has a clock cycle fast enough to
move data and get new data each cycle.

It is poor practice to try and argue from alleged analogies between data processing systems, and someone pushing a book truck. Or else I have too literal a mind and the analogy is not at all clear to me. Either way, your account doesn't work for me.

Please don't try again.

 

[Turbofan]

It is poor practice to try and argue from alleged analogies between data processing systems, and someone pushing a book truck. Or else I have too literal a mind and the analogy is not at all clear to me. Either way, your account doesn't work for me.

Please don't try again.

You know what? It's also a greater fault to base theories on systems in which
documentation, or reference is not available (in the case of Anti, Beachnut and
R. Mackey).

Sorry the analogy doesn't work for you. It's a pretty good analogy in the
sense that a data system incorporates X number of buffers for X number of
data bits.

You can't magically insert lag, and extra data bits into 'thin air'...

 

[Reheat]

Let's put it this way SDC:

Words, words, and more words.

You completely miss SDC's point as well as the point of many others here to spew your nonsense. You use the wrong analogy, here's a better one....

You have a persistent headache that won't go away. You go to a Medical Book and read everything about the the composition, function, and operation of the brain, but you still have a headache.

You then decide to see a Doctor to determine the cause of your headache. He does a CAT Scan, analyzes it and tells you that you have an inoperable brain tumor and are going to die in less than six months.

You then spend the rest of the time of your visit with the Doctor pointing to the pretty pictures in the Medical Book that shows everything one needs to know about the brain and arguing that he can't be correct because the Medical Books explains everything there is to know about the composition, function, and operation of the brain.

In 5 months you die, arguing to your grave that the Doctor is wrong because the Medical Books only cover the composition, function, and operation of the Brain, not the REAL WORLD problems that the Doctor correctly understands.

 

[beachnut]

...
I have picked apart each theory from Anti, R. Mackey and Beachnut and explained why
it can't work like that.
...
There is no lag. The system
is designed to handle the data load, and has a clock cycle fast enough to
move data and get new data each cycle.

The most fact filled post you have made to date. Bravo. Keep up the great work.

You have what? The only thing you have done is expose you arrogance to regurgitate other people's failed ideas. You can't figure out one thing about 9/11 that makes sense to support conclusions you p4t guys are not allowed to make. This is why people are telling you, you have failed. But you persist you have won and I can’t remember your point in the first place, or what conclusion it is suppose to support.

The lag, does this boil down to a FDR can't be missing data? Take your salesman expert ideas and go place them in the trash, you have been fooled by people who are only selling false ideas. FDR have lost data, or are missing data, or the data has stopped. Flight 77 looks like the data stopped when 77 was over 4600 feet away from the Pentagon.

You should concentrate on explaining what you think happened on 9/11 with Flight 77. I know 77 hit the Pentagon, what is your complete story? Or is that against your cult rules?

 

[jsiv]

So to sum up 44 pages.. The plane dropped a cruise missile, flew over the Pentagon, and then proceeded out over the Atlantic where the crew ditched it and parachuted onto a yacht with the FDR in a backpack which was then returned to land and the data released to the public? Is that about it?

 

[Jonnyclueless]

That is bs!

You have no idea what you're talking about!

How the hell can you have a HALF SECOND DELAY in a system that writes
to crash protected memory at a rate of 64 WORDS PER SECOND?!

EXPLAIN it smart guy.

It's impossible! T4-T5 are after the fact. They are not required in this
stupid theory of Anti's

Perhaps then you can explain why it has happened several times before? Are you going to say that every plane crash where the data does not go right up to the point of impact is a conspiracy theory?

Are you going to go on and explain that some criminals set up this absurdly complex and detailed caper and yet were too lazy to simply put in code un to the time of impact? Or are you going to claim that the plane crashed in mid air above the pentagon? Please explain.

 

[beachnut]

What was Turbofan's ideas and conclusions on 9/11?
I can't find an official document from the NTSB with an impact time. How does p4t come up with an impact time?

Lag? p4t turbofan, aka jdx regurgitation expert, says impact was at :45, the data p4t gathered stops at :43, two seconds missing, the last data from the NTSB is :44, so there is a whole second missing. If you use the Commission report, they say impact was at :46, this means 3 seconds and 2 seconds of missing data. Can Turbofan explain this? I thought no data was missing, were is the data for :45 and/or :46 seconds? Gee, where is the data for :44 from p4t?

 

[Jonnyclueless]

The problem is YOU don't understand what I just wrote!

Once again, show me how a system which writes to crash protected memory
at a rate of 64 words per second, can have a "lag" of 500 milliseconds per
cycle.

Hey Kid, flight 77 is the answer to your question right there. That's the perfect example you are looking for that shows it can happen.

 

[tsig]

Ok, so you've accounted for 64 words to be written per second.

Where is the lag in your one second time period?

From the time the first word is written til the last is a one second lag.

 

[Jonnyclueless]

BTW, another example is swiss air flight 111. It lost 6 minutes of data prior to impact.

And one thing that should be considered is damage to the craft prior to the final impact which could have disrupted power or wiring to the FDR.

 

[Jonnyclueless]

Also, American Airlines flight 587 lost the last 2.5 seconds ot FDR data.

 

[SDC]

Also, American Airlines flight 587 lost the last 2.5 seconds ot FDR data.

And if I were a completely crass jerk I would say "the passengers were flown to Cleveland and executed by government agents. It was a conspiracy..." (created for some reason unidentifiable by normal humans. Was there a CIA agent on the flight who was following a lead that Cheney had told a female friend in the Dominican, right before his orgasm, that the WTC was going to be blown up?)

If I recall correctly, that was the Dominican Rep flight which went down a couple of months after 9/11, on its way from NYC; people thought it might be another hijacking.

Don't tell me there is still a notion that it was a hijacking. Please.

 

[Turbofan]

From the time the first word is written til the last is a one second lag.

Sorry, that's not referred to as 'lag', that is the write time.

The next scan starts over at the top of the second, cylce after cylce...after cycle.

You see in the real world, eletric circuits are not pretty pictures and brain
tumors which are affected by human genetics.

An electric circuit doesn't grow extra bits, and Bin Laden doesn't board
the plane and start inserting extra nodes, and adding 'lag'.

This is an electrical specification, and the system is designed for
X nodes to handle X bits.

Pretty bad analogy Reheat...I would have expected more from an "expert" .

You guys need to go live with me so I can hear you stumble over your
words and flip pages through your noteboook to keep up.

Waiting for Anti to try and get past all of this technical grave he dug himself,
because Reheat and Beachnut are not cutting it.

 

[tsig]

Sorry, that's not referred to as 'lag', that is the write time.

The next scan starts over at the top of the second, cylce after cylce...after cycle.

You see in the real world, eletric circuits are not pretty pictures and brain
tumors which are affected by human genetics.

An electric circuit doesn't grow extra bits, and Bin Laden doesn't board
the plane and start inserting extra nodes, and adding 'lag'.

This is an electrical specification, and the system is designed for
X nodes to handle X bits.

Pretty bad analogy Reheat...I would have expected more from an "expert" .

You guys need to go live with me so I can hear you stumble over your
words and flip pages through your noteboook to keep up.

Waiting for Anti to try and get past all of this technical grave he dug himself,
because Reheat and Beachnut are not cutting it.

So the write time does not add to the lag time?

It seems to me that any interval between the entering of the data and the recording of the data is lag time,

 

[Jonnyclueless]

You see in the real world things don't always live up to expectation hence the common phenomenon of FDRs not recording data up to the point of impact. Again, another big assumption being made is that everything outside of the FDR was working perfectly and that there was no power failure.

 

[beachnut]

You see in the real world things don't always live up to expectation hence the common phenomenon of FDRs not recording data up to the point of impact. Again, another big assumption being made is that everything outside of the FDR was working perfectly and that there was no power failure.

Expect p4t members to not understand much, they lack math and physics skills and leave know errors posted for over 5 months as they try to gain skills to understand their 11.2 Gs is dumb.

I wonder what lag has to do with missing data. Other aircraft have had FDRs stop recording data. Why can't 77?

He can't answer any of my DME questions! He must be too challenged to figure out why only 4 out of 10 numbers are used per unit NM to store DME. He can't explain why p4t DME lists 1.5 DME and 3.2 DME at the same time.

But he does complain about having a salesman as an expert for DME. Guess he has to check with jdx to see what to say next! Oops, he is asking him now....

 

[Jonnyclueless]

But he says he's an expert.